raising daughters Archives

Presence Over Perfection: Creating Meaningful Dad-Daughter Connections

October 5, 2026 by dadofdivas

Building a strong, meaningful relationship with your daughter takes intention, patience, and a genuine commitment to growth—for both parent and child. That’s the heartbeat of “The Dad and Daughter Connection,” a podcast devoted to helping dads nurture confidence and independence in their daughters. In the latest episode, host Dr. Christopher Lewis sits down with returning guest Arpan Shah to discuss what it really takes to create lasting, positive connections, even in challenging circumstances.

One of the episode’s central themes is being truly present. Arpan Shah opens up about his journey as a dad navigating dual custody, and how—even when parenting comes with logistical and emotional hurdles—intentionally showing up matters more than perfection. He shares the powerful impact of simple, everyday rituals: from regular FaceTime check-ins and nighttime meditation to asking thoughtful questions like, “How did you help someone today?” or “What new thing did you learn?”

Another key takeaway is the importance of leading by example. Children learn more from their parents’ behaviors than their words. Arpan Shah explains how volunteering at school, coaching basketball, and making time for shared hobbies like hiking and music aren’t just fun—they show his daughter that she is valued and supported, while modeling lifelong curiosity and resilience.

Honesty and forgiveness are woven throughout the conversation. Both Dr. Christopher Lewis and Arpan Shah talk about the inevitable mistakes that come with parenting. The real magic, they suggest, happens when we use those moments to communicate openly, learn together, and even let our daughters teach us a thing or two about empathy.

The episode is full of practical advice for fathers who want to build a deep, trusting relationship with their daughters, such as:

Prioritizing quality time over material things or work distractions
Supporting your child’s interests—from robotics and coding to sports and music
Establishing meaningful routines and traditions
Creating space for honest, two-way conversations—even when they’re tough
Focusing on presence instead of perfection

If you’re looking for real stories and actionable insights to help you on your fatherhood journey, this podcast is for you. Tune in for inspiration, support, and a reminder that your heart already knows the way—sometimes, you just need to be still, listen, and be present.

Subscribe today and start strengthening your bond. Listen to the latest episode of “The Dad and Daughter Connection” now!

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TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to The Dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and The Dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started. Because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the Dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to Work together on these relationships that we want to build with our daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:02]:
And I just want to say thank you. Thank you for coming back every week, for you putting yourself out there, for wanting to continue to keep learning, to keep growing, and to keep being present for your daughters. Because that’s what it’s all about. Each one of us has to put in the work, put in the time to be able to do what we can to be able to help our daughters grow into the women that they’re becoming. But also, we need to put in the time for ourselves to be able to be the fathers that we want to be. And that’s why this show exists. This show exists because I want to provide you with resources that are going to help you, give you some tools for your toolbox that’ll help you to be that dad that you want to be. As you know, I’ve got 2 daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:44]:
I know you’ve got daughters. And I love being able to allow for you every week to learn something new from new people that can provide you with some of the experiences that they’ve had. in their life. Because every one of us as fathers is going to father in a different way. But we can learn from each other and take little pieces here and there to be able to help us be even better dads in the future. That’s why every week I bring you a different guest, a different person with different experiences. And this week we’ve got another great guest. Arpan Shah is with us today.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:15]:
And Arpan is a, actually a past guest of another podcast that I used to do called Dads with Daughters. And I was really excited to be able to ask him to come back to join us and to, and to have us have him back on to talk with us about his own journey as a father. And I’m really excited to introduce him to you. Arpan, thanks so much for being here today.

Arpan Shah [00:02:38]:
Thanks for having me, Chris.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:39]:
I’m really excited to be able to have you here today and for you to share some of the experiences that you’ve had. I always start these interviews with an opportunity to learn a little bit more about you as a dad and talk about you and the relationship with your daughter. I guess first and foremost, as you think about the relationship that you have with your daughter, I know she’s 9. So as you think back to that relationship that you have with her, what is one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share together with your daughter? And what made it so special?

Arpan Shah [00:03:07]:
I think the special moments is now that she’s 9. My last podcast was when she was about 4 or 5. And I was in the midst of a really bad custody battle. And so I was going through all kinds of emotions that many fathers go through in the treacherous waters of family court. And so what has changed And what’s meaningful now is those little random hugs and bursts of, I love you, for no absolute reason, where you can see the unconditional love just pouring out of each other’s eyes and souls when you embrace your child. And knowing that you’re doing a good job, knowing that she’s smart, she’s got a good heart, and that she is a kind person, and she helps me out as well. And those are some of the most meaningful little milestones. Just if we can have that connection as the child grows and blooms, to nurture that and to have a hand in that is extremely humbling.

Arpan Shah [00:03:57]:
And something to be very grateful for.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:58]:
As you think about what you just said, each one of us is trying to do things to intentionally build those moments and be able to have those opportunities to be able to connect with our daughters. What are some intentional ways that you’ve worked to strengthen your bond with your daughter, especially during challenging times?

Arpan Shah [00:04:16]:
Well, recently, as she’s gotten older, this is much different, as I have not pondered these questions you’ve asked for some time now, is There is a struggle when she goes from home to home. Our parenting schedule is such where she is 7 days with me with a break in the middle where there’s a date night with the other parent and with her mother. And then on 7 days with her mom, I have a date night in the middle of the week as well. So during those times, there are FaceTime calls every day. And then we do a check-in. We meditate or pray every night before going to sleep. And the way I started that was a count to 10, just a breathing to 10 where you clear your mind for those 10 seconds. And I kind of assist her in doing so.

Arpan Shah [00:04:59]:
So, and we’ll take deep breaths, we’ll hold them, we’ll let them out, and we’ll try to clear ourselves of all our thoughts and whatever might be on our minds. We just clear it. And it’s just me and her, her voice and mine. And then we find peace. And then we touch base every day where that grows. I can get into that a little further, but I think that’s something that everybody should do is just unwind with your child and debrief. How was your day today? What were some of your best moments of the day? How have you helped somebody today? What did you learn today? Those kind of questions are very important to ask. And then getting a habit of that, it keeps it in your mind throughout the day.

Arpan Shah [00:05:35]:
It helps you have a more positive impact as a parent. And then the child ponders those questions a lot more than you might think. Children learn more from behaviors than what you tell them to do. So it’s important for you to exhibit that as well.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:46]:
And following up with that, you talked a little bit about the fact that getting her back onto a routine and moving from routine to routine, and some fathers like yourself have a similar type of a family dynamic that has to happen based on time with mom, time with dad, you know, whatever the situation is. And you said that you’ve tried some different things that have worked, maybe some things that didn’t work. For other fathers that are in dual custody type of situations like that, what’s some advice that you would give them to be able to help the child to be able to maneuver from environment to environment?

Arpan Shah [00:06:21]:
There’s a couple of things that we can do to help the transitions. The most important being Don’t badmouth the other parent when the child is around. That’s very important. You want to love the child more than you might have some grievances with the other parent because that child is half you and half the other. And so it’s important to know that if the child hears that, it’s heartbreaking because the child is part of both and it’s confusing as well. So it’s important not to do that. On the contrary, if you are fortunate enough to have a good relationship, it’s important to maybe just watch the child interact— you both interact politely. respectfully with each other.

Arpan Shah [00:06:57]:
And then maybe do an exchange at a playground where you’re both present for a little while, things like that. In the beginning, attorneys can really make things complicated. So I would have imaginary phone calls with the other parent to show that, hey, you know, we’re laughing, we’re good. And it felt— made her feel really good growing up. I think it’s important for dads to be present, not be on your phone. And you know what, work may come in the future, spend time with your child. When you’re older, you’re not going to look back and wish that you had worked the extra hour to get that overtime pay or whatever it is. If you’re in that situation.

Arpan Shah [00:07:28]:
I know it’s easier for some than others. But I have turned down opportunities, and even relationships and commitments to spend time. And I’ve never regretted that. As far as spending time goes, it’s like, what do I do? I mean, if you look in the marketplace, or the— or even TV shows, it’s changing slowly. But usually, historically, it’s frustrating to me that the dad is more of a sort of like a bumbling idiot, if you will, in these TV shows like Al Bundy and Homer Simpson, and etc., etc. So it’s important for you to find those positive figures or exhibit that yourself. Doing things, learning something together, taking a cooking class with the child, putting together one of those crafts like a mechanical toy or Lego set, building it together. Those things you’re creating together with your creation.

Arpan Shah [00:08:14]:
And that’s one of the reasons I wrote Daddy Goes to Work, my book, because it’s a book that I was looking for when she was young. Because she’ll grab your leg and be like, Dad, where are you going? Dada, no! And then she’ll whine. And you have a schedule, you have to be at work, and the kid has no idea where you’ve abandoned her for 8, 9, 10 hours. So in a good connection with one’s father, especially girls, it’s important for their sense of joy and self-confidence later in life. And more and more research and science is showing this and proving that to be true. A father’s love is no less, especially with a girl, although it’s also prevalent with males too. So anyways, Daddy Goes to Work is what I wrote, and I’m glad I did. Every child that reads it has a better connection and makes the world a better place, in my opinion, one kid at a time.

Arpan Shah [00:09:00]:
It’s a story of a father that goes to work and explains to a young child— it’s more for kids under 7— what happens in the day and how much the father loves her, and that he’ll always come back. And that message is very important, and it’s nonexistent until now.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:13]:
You know, and we talk a lot more about that book in the first interview that I mentioned. I’ll put a link in the notes today so you can learn more about the book and kind of the impetus behind that to be able to learn a little bit more. One of the questions that I have, and it goes back to kind of what you were talking about in regard to The work that we all do, many of us are working full-time. We’re trying our best to provide for our families. We’re wearing a lot of hats as we are being fathers, and we have to try to balance all of those different things. Talk to me about how you balance guiding your daughter while also giving her the ability and the independence to grow into the person that she’s becoming.

Arpan Shah [00:09:49]:
So I incorporate her with my day. I will take vacation days like many, but instead of sitting around or going on a guys trip, I’ll volunteer at her school. I’m involved. I’m her basketball coach for the 3rd graders last year. As a children’s book author, I’ll do author readings in the school. I’ll help any way I can. So I make myself known. And I’ve always noticed when I was a kid and other parents would volunteer, I always thought it was so cool.

Arpan Shah [00:10:12]:
I thought it was so special. And I could see it in her eyes and heart, how joy she gets seeing me in her classroom. She’s like, whoa, what are you doing here? And then now people have gotten to know me as Mr. Shah. Like, she thinks I work there. So that’s really special. So I’m very involved. And I encourage every father to do that.

Arpan Shah [00:10:29]:
Show up at their appointments, dentist, doctor. It’s important for you to be there. These norms are changing. And especially in the future with AI and stuff, I think fathers are more involved now than ever in the last century, at least, and volunteering, doing activities together, and just being present. Or, and if you can’t, debriefing with her, asking her specific questions on her day. Because young children can be very vague. It’s like, yeah, it was good. It was fine.

Arpan Shah [00:10:53]:
What’d you do? Nothing. You know, like, well, did you play with any friends? And back to those questions that I mentioned earlier, have— how did you help somebody today? What’s something new that you learned today? What is something that you need to work on? How can I help you? What was your favorite part of your day with me if you had spent the day? So those are all very— make things more meaningful. And then when you go putting action to your thoughts, you’ll be surprised how your soul will carry you forward in this relationship.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:19]:
Now, none of us are infallible. We’re human. We make mistakes. And I guess as you think about yourself as a father in working with your daughter, what’s a mistake that you’ve made as a father And what did you learn from it about fostering better communication with your own daughter?

Arpan Shah [00:11:35]:
Well, I learned something new every day. I just never stopped looking for ways to improve. This is a very common thing. The way my custody battle started, it was my child was removed from the state and we kind of saw it coming and she was held without contact for an extended period. So I think that’s why I’m so intense and present in her life right now, because I was so connected to her. I’m the oldest out of like 9 cousins and we were raised very close together. Like I was in Chicago. They’re in Indiana, and we would visit every weekend.

Arpan Shah [00:12:03]:
So they were like siblings, but I was the oldest. And my best friend in the family has always been the youngest one. Like I said, I’m a big kid. I love goofing around. And I missed that. But I won that pretty quickly. But it was very difficult, very traumatic. And that kind of helped me be extremely present.

Arpan Shah [00:12:18]:
I did some positive parenting classes that were free I found online, just voluntarily. I talked to other dads. I went to some parent mentoring stuff. And I’m just always trying to be a better dad or make other fathers better. I currently help freelance as a divorce coach and a parenting guide for fathers and some mothers too. I’ve helped a lot of people out, so I learned from their experiences. I learned from mine. I’m trying to think.

Arpan Shah [00:12:40]:
We’re human, like you said, so you can get angry sometimes, or you want to make sure that you’re always communicating so that you can grow together. In relationships, you learn when you fall and from when you rise. So you want to make sure you’re there to carry her up, and then you want to empower your child to lift you up when she notices things and to have honest conversations with— because you are not a god.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:00]:
One other question, which is really going to some of the things that you do, because you’re already talking about things that you’re doing to be able to show up for your daughter. What do you do intentionally to make your daughter feel valued and heard?

Arpan Shah [00:13:12]:
I’m always present. I think presence is what’s important for fathers more than ever. I’m there before she’s awake. I’m there to put her down. When I’m picking her up at school, I’m, I’m on time. I’m there taking her to activities and not just leaving, checking out at the playground. I’m not just leaving her at the playground sitting on the bench on my phone. I’m interacting.

Arpan Shah [00:13:29]:
You know, while I still can, while I have a good back. And it’s the engaging, it’s the wanting to be there, it’s the presence. And I think as long as you’re present, the love that you have for your child will tell you where to go next.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:40]:
And before we started the show today, one of the things that you told me was the story of the conversation that you had with your daughter about teasing. I want you to tell that story because I think that really connects with this question as well.

Arpan Shah [00:13:53]:
I can be immature sometimes, and then we tease each other, but I got to realize that one time she was joking around with me, and then I can’t remember I don’t remember exactly the situation. It was some time ago, but I do remember what she said afterwards. She sat me down like she was my mom and she’s like, hey, if you treat somebody and do blah, blah, blah to them, how would that make you feel? And then I was like, ah, man, I wouldn’t feel very good at all. And she’s like, well, that’s how I feel. And I was just like, oh my God. I apologized. It was just so sweet to see her put me in my place and the maturity. I was just so proud of her.

Arpan Shah [00:14:27]:
Even when she was 3, she had those kind of tendencies. One time we had people over, me and my wife, and And then it was about 9 PM. So what she did— and we had music playing, we had some food on the dining table, and people were kind of scattered throughout the condo. And then she walks up out of her room, turns the music off, slams her door before she says, I’m going to sleep, everybody be quiet. And then the mic just dropped and everybody was like, oh my God, that was so beautiful. It was so awesome. And then, I mean, eventually, you know, people got quiet and they were trailing out anyways. There were other children there.

Arpan Shah [00:15:00]:
So I just thought that was really cool. She’s like 9 going on 90.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:04]:
So, you know, every one of us as fathers also try to support our daughter’s dreams and passions. How are you supporting your daughter’s dreams and passions?

Arpan Shah [00:15:14]:
I’ve exposed her in her earlier years to so many different activities. We’ve tried all kinds of sports. She did love basketball. I didn’t think she would because probably that I was one of the coaches there. So I’m really proud of that. And we play every chance we get. And when we find a park, I keep a ball in my car. Something else is she’s really taken a liking to building and programming and coding.

Arpan Shah [00:15:36]:
Like engineering, whether it be Legos or Roblox, Minecraft. I’m not a big fan of Roblox, but there’s also editing videos and sounds. I play several instruments myself, so that way she’s become somewhat of an audiophile. She has an appreciation for good music and the technology that’s behind it. Her school is a performing arts and fine arts magnet, so they do have a music technology class that they start at a young age, which I thought was cool. I didn’t have that when I was young. I had a recorder, but I found a place called iCode. Where they did like a YouTube Creator Week where you modify sound waves and add text to video and make, make like video editing basically.

Arpan Shah [00:16:15]:
And she just loved it. After school, she pulled up my laptop, downloaded some app, and started finding stock videos and footage, adding text, and then finding music clips, uploading them, and doing that. And she’s just turned 9, and I can’t even do some of this stuff. So I was very impressed, and I felt grateful that, hey, I put in this effort. I got her into this camp over the summer instead of something else or just sitting at home. And she’s learned something new that she’s passionate about. The way I found it was a trial class in robotics where you kind of code a robot to like make a left turn, go straight, because, you know, the future is AI. So we gotta— I don’t know what the future holds, but I do know that you can’t go wrong with this stuff for now at least.

Arpan Shah [00:16:54]:
And it’s good to have a background in it. So I’m looking forward to seeing if I can get her into something else like our Battle of the Bots. That’s the— that’s something coming up in August, which is a week-long course about programming a robot. The other student programs one. And then you fight and then you see who wins and you learn something and you have a fun time.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:10]:
And what’s one way that you show your daughter that she can always count on you?

Arpan Shah [00:17:13]:
When she confesses something to me or says something serious, she knows that I have her back. Like if there’s some bullying happening or if she gets in trouble, there’s one way to discipline. And then, but in private, you want to give the advice and know that you’re on her side, that you are supported, that she is not alone. Even though there are going to be consequences for her behaviors and actions, you have to explain that to her. You can’t just be like, you’re going timeout, or Like, you know, I’m taking your tablet away for a week or whatever else you do to discipline your child. You want to explain that this was you, this is your choice. You can choose to do this or you can choose to do that. You have to give them the power.

Arpan Shah [00:17:50]:
And then once you give them the choice and they make the wrong choice, they’ll understand that there are specific consequences to making those choices in their little minds. And that’s how they’re gonna learn it. If you just yell at them, they’re just gonna learn to resist slightly and outsmart. But, and kids are smart, so you have to be on top of it and you have to be present and you have to be involved in everything we’ve set up to this point.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:10]:
And what’s a tradition or routine that you’ve created together that strengthens your bond?

Arpan Shah [00:18:15]:
It would have to be the evening meditation. And we did jiu-jitsu for 5 years. You know, we need to empower our girls, especially if they’re not bullies. If they are, then don’t empower them. But now she’s recently taken a liking to boxing. She loves it. Actually, as a bachelor, I might— I’m actually shopping for a 40-pound punching bag to put in my living room. Between my living room and dining room.

Arpan Shah [00:18:37]:
So I’m really happy that she loves it so much. And it’s something good, something fitness-oriented. I go to the gym, I make sure I bring her with me. Gyms have daycares with toys and fun stuff. So it’s important, like I said earlier, kids learn more from behaviors. You can tell a kid that it’s important to work out and eat healthy, or you can demonstrate that. And then she enjoys doing push-ups, mountain climbers, bear crawls, and all kinds of stuff just by watching me. And then you break a sweat, you come into the break room or the childcare area sweating, and you’re like, hey, just checking in on you.

Arpan Shah [00:19:07]:
How are you doing? You having fun, great. And then you go back. And I think those are really important.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:11]:
Now, we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our Dad Connection 6. 6 more questions to delve into you as a dad. Are you ready?

Arpan Shah [00:19:18]:
I am.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:18]:
What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughter?

Arpan Shah [00:19:22]:
Blissful.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:22]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice that you’ve ever received?

Arpan Shah [00:19:27]:
Always be honest with them.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:28]:
What’s one activity that you and your daughter love doing together?

Arpan Shah [00:19:32]:
Hiking.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:32]:
If you could give your daughter one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Arpan Shah [00:19:36]:
Pain is mandatory. Suffering is optional.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:38]:
What’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Arpan Shah [00:19:41]:
Resilience.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:42]:
And finally, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Arpan Shah [00:19:50]:
Your heart already knows what to do. Cut out your programming that you might have had from your parents and the parents before and be present with an open heart and mind.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:58]:
Well, Arpan, I just want to say thank you. Thank you so much for being here today, for sharing what you shared. If people want to find out more about you, where should they go?

Arpan Shah [00:20:06]:
Well, they can Google Arpan V. Shah, A-R-P-A-N, and my book is Daddy Goes to Work. You can also find me on Facebook as A.V. Shah. It’s just capital letters, A.V. together, space, Shah.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:18]:
Well, again, Arpan, thanks so much for being here today. I really appreciate the opportunity to talk to you again, and I wish you all the best.

Arpan Shah [00:20:24]:
Thank you so much, Chris. I appreciate the opportunity. It’s been a long time. Always a pleasure.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:28]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect; it’s about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes at dadanddaughterconnection.com. Until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:20:58]:
We’re all in the same boat, and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, we give the lessons, we make the meals, we buy them presents. Bring your A-game, ’cause those kids are growing fast. The time goes by so fast. I’m gonna go get some sleep. Time goes by just like a dynamite blast. Calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters and muscle men, get out and be in the world too now. Be the best dad you can be.

Musical Outro Performer [00:21:51]:
Be the best dad you can be.

Building Stronger Bonds: Matt Haviland and his Daughter Olivia’s Father-Daughter Journey

September 21, 2026 by dadofdivas

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At the heart of The Dad and Daughter Connection, featured in this week’s episode, is the steadfast belief that the strongest father-daughter relationships are built one intentional moment at a time. In a conversation brimming with honesty and warmth, Dr. Christopher Lewis sits down with Matt Haviland and his 20-year-old daughter, Olivia Haviland, to explore what it truly means to connect, support, and empower our daughters to become confident, independent women.

Listening With Intent

One of the most powerful themes from this episode is the importance of truly listening. Olivia Haviland reflects on her high school years, sharing how her dad’s willingness to listen without judgment made her feel seen and valued. Rather than resorting to harsh discipline, Matt Haviland chose to open a dialogue, striving to understand Olivia’s perspective and guide rather than simply correct. This practice, inspired by a national survey in which teens wished their dads would “listen more,” is a reminder for all fathers: be present, and let your daughter’s voice be heard.

Meaningful Moments Big and Small

Connection isn’t always about the grand gestures. Matt Haviland and Olivia share memories ranging from epic squirt gun battles to heartfelt college essays, and even “loud and obnoxious” declarations of love at McDonald’s. Whether it’s a shared joke, a drive together, or simply showing up at a dance recital, these moments accumulate into a reservoir of trust and comfort. As Olivia Haviland puts it, time spent together outweighs any material gift.

Guidance and Independence

Balancing guidance with independence is a recurring theme. Matt Haviland, a former single dad, emphasizes being intentional with the time he shared with Olivia, supporting her dreams while encouraging self-reflection and growth. For Olivia, this support translated into confidence in her career and life decisions—bolstered by her dad’s encouragement to think long-term and his faith-based guidance.

Real Advice for Real Dads

This episode wraps with practical wisdom: prioritize time with your kids, apologize for your mistakes, and let your actions reflect your family values. Both Matt Haviland and Olivia Haviland urge dads everywhere to listen deeply and value presence over presents.

Ready to strengthen your bond with your daughter? Listen to this heartfelt episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection and discover how every day can be an opportunity to connect, grow, and become the dad she needs.

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to The Dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and The Dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the Dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to work together to build those connections that we want to have with our daughters one day at a time. You know, I love it that you come back every week because that shows a lot about who you want to be as a father, but also who you want to be and what type of relationship you want to have, relationship that you want to have with your daughter.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:16]:
And it takes time, it takes effort, and it takes work. And we have to keep showing up. And it is so important for us to be able to put the work in for ourselves, but also put in the work with our daughters to be able to have that solid relationship that we wanna have. And that’s why this podcast exists. Every week, I love being able to bring you different people with different experiences that allow for you to be able to learn, to grow, to get some tools for your toolbox, and to be able to take those and use them for the future. So I am really excited today to have a, I’m gonna say a return guest. It’s not really a return guest on this show, but Matt Haviland, is with us. And Matt and his daughter are with us today, his daughter Olivia.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:02]:
And Matt is a past guest of a past podcast that I did called Dads with Daughters about 4 years ago. And I’m really excited to be able to have Matt on, but also this time his daughter Olivia, to be able to talk about the relationship that they’ve been able to build together and also what they’ve learned along the way to share that with you. Matt, Olivia, thanks so much for being here today.

Matt Haviland [00:02:26]:
Yeah, Chris, thanks again for having me back. And this is a really It’s a really special moment to have Olivia with me today. So say hi.

Olivia Haviland [00:02:33]:
Hi.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:33]:
I’m really excited to have you both here. And I want to go back a little bit because I know, Olivia, you’re 20. You know, you’re an adult now. You’re doing the life thing. You’re doing the work thing. You’re out there. And as you think back to the relationship that you’ve been able to build with your dad, what’s one thing that your dad did for you that helped you and made you feel truly seen, heard, and valued as a daughter?

Olivia Haviland [00:03:02]:
Um, I would say in high school, I was struggling a lot with my mental health. And then I was getting myself into a little bit of trouble. And he didn’t ground me. Well, there was like boundaries where he grounded me a little bit, but he was more open to like listening as of like why I did the things that I did, instead of just like not hearing me out and just screaming at me, taking my phone, not letting me hang out with my friends and everything. So that meant a lot to me.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:32]:
And Matt, I guess, take me back to that point for you, because I know you had your own journey as a youth and went through your own stuff. And we talked about, we talked about a lot of that in the first interview that we did. So talk to me about that for you and hearing that from Olivia and how you had to be able to kind of take what you learned to be able to help her?

Matt Haviland [00:03:57]:
Yeah, I was very grateful for a lot of the experiences that I had, not only personally but also professionally or through mentorship as well. I guess where I can go with that, Chris, is Olivia was born when I was 30 years old, so I wasn’t super young. So by the time she’s in high school, you know, I’m in my mid-40s. I would like to say I’ve learned a few things over those 14 or 15 years of parenting her, but I also Just like a lot of people, either parents or— I, I work with fathers also in a professional setting. You know, we learn a lot from our own previous experiences. So the things my own parents did or did not do, so learning how to correct that and apply that as much as possible. Plus working in a fatherhood field for so long, I’ve obviously picked up tips, either again things that I’ve taught guys or other men have taught me as well. But it really becomes a lot different instead of me just telling a dad what to do when I actually have to live this out.

Matt Haviland [00:04:54]:
But I think I could attribute a lot of it to— I was at a conference many years ago, probably 2010, 2012, and they revealed a survey result, a national survey, and they said all these teen kids wish their dad would fill in the blank. And the number one answer was listen more. And that was something that, just like Olivia just said, instead of flying off the handle, telling her how much trouble she’s in, let me hear her out first.

Olivia Haviland [00:05:18]:
Yeah.

Matt Haviland [00:05:19]:
And then we can go from there.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:20]:
Now I know that a lot of times, Matt, we as fathers are trying to build those moments, those meaningful moments that connect us with our kids. And what is one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share with Olivia and what made it so special?

Matt Haviland [00:05:35]:
Okay, she said the water fight, so clearly that must have been one. It was April Fool’s Day, probably about 4 or 5 years ago. She pranked me in the house and that turned out to a full-blown squirt gun war in the house, actually Super Soakers in the house.

Olivia Haviland [00:05:49]:
Well, I pranked him once and then he forgot to take the tape off the faucet and pranked himself again.

Matt Haviland [00:05:55]:
Yeah, she did the old, you know, she tied the rubber band around the sprayer on the kitchen sink. So when I turned on the kitchen sink faucet, it hit me, and then I shut it off and hit myself again. And yes, that is a very— we’re gonna remember that forever, having a squirt gun fight in the house. Not recommended. My wife had something to say about it when she got home, but it was very meaningful. Another really meaningful moment on a more emotional level was a couple years ago, Olivia wrote a paper for college, and they were to choose somebody that’s inspired them inspired them, and she wrote the paper about me. And it starts out with the words, I am who I am today because of my dad. And I don’t think, Christopher, I don’t think there’s any greater words that a parent can hear than something like that.

Matt Haviland [00:06:34]:
And she went on to say a lot of like what she just said about me being there and communicating with her mom and just so many other things. So that was a special moment. The fact that of all the times I’ve screwed up as a dad over, at that point, over 18 years, and then just to receive the gift like that that says, no, Dad, you did a lot of screwing up, but you did it right as well. And Really, that meant so much. To this day, there’s no greater gift I’ve ever been given than that paper.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:59]:
And Olivia, what are some things that you wish your dad had done differently when it came to building your relationship?

Olivia Haviland [00:07:05]:
I don’t know. I can’t really think of much because from our situation of like me growing up, it was really hard to make time to see me and everything, but he was doing all that he could. From what I noticed, I would just say maybe less of the dad jokes for sure. On a serious note, I can only flash back to when I was little and I wish he learned to cook more things rather than turkey burger and rice and sometimes mac and cheese.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:34]:
That’s fair.

Matt Haviland [00:07:35]:
I was a bachelor for 29 years. Okay, so but just for your audience though, to just kind of backtrack our story, I was a single dad, Olivia’s mom and I never married. So I was a single father for the first 9 years of her life too. So just trying to navigate what that was like raising a child in 2 different homes.

Olivia Haviland [00:07:52]:
Because rules would would be different at my mom’s and then rules would be different here. I would say like not anything that he could do different, but like something I take back is like when we would get in arguments, I would like not talk to him for the rest of the night. But like, he— I’m thankful that you respected my space, but I kind of wish you would have like pushed me a little bit to like talk more. But other than that, I can’t really think of anything.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:16]:
Now, Matt, all of us are trying to help our daughters to be able to become the people that they’re becoming. Talk to me about how you you balanced guiding Olivia while also giving her the independence to grow into the person that she has become?

Matt Haviland [00:08:31]:
Yeah, speaking from personal experience, so being a single father— and I’ve often defined single dads especially as it could be a man who has full custody, maybe it’s split custody, maybe it’s minimal custody— I would be what was defined as a non-custodial parent, meaning I had less than 50% of the parenting time. Because of that, I was really intentional about the time I had with her. But I think that’s just a good lesson for any parent, is to be intentional intentional. I have the privilege of working with new first-time fathers in some of the work that I do, and I’ll talk to them about making time for their kids. You know, there’s a great quote that says, you’ll never have the time for your kids, you have to make time. There’s no other way. And really putting that into practice, um, you know, you go to parks— and this isn’t to shame anybody listening, but it’s a good reminder— and you’ll see all the parents looking down at their phones while the kids are playing. And it’s about getting engaged in their life.

Matt Haviland [00:09:24]:
And I think for having Olivia, because I didn’t have her all the time. I did not want to take her time— the time with her for granted. But any— even for parents that are raising their kids together in the same household, I mean, the reminder still goes that there’s no greater gift that we can give our kids than our time. And being present isn’t just being in the same room, it’s being, you know, mentally and emotionally present. And I know there’s probably a lot of people that have heard that before, but I think it’s true. I mean, just to be there, to be involved with raising kids— yes, you’re going to have the serious moments, But then also, it’s just kind of spending time together. Maybe it’s going for a walk, and maybe at first it’s a goofy conversation, or, or it’s, uh, it gets more serious. When I had Olivia, the average drive home to her mom was about 15 or 20 minutes each way.

Matt Haviland [00:10:09]:
So every time I picked her up, I mean, that’s 20 minutes of car time that we can kind of talk a little bit. So I think it was not just anything one specific, but it was just that continual over and over and over for 18 years of trying to be as intentional as I can, listening to her, correcting mistakes when I, I can, and then Everybody will say it, she is a carbon copy of me. She is literally— I mean, she’s cuter than me, but just, I mean, personality-wise, she is a carbon copy.

Olivia Haviland [00:10:36]:
We stand the same.

Matt Haviland [00:10:37]:
Yeah, our mannerisms are all the same. But really understanding that too, that I’m looking in a mirror here. So when I am raising her, disciplining her, engaging with her, how would I react to that as well?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:49]:
And speaking to that, Olivia, how has your relationship with your dad influenced the way in which you navigate life, relationships, or challenges? challenges today?

Olivia Haviland [00:10:59]:
Um, I would say, I mean, definitely he— I obviously wasn’t alive, but he did struggle when he was a teenager and in his 20s. And I feel like when I got into that point, when I was getting in some trouble my sophomore year of high school and everything, just like for him to know exactly what it was like to do the same things helped him guide me out of it instead of, like I said earlier, yelling at me, screaming at me. He would actually like hear me out and be like, hey, I was in your position once and this is how I got through it. But he would also always bring faith into it and keep me strong in my faith. Like he would always end a conversation with a Bible verse or bring in a passage or a verse just to help me through something.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:47]:
Now, Matt, we talked about— Olivia’s just talking about some challenging times, and all of us go through those challenging times as we’re raising kids. There’s great times and there’s where you might hit rock bottom as well. And what are some intentional ways that you worked to strengthen your bond with Olivia, especially during those challenging times?

Matt Haviland [00:12:05]:
I’ve always had, since I’ve become a dad, and I am one to really— I’m a huge advocate for everyone to have a mentor. You know, I’ve always had a mentor. I wasn’t raised in a two-parent home. My parents were never married. My dad was minimally engaged in my life. So not having that strong father figure in my life, growing up and understanding what that’s like. But when I did become a dad, I’ve always had strong mentor men in my life in various capacities. Some might be in work, some might be in parenting, or whatever it may be.

Matt Haviland [00:12:38]:
So I think being able to talk it through with a mentor who also was a father, and maybe even perhaps depending on who it was, a grandfather— so a mentor just being somebody that’s a little older and has more experience And hearing that out. And Chris, there was a ton of mistakes along the way. I mean, I’m not going to lie. There was— I’ve had some really bad moments as parents, never in a, like, an abusive way or anything, but where I really dropped the ball. And just understand, I don’t ever want to feel like that again. Apologizing to her, admitting that I screwed up and doing my best not to go through that again. But by the time she was really struggling, especially in the late middle school, early high school years, again, by this point, I’m in my mid-40s. I had been parenting her for a long time.

Matt Haviland [00:13:22]:
So, I knew Olivia. I was able to read her cues. And, I understand that might be a little different in every family dynamic, but I was able to read her cues. And, the girl talks all the time. So, when Olivia’s quiet, there’s obviously there’s something going on. And, like she said, I mean, I was in some— my teen and 20s were some pretty dark years in my life and never wanting her to go through that. I struggled with substance abuse and a lot of other I didn’t go that far. No, but I’m just saying I didn’t want you to go that far.

Matt Haviland [00:13:53]:
So being able to kind of curb that beforehand. But there’s always— I think there also was a special bond. And again, this isn’t to take away from anybody in other family dynamics, but because I was a single father, when I had Olivia, it was me and Olivia. So for 9 years, it was just us. We were like a team, you know? And just to be able to read— and I mean, she’s my heart, and I wanted to in so many ways, give her what I was never given from an upbringing even though it wasn’t perfect because she was still being raised in 2 different homes. But nonetheless, giving her the holidays or the Christmases or the love—

Olivia Haviland [00:14:28]:
Dance recitals and games.

Matt Haviland [00:14:29]:
Yeah, attending. My dad made 2 of my baseball games over 12 years. And, I was at almost every game I could make for her or her dance recitals and understanding how important that is for her to look out in the crowd And to see me there.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:41]:
You know, Olivia, earlier I asked your dad about how he worked to be able to provide you with that independence that you needed. Talk to me on your side of how your dad encouraged you to be confident and independent in your life.

Olivia Haviland [00:14:56]:
I would say he’s always been my biggest cheerleader, even if it’s loud and obnoxious at my games. Or there was one time he was saying how much he loved me in the middle of McDonald’s, just screaming it.

Matt Haviland [00:15:09]:
On purpose.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:10]:
On purpose.

Matt Haviland [00:15:11]:
To embarrass her on purpose.

Olivia Haviland [00:15:12]:
But I would say, like, he’s always been like, he’ll send me a, hey, good morning, I hope you have an amazing day. It’s not every day, but I think that’s what makes it more special is that it’ll be like out of the blue or it’ll be like a Bible verse or like I’ll tell him, I’m like, hey, I had a really bad day today. And then he’ll send me a Bible verse or be like, hey, I have time to call. I would say that’s really encouraging. And then also just like, you know, I’ll be at work and then he’ll show up and bring Dunkin’ or Subway, just like showing that even like if he can see me for 5 minutes, like it still matters. So that means a lot to me too.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:51]:
And Matt, we talked before we started today about what Olivia is doing and she’s working in healthcare right now. And I guess as you have been fathering Olivia, how do you support Olivia in pursuing her passions and her dreams?

Matt Haviland [00:16:04]:
Great question. I, first of all, I’m very impressed because Olivia has a career focus already at 20. And I know that’s not rare, but I, at 20, I mean, I was completely in the opposite direction. So I’m already just so proud of her because, I mean, she is very motivated, she’s very determined, she has an excellent work ethic. I mean, she works hard and she really respects the job that she has, even if she doesn’t like it a lot. So, so to encourage her again— Yeah, she likes her job right now, so that’s good. But to encourage her, I would say again, just listening, kind of maybe as she’s talking, processing, like, okay, what’s this going to look like in your life? Is this going to require more schooling? Sometimes I ask her questions like, how do you see this playing out long-term? If you want to get advanced in your career, what’s that going to look like? How’s that going to affect the other areas of your life? And kind of just helping her think through. You know, she doesn’t have all the weight that, you know, we as adults have right now, you know, carrying a lot of mortgages or payments or, you know, other bigger obligations.

Matt Haviland [00:17:09]:
Not to minimize what she’s doing, but—

Olivia Haviland [00:17:10]:
Right.

Matt Haviland [00:17:11]:
But she has some opportunity and some room right now to really dream, like, hey, what do I want to do for a career? And if I do change my career, that’s okay. But she has tremendous skills. I think that’s one thing, is to let her know what skills she has. She’s definitely a people person. She has a hard work ethic. She’s a great communicator. So just kind of saying, hey, these are the things you’re really good at. So where would that fit for you in your career field?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:35]:
And Olivia, if you could spend an entire day with your dad doing anything, what would it look like?

Olivia Haviland [00:17:39]:
Oh, no. No signs, no dad jokes. That would be—

Matt Haviland [00:17:44]:
You gotta explain the signs.

Olivia Haviland [00:17:46]:
He is obsessed. I will be trying, like, you know, we go to a zoo, I want to see the animals, and he’s like, oh, I want to know where the animals lived, um, where they came from, how old are they, how many, like, claws do they have, how many teeth. Like, it doesn’t matter. Like, I just— I want to see the animals. And it kind of just began as, like, a running joke. Every time he sees a sign, he sends it to me. I reply with, I’m not reading that. But I would say a perfect day, honestly, I love our beach days because he’s very— I mean, we’re like the same person.

Olivia Haviland [00:18:19]:
Like, we don’t want to get out of the water, but we’ve always played stupid games like how many times can we catch the ball in a row throwing trick shots. And then like during COVID we were hitting a ball on our roof with a tennis racket, like, and made that like a whole summer competition. So I would say just like Like little games, like beach day getaway, just the two of us. And then probably Star Wars at the end. Star Wars are an old movie, but something we do like monthly.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:48]:
Sounds like a good day. Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our Dad Connection 6, 6 more questions. And I usually ask them just to dads, but I’m gonna ask both of you some different questions or questions for both of you. Uh, first and foremost, Olivia, what’s one word that describes your relationship with your dad?

Olivia Haviland [00:19:04]:
Comforting.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:05]:
And Matt, what’s your word?

Matt Haviland [00:19:06]:
I’d say solid.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:07]:
And Matt, what’s the best piece of dad advice you’ve ever received?

Matt Haviland [00:19:12]:
I think it’s honestly, it’s been in multiple forms and it’s what I’ve already mentioned. It’s just spending time with them. Other things can wait. And I’ve heard a million different quotes in that way, but it all boils down to spending undivided, just they got my attention or she has my attention. Everything else can wait and it’s just our time. So yeah, time.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:33]:
And Olivia, what’s the best piece of dad advice you’ve ever received?

Olivia Haviland [00:19:37]:
I would honestly say, like, like he said earlier, the, like, talking me through it. Where can you see yourself from this? Let’s, you know, visualize what even is it gonna look like in a month versus 5 years. And I would say that’s gotten me a lot of places because before I make decisions now, I always, like, stop and think, like, hey, like, I may like it right now, but in 3 months, am I gonna like what I’m doing? In a year, am I gonna like what I’m doing? Am I gonna wanna be doing this when I’m older?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:06]:
Yeah.

Olivia Haviland [00:20:06]:
I’m 60 or 70 years old kind of thing. So I would say that’s gotten me far in a lot of places.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:12]:
Matt, what’s one activity that you and Olivia love doing together?

Matt Haviland [00:20:15]:
You’re gonna appreciate this one, Christopher. Going to University of Michigan football games.

Musical Outro Performer [00:20:20]:
Okay.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:21]:
And I’m gonna throw it back to you too, Olivia. And it doesn’t have to be the same thing. It’d be something different.

Olivia Haviland [00:20:25]:
Daddy-daughter dances or like donuts with dad or anything that’s like one-on-one mini golf, golf, and football games, definitely.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:33]:
Matt, if you could give Olivia one life lesson in a single sentence, What would it be?

Matt Haviland [00:20:37]:
Love God, love others.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:38]:
And Matt, what’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Matt Haviland [00:20:42]:
I think—

Olivia Haviland [00:20:43]:
The girl version of you.

Matt Haviland [00:20:45]:
That too. But I would say since becoming a dad, I think you learn how the word selfish feels strong, but I don’t think it’s out of line of when it’s just us. But when it was just me as a single dad or a single man versus becoming a father, it was all about me. I tell my new guys, I think I think being a parent drives you to a level of commitment to your children that would not be attained any other way.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:09]:
And Olivia, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Olivia Haviland [00:21:16]:
I would say put aside anything that can wait, and then also listen before either conversating or just listen to the full story instead of, like, interrupting, getting down to the point.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:32]:
And Matt?

Matt Haviland [00:21:32]:
Yeah, I think it’s so important to live out your values and what’s important to your family. We have a culture that is in many ways just so antagonistic and assaulting our daughters, and to be able to speak against that, letting our daughters know how beautiful they are, how valued they are, their virtue, their beauty, their tenderness. And this is an appropriate conversation for whether you’re raising a 5-year-old or a 20-year-old as well.

Olivia Haviland [00:21:58]:
I would also always say time over items too, because I know A lot of my friends’ parents will be like at work because they work third shift or something. They’ll be like, here’s money to go get something because I didn’t see you all day, or here’s money because I yelled at you kind of thing, instead of just sitting down, actually talking everything out. It helps grow a relationship too.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:20]:
Well, Matt, Olivia, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for spending time with me today, for sharing your journey in your own relationship. Matt is an author as well, and I should mention that he did write a book a number of years back called A Father’s Walk, a Christian-based resource for single fathers. And if people want to find out more about you, Matt, and what you’re doing, where should they go?

Matt Haviland [00:22:43]:
I don’t have a website, but you can email me. I’m completely open to that. My email is afatherswalk@gmail.com. That’s a fathers with an S on the end, walk at Gmail.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:54]:
Well, again, I want to say thank you. Thank you to both of you for your time, for sharing your And I wish you both all the best.

Matt Haviland [00:23:01]:
Thanks, Christopher.

Olivia Haviland [00:23:01]:
Thank you.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:02]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect. It’s about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes at dadanddaughterconnection.com. Until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:23:33]:
We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, we give the lessons. We make the meals, we buy them presents. Bring your A-game, ’cause those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast. Calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters and muscle men, get out and be the world to them. Be the best dad you can be. Be the best dad you can be.

Building Lasting Bonds: Intentional Fatherhood with John Azoni

September 7, 2026 by dadofdivas

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If you’re a dad on a mission to forge a lasting, meaningful bond with your daughter, “The Dad and Daughter Connection” should be your next podcast download. In a recent episode, host Dr. Christopher Lewis sits down with John Azoni, a father of two daughters (ages 9 and 11), who opens up about the real joys and sometimes messy challenges of raising confident, independent girls.

Intentionality and Presence
From the very start, Dr. Christopher Lewis sets the tone: fatherhood isn’t about achieving perfection, but about truly connecting and learning as you go. Each week, the podcast dives into stories and practical advice to help dads show up with intention. As John Azoni shares, “There’s no one right way to father our daughters,” but we can always add new tools to our toolbox by learning from each other.

Creating Meaningful Memories
A standout theme of this episode is making memories, both big and small. John Azoni recounts an unforgettable trip to Japan with his daughter for her 10th birthday—a tradition inspired by a parenting book. But the heart of the conversation reveals that it’s often the simplest moments, like cooking together or going for wonton soup every Thursday, that mean the most. One-on-one time, even a half hour at bedtime, can become the foundation for lifelong connections.

Honesty, Growth, and Mistakes
Both John Azoni and Dr. Christopher Lewis candidly discuss the challenges—especially during difficult times like COVID or navigating questions around faith. John Azoni is honest about making mistakes, from losing patience to not always having the answers. The key lesson? “I make a lot of mistakes and I’ve learned to be okay with that… I want my kids to grow up and know their dad was crazy about them.”

Encouragement to Other Dads
The episode wraps with powerful advice: Be intentional. Don’t let stress distract you from what really matters. As John Azoni puts it, “The grass is greener where you water it”—the relationships you invest in now will shape the future.

If you’re a dad, or know someone who is, this episode is a must-listen. It’s a heartfelt reminder that showing up, being present, and embracing imperfection are the real keys to building an unbreakable bond with your daughter.

Listen to the full episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection to get inspired and start your journey toward a stronger relationship today!

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to The Dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and The Dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there, it’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the Dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to connect with one another and work on building those that we want with our daughters one day at a time. I love that you come back every week because all of us are on a journey. Whether you have toddlers, whether you have a baby at home, whether you have teenagers at home, whether you have adult kids, we all are on this continuum of being a father to a daughter.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:19]:
And we can always learn more. We can always learn more to help us to be able to be better in the role that we have. We’re gonna stumble, we’re gonna fall, That’s okay. All of us do it. There’s no one right way to father our daughters. But what we can do is we can learn from other dads what’s working for them, what’s not working for them, and build some tools for our own toolbox, add some tools for our own toolbox, and be able to get just that much better every day because that’s what we need to be doing. to be able to be there for our daughters. That’s what we need to be doing to be able to be present.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:59]:
And I am really excited to have another new guest this week. John Azoni is with us today, and John’s a father of 2 daughters who are 9 and 11. And we’re gonna be talking about the journey that he’s been on with his daughters. And I’m really excited to have him here today. John, thanks so much for being here.

John Azoni [00:02:15]:
Thanks for having me. It’s great to be here.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:17]:
You know, it’s really, I’m really excited to be able to have you here today and to be able to talk to you about the journey that you have been on thus far with your daughters. And I guess one of the things that I always think about when it comes to raising our daughters is we’re always running after those moments. We want those moments with our kids. And as you think back to the years that you’ve had with your daughters thus far, what’s one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share with them and what made it so special? And one thing I’ll add is they could be separate moments as well.

John Azoni [00:02:49]:
So I read this book a number of years ago called Love Does. The author is Bob Goff and it’s a faith-based book. And in it, he talks a lot about parenting. parenting. And he told the story of taking his kids when they turned 10 on a trip anywhere in the world they want to go to, really leaning into what is it that they are becoming, what is it that they’re interested in, and, and where can we go in the world to kind of deepen that. And so I always thought that that was a cool idea. And my daughter, when she turned 10 last year, my daughter Ellie, in my mind I was kind of like maybe somewhere in the United States. I don’t remember explicitly saying anywhere in the world.

John Azoni [00:03:25]:
So when my daughter was like, I want to go to Japan, I was like, oh, okay. Well, so after a lot of hemming and hawing, I talked to my wife. She’s like, just do it. It’s like once in a lifetime. We’re like, all right, we’re going to Japan. So, so we went to Tokyo last May and it was so cool just to learn about another culture together, to really press into, you know, the stuff that she likes. She’s really into K-pop. It’s obviously not in Korea, but somewhere over there.

John Azoni [00:03:54]:
She’s into that kind of Asian culture and Hello Kitty. And they have the biggest Hello Kitty store in the world there, uh, video games and arcades where she can and do all the— she loves playing those claw games, which are really popular in Asian countries. So, so it was great. I mean, we just traveled around, we ate good food, we went to Paris Disney, um, and just spent a week together. That— and, and even just like, it was a pretty short trip, but— and people were like, well, you’re just going for like 5 days? Like, aren’t you gonna be— I mean, like, a big part of that is just traveling, you know? By the time you get there, I think we had 3 full days there. And I was just like, you know, it’s, it’s the adventure. It’s like traveling is, is part of it. We’re gonna learn how to do the airport together.

John Azoni [00:04:30]:
So on the way there, I kind of led the charge, but on the way back I was like, All right, where do you think we should turn to get to baggage claim or stuff like that? Or where do you think we should go to get our bags checked? So that was fun. And, you know, I’ve had other special experiences with my youngest daughter, Ryland. Currently though, we’re planning her trip. She wants to go to Paris. So we’re planning on going to Paris next year.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:50]:
Those will be experiences that they will never forget. And definitely you don’t have to do these huge moments. They can be small moments as well. But I had an experience like that last year with my oldest who is in college, but she was out in Colorado and I picked her up from a camp she was working in and we spent a week going to all the national parks all around in that area. So we went to Zion and Bryce and Grand Canyon and Petrified Forest, all kinds of places. And we hiked and we just had an amazing experience. And I think when you have those opportunities, not only are they great opportunities to be able to have to build memories, but you have time one-on-one. And I think that’s even more important.

John Azoni [00:05:32]:
Yeah, one-on-one time is really special. So last weekend, my oldest daughter went to Florida with my wife because she does dance, and her dance group went to go perform at Disney in the parade. And so that was just a life dream of hers. And she got this one-on-one time with my wife. And previously, we were kind of like, all right, we’re Disney’d out. We’ve been to Disney World. We’ve been on a Disney cruise. I took Ellie to Disney in Tokyo.

John Azoni [00:05:58]:
And we’ve been to Disneyland when we went to California last year. And my wife was kind of like, all right, this is the last time I got to go to Disney. And then I get a text from her in the middle of it. She’s like, this is so great. It’s such a different experience being one-on-one with Ellie and we’re just having the best time. And at the same time, I’m home with Ryland and we had our own special weekend. We, you know, wrote on the whiteboard, here’s all the things we wanna do and we wanna schedule all these things out. Anytime you can write a list on a whiteboard for my youngest, she’s all about it.

John Azoni [00:06:27]:
She loves to just like have a checklist, have a plan. So one-on-one time is something completely different that you just cannot replace.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:33]:
Now you talked a little bit about on that trip to Tokyo, giving your daughter some independence to be able to make some decisions and things like that. And, and as our kids are getting older, we definitely have to do that. How are you finding that you’re balancing not only guiding your daughters, but also giving them the independence to grow into the people that they’re becoming?

John Azoni [00:06:52]:
Oh, that’s a tough question. I try to lean into who are they and what is, what is my role in this? Like one of the things that I learned about Ellie on that Japan trip is how scrappy she is. And it’s so different for me. Like she has no problem going up and asking a stranger where to get directions. Or one time we were on the bus going somewhere in Tokyo and some lady was lost. And for some reason my daughter stepped in and starts trying to tell her where to go as if she knows where to go. I’m like, Ellie, where do you think you’re sending her? She just wants to get in there. And I’m just very like, I don’t like to be embarrassed.

John Azoni [00:07:27]:
I don’t like to ask for help. I’m a lot more shy, but she kind of lifts me up in that way. I really try to get on that level with her and also just try to let her be who she is and go out into the world and just talk to new people like her mom does. But I think it’s always a challenge where to step in. I think the biggest area that we are struggling with that right now is, is in faith. And I don’t know if you’re a person of faith, but when I got married, my wife and I were both devout Christians. And over the last 5 years, I’ve kind of deconstructed and my faith has evolved in a way— I wouldn’t say I’m not a believer, but I would say like I just have so many questions that I’m allowing myself to ask. And I’m engaging in these conversations with what I grew up believing versus what can be verified and things like that.

John Azoni [00:08:13]:
So I’m kind of down this more scientific path. My wife isn’t. How do we let our kids discover things on their own? And what do we teach them about the world? That’s been really hard because when you’re defining your parenthood around an entire ideology, like a religion, and that’s the lens that you’re giving your kids, and that’s the lens you’re told to give your kids, you’re instructed to teach them in this way. Well, now when you throw questions into the mix, mom and dad have different answers for what do you do? So I think we’ve kind of landed on. We want our kids to think independently. And when one of my kids has a tough question, I’ll say, well, here’s what I think. Here’s what I’m not sure about. Like, here’s what I have questions about.

John Azoni [00:08:55]:
Here’s what your mom thinks. And you can kind of make up your own decision. And that was also never more true in, you know, this most recent election. You know, my oldest had a lot of questions about who was running for president, who was the good guy, and who was the bad guy. And it’s easy to want to pick a side and train your kid on that side. But we really tried to just step back and be like, well, Well, here’s what this side says. Here’s what that side says. What do you think? And so that’s kind of where we’ve landed, I think, giving them some scaffolding, but letting them kind of figure it out themselves.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:26]:
And as you’ve been starting to do that with your daughters, especially around this faith journey, what has their response been?

John Azoni [00:09:33]:
It’s tough because they knew me when we were all praying every night and putting them to bed and going to church all the time and, you know, all this stuff. And so they’ve seen me kind of drift and ask these questions that they look at me as I’m supposed to have the answers To these, you’re supposed to know if if Adam and Eve are real people or not. And so that’s been tough. You know, their response has been honestly one of confusion. I wish I had a glossy answer for you. It’s not gone great. It’s very tough to navigate. And like I said, you know, we just go back to like here’s what two different people can think, and we can hold two different things in tension.

John Azoni [00:10:11]:
And certainly the Bible, there are a lot of instances where the Bible is represented as God holding two. seemingly opposing things in tension together and somehow making it work. So we kind of go with that. But yeah, I wish I could tell you that it’s gone. It’s just been perfect. And they’re— they have all the answers that I don’t have. But anytime you’re trying to sort through something on your own and your kid’s looking to you for the answer, that’s just a tough position to be in.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:36]:
It is a tough place to be because, I mean, you try to have that solid front on everything in parenting because when you don’t have the solid front, then things tend to go awry. So I think what you’re hearing here, though, is that John and his wife still have a solid front, but they’re attacking it in different ways. And they’re providing their kids the ability to be able to move in the direction that makes more sense for them. That doesn’t mean that they’re not in alignment on other things in their parenting journey, though.

John Azoni [00:11:07]:
Yeah, I would liken it to, like, giving them— I mentioned the term scaffolding, and I really like that term. And I would just say, So we’ve just really widened the scaffolding around faith to where we’re still in this box. But what that looks like on a day-to-day basis or on an individual beliefs basis can look different. And 2 people can arrive at different conclusions and still have the same heart.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:31]:
So as you think about your daughters and you think about what you’ve been doing with your daughters, what are some intentional ways that you have worked to strengthen your bond with your daughters, especially during times that might be more challenging?

John Azoni [00:11:43]:
COVID was a time of obviously being sort of forced into this intentional time. And at first it was very stressful because at the time I had a salaried job and a certain amount of PTO days and I’m a rule follower. So if I say I’m working, but I’m off at the park with the kids, like I don’t, I don’t feel good about that. But like there was all this stuff that you had to do from out of necessity during that time. So it was a stressful time, but it also kind of caused me to be like, let’s really soak this up. And so we did a lot of stuff together as a family, but that actually led me to leave that job. and start my own company, my own video production company. And for a big reason was to be more flexible with them and to be able to be home with them and be there when they need me and not have to worry about PTO.

John Azoni [00:12:28]:
And so that’s opened the doors to a lot of great times where I might be right in the middle of a busy project and I would get a call from the school. And my oldest, Ellie, she was the one that would call home a lot. She would feel a stomachache or something and she’d feel like she needed to go home. And we would have to navigate like a lot of times, like, what is the line that Where Dad will pick you up and where you need to tough it out. But there’s a lot of times where I could have been really stressed about work, but I had to just really be like, you know what, I’m just— I’m gonna go pick her up. I’m gonna be happy about it. I’m gonna have a smile on my face. I’m gonna make her feel like Dad wants to be here.

John Azoni [00:13:01]:
Dad cares about me. He’s not annoyed with me. You know, I think just those small acts have been great. And I remember, you know, other times too, just a lot of our special times revolve around food.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:12]:
Yeah.

John Azoni [00:13:13]:
It seems like every Thursday, a number of years ago when Ellie was in preschool, she would have a half day. And so I’d pick her up and every Thursday we’d go get wonton soup on the way home at this Chinese restaurant. And we learned— Dad stepped out of his comfort zone and learned the owner of the restaurant’s name so that when we called, we can say, hey, Lynn, our usual. She wanted that. Like, that would just be so cool. And so eventually she started calling and being like, hi, Lynn, it’s Ellie, just our usual. And then we’d go pick it up. But we cook a lot together too.

John Azoni [00:13:42]:
My daughters each really enjoy cooking and no matter what we’re making, just spending time together. And that’s where I think one-on-one time is really important because trying to cook with both of them at the same time is just a constant referee of who got to chop what, who got to pour this, who cracked the last egg, you know. So I found just one at a time, we’ll have a great time together, but let’s just, you know. So yeah, I mean, there’s a lot of opportunities, but I think it’s a lot in those small moments where it’s like my natural reaction might be to be stressed or just to be worried about the day-to-day. stuff, but like my daughters are looking to me as like, am I liked? Like, am I loved in this moment? Am I safe in this moment? Does my dad want to be here? And I really try to, to just put on a smile and just be like, you know what, this— because one of the things I say, I started saying since I started my own business was my business is in service of my kids, not in spite of them. And that’s a tough thing to, to stick to because whether or not something gets done has a very real consequences about whether, whether income comes in the door. But, but the reason why I— half the reason I started my own company was to be there for my kids and to not miss this time with them. And so, so yeah, that’s kind of how I think about work and spending time with them.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:01]:
All of us as dads, we’re not perfect. We make mistakes. And while we try our best to be the best we can, we’re going to make mistakes. We’re fallible. We’re humans. What’s a mistake that you made as a father? And what did What did it do, or what did you learn from it about fostering positive communication and connection with your daughters?

John Azoni [00:15:20]:
I think it’s a pattern of mistakes. And when I get overstimulated, when there’s too many people talking to me at once, I get immediate, like 0 to 100 stressed out. And that’s— I’m so likely to just lash out and like snap and say something, tell them to be quiet, but in a rude way that we’re not allowed to say. So that’s where it’s such a tension of like, because they’re both in the back talking like peak back-talking phase. And honestly, my youngest is the most cutting about it. I mean, she will just go right for the jugular. And they talk back usually as a reaction and not as a response, like not as an intentional response. So when I’m feeling stressed or overwhelmed and I lash out, I’m not doing any service to them.

John Azoni [00:16:06]:
It’s very hypocritical to tell them that’s not how we talk to people. And then just in a, in a different way or a different use of words, I do the same thing. So I think that’s— I think we’re all learning together. How to regulate ourselves. My wife is a therapist, and so we’ve learned a lot about the concept of regulation, and we’ve read a lot of parenting books about when your kids make you mad or something, or they say something completely disrespectful, they’re dysregulated. They’re not really choosing that response. And so your job as a parent is to be the one that regulates, not escalates. And so that’s— that is the toughest thing for me, like— I have to really think I’m feeling myself escalating this situation and I need to be the, I need to be the regulator.

John Azoni [00:16:50]:
So I don’t know if that answers your question, but that’s just a slurry of thoughts of, of communication between me and my kids.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:58]:
No, I appreciate you sharing that because I think it is important to understand that that happens. I mean, and we’re going to, things are going to adjust and, you know, and all of us get overwhelmed at times. And especially these days, there’s so many things being thrown at every one of us. And whether it’s technology, whether it’s, you know, whatever, there are so many things that are being thrown at each one of us, not only us, but our kids, etc. So it is important to know that. And then finding ways to be able to quiet the noise, not only for ourselves, but quiet the noise for our kids, I think is also important as we think about our— the way in which we’re fathering. Because if we know— if you know that you’re triggered when that happens, you have to figure out for yourself, and you’ve probably already done that, is What can you do to quiet the noise so that you can continue being present and continue, continue being who you want to be with your daughters?

John Azoni [00:17:51]:
Yeah, absolutely.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:52]:
So there’s been a lot of things that you’ve talked about where you’re showing that you’re doing some intentional things to really connect with your daughters. What do you do intentionally to make your daughters feel valued and heard?

John Azoni [00:18:04]:
I think it’s just trying to get on their level and care about the things that they care about. My youngest, it’s always was so funny, and we, my wife and I laugh about this. We would pick her up from daycare when she was younger, you know, 3, 4 years old. And that could be a very stressful moment because we’re also picking up my oldest from daycare and she’s wanting to do something. Can we go out for ice cream? Or when’s mom going to be home? Blah, blah, blah. And again, too many people talking to me at once. And my youngest, all she wants to do in that moment is show me the drawings that she made and show me the little worksheets that she did. And it’s so important to her.

John Azoni [00:18:38]:
And she feels, you can just see the receiving of love when you look at her and you care about what she wrote, that she wrote her name or that she did something, that she wrote, she counted to 10 or whatever it is. And so, I mean, we have stacks and stacks of paper because that behavior has never stopped. She’s almost 9 and she still to this day wants to show us everything. She went to this art camp a couple weeks ago, made all kinds of art. And the first thing she wants to do when we get in the car is like, Dad, let me show you what I made. And it’s so important that I give her my full attention. And I can get on board with that because I’m— my background’s in fine arts. I’m a painter.

John Azoni [00:19:14]:
So I went to art school and all that stuff. So that’s a perfect thing for me to like get on board with. I think just, yeah, finding in those moments, what are they really trying to say right now? What they’re really trying to say is, Dad, I want to connect with you. Not like, not necessarily about the papers or the drawings or whatever. And I find that with my oldest too. She’s starting to outgrow like bedtime, but she still wants me to put her to bed. And, you know, and I’m kind of just like clinging to that for as long as possible. And we just have the best talks.

John Azoni [00:19:43]:
Like, there’s just no greater conversation than when we’re just— I’m just laying in her bed with her next to her and we’re just, just talking about whatever, just laughing about things. I mean, so much laughter happens in those moments. And I listen when I’m putting my other daughter to bed, my wife’s putting Ellie to bed, I hear them cracking up too because they just get into the funniest, you know, they just become a new person. They feel so safe. And so I think just being intentional about those moments, because sometimes I’m like, I’m tired, it’s 9:30, I got to get up at 5 in the morning. I don’t want to spend a half an hour, you know, laying, laying with you and waiting for you to brush your teeth and waiting for you to put your pajamas on. And it’s getting towards 10 o’clock now. And so I try, but I try to really push that aside and say, hey, she’s, she’s not going to ask me to do this for much longer.

John Azoni [00:20:29]:
And in 5 years, I’m going to miss any, any attention she gave me, like her wanting to actually hang out with me, because it’s going to be the other way around. So, so I think it’s just, I think it’s just recognizing in those moments what’s really most important and then just leaning into that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:45]:
Now, we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our Dad Connection 6. 6 more questions to delve a little bit deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:52]:
Sure.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:53]:
What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughters?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:56]:
Humor.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:57]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice that you ever received?

John Azoni [00:21:02]:
It’s probably from when you’re walking around a grocery store and you get like a whole stream of like elderly men that will say, I remember when my daughter was that age and then she started driving the next day. Like, don’t miss it. I really actually took advice to heart, like what I just said. I’m like, there’s gonna be a time when they’re not gonna want to hang out with me, so don’t miss it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:20]:
What’s one activity you and your daughters love doing together?

John Azoni [00:21:24]:
Cooking.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:25]:
If you could give your daughters one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

John Azoni [00:21:30]:
I think just don’t change for other people. Don’t be the person that you’re with. I think like maybe girls especially start dating and things like that, they want to change to be liked and to impress and things like that. And so I think my advice would just be to just be yourself and be What’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad? I have learned, I have learned that I make a lot of mistakes and I’ve learned to be okay with that. I just want my kids to grow up and know that their dad was crazy about them. And for all my flaws, I want them to— I watched this video one time. It was my boss’s. We did a story on my boss at the time at my old job, his family.

John Azoni [00:22:11]:
And we interviewed his wife and they were talking about her parents and they asked her, what’s your favorite thing about your dad? And she said, said how much he loves me. And she started crying. And I edited that video. So of course, I’m like, I’m like tearing up and like, you know, you got the music going and stuff like that in the edit, in the video edit. So, but I’ve always kept that with me as like, that’s like my mantra as a dad. Like, I’m gonna mess up, but like, I want my kids to, to really feel and be imprinted with how like crazy I am about them.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:39]:
And finally, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

John Azoni [00:22:48]:
I think it’s just being really intentional with them. I think for me, I just think about, it’s like we have 18 years if we’re lucky, and I want to build as many memories with them as possible. And I don’t want to waste this being stressed about stuff that’s just not going to matter in 50 years. And so, and I think about it the same way of like marriage advice. People contrast the saying of the grass is greener on the other side. side with, with saying the grass is greener where you water it. And I like that about marriage. And that’s something that I keep in my mind.

John Azoni [00:23:20]:
But I also think that that applies to kids too. I mean, the type of relationship that you’re going to have with your kids now and when they’re older is determined by how intentional you are in these early years and just watering that grass.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:34]:
Well, John, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for being here today, for sharing what you shared with the journey that you’ve gone through. If people want to find out more about you, I know you got a podcast. Is there a place that people can go to find out more?

John Azoni [00:23:46]:
Yeah, I’m very active on LinkedIn. My name’s spelled J-O-H-N-A-Z-O-N-I if you’re searching for me. That’s probably where I hang out the most, on LinkedIn. I don’t post a whole lot of family stuff, but once in a while you might get some sort of business advice through the lens of being a dad to 2 girls.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:00]:
Well, again, John, thank you so much for being here, and I wish you all the best.

John Azoni [00:24:03]:
Thank you.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:03]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect; it’s about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes at dadanddaughterconnection.com. Until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:24:34]:
We’re all in the same boat. And it’s full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, we give the lessons, we make the meals, we buy them presents. So bring your A-game, ’cause those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast. Calling astronauts and firemen, Carpenters and muscle men, get out and be in the world too now. Be the best dad you can be. Be the best dad you can be.

A Change In Our Format

August 17, 2026 by dadofdivas

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Hey everyone, I wanted to take a few minutes to share a little change that’s coming to The Dad & Daughter Connection.

For the past several years, I’ve been bringing you a new episode every single week, and I am incredibly grateful for everyone who listens, shares an episode, recommends the podcast to a friend, or simply takes the time to tune in. This podcast means a lot to me, and getting to have conversations with amazing dads, daughters, authors, experts, and people who have something meaningful to teach us about fatherhood has been an incredible journey.

But I’ve also been reminded of something that I talk about on this podcast all the time: being present matters.

As much as I love doing this podcast, I’m also a dad, a husband, and someone with a lot of other responsibilities and commitments. And I’ve realized that trying to maintain a weekly schedule can sometimes mean I’m stretching myself a little too thin.

So, beginning today, The Dad & Daughter Connection will be moving from a weekly podcast to an every-other-week schedule.

Now, I want to be very clear: this isn’t about slowing down or giving you less. In fact, it’s about making sure I can continue giving you the kind of conversations and content you’ve come to expect from this podcast.

I want to have the time to find great guests, ask thoughtful questions, have meaningful conversations, and produce episodes that are worth your time. And just as importantly, I want to make sure I’m protecting time for the people who matter most to me—my family.

Because if I’m going to spend my time talking about the importance of being present for our daughters, I need to make sure I’m practicing what I preach.

So, you’re still going to hear the stories, the conversations, the laughs, and hopefully a few things that make you think differently about being a dad and raising strong, confident, independent daughters. You’ll just hear them every other week instead of every week.

I hope you’ll stick with me for the journey. And if you’ve been listening all along, thank you. I truly appreciate you being part of The Dad & Daughter Connection community.

Until next time, keep connecting with your daughters, keep having those important conversations, and most importantly, keep showing up.

Empowering Daughters: Alan Mallory on Guiding with Adventure and Trust

August 3, 2026 by dadofdivas

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This week on The Dad and Daughter Connection, Dr. Christopher Lewis welcomed adventurer and performance coach Alan Mallory for an inspiring conversation on what it means to truly connect with your daughters. If you’re a dad seeking real-world advice, heartfelt stories, and strategies to build stronger family ties, this episode is a must-listen.

One of the most impactful themes that emerged is the importance of quality time and shared adventures. Alan Mallory talked passionately about how he’s embraced experiences with his two daughters, from spontaneous ski trips to months traveling across the country in a fifth wheel trailer. These journeys provided special opportunities, not just for fun, but for deep conversations and growth. “When it’s just the two of us, you can connect on a deeper level,” he shared, highlighting the magic of one-on-one time.

But beyond the adventures, Alan Mallory emphasized the vital balance between guidance and independence. He champions a parenting style rooted in mentorship rather than control: “You can’t dictate the direction… you have to give them that latitude”. This philosophy was shaped by his own experiences, like summiting Mount Everest alongside his family—and by seeing how trust and empowerment forge the strongest bonds.

Another powerful thread: fostering communication and emotional growth. Mallory admitted to struggling at times, especially when it comes to connecting on the emotional level, teaching us all that vulnerability makes for better dads: “I could probably think of a few times where I should have been more empathetic… and just listened”. It’s a message that resonates—sometimes the greatest gift we can offer is our presence and our ears.

For dads supporting daughters’ passions or mental health journeys, this episode is rich with wisdom: encourage experimentation, be the gentle guide, and above all, show up—time is fleeting, and investing those hours pays lifelong dividends.

The Dad and Daughter Connection is a source of community and inspiration for fathers everywhere. Whether you’re seeking reassurance or a nudge to start a new adventure, tune in—this conversation with Alan Mallory will remind you that being a great dad is about being present, facing the adventures together, and empowering your daughter to blaze her own trail.

Ready to strengthen your bond? Listen to the episode now and start building those lasting connections!

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to talk about, but also work on those relationships that we want to build with our own daughters one step at a time.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:04]:
And I’m so excited that you come back every week because we’re all on a journey. We’re all on a journey of trying to be the best dads that we want to be and the best dads that we can be. But to get there, we’ve got to put in the time. We got to put in the effort. We got to learn from other dads around us and see what they’re doing, see what makes sense and what works for them. But maybe, maybe that will work for you as well, and that’s why this podcast exists. This podcast exists to help you to be able to connect with other dads, but also to learn from some other dads that have different experiences. And I love being able to bring you different people with different experiences every week that can do just that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:39]:
Today we got another great guest. Alan Mallory is with us. And Alan is a dynamic speaker. He’s an author, he is a performance coach. But I saw him at a recent conference, and he was really talking about some of the things that he’s done in his life to push himself beyond who he thought he was and who he thought he could be. He. In his presentations, he gives kind of a unique blend of psychology, engineering, project management, and some artistic flair to be able to make the presentations really a dynamic one. And in the conversation that he gave to the Rotary group that I was with, I loved the message that he gave because he really rooted his messages in his experiences, both as an adventurer, a mountaineer, but really talking about the things that he’s done with his family, to be able to keep them, to bring them together and seeing that he is a father.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:33]:
Of two daughters. I wanted to bring him on to talk a little bit about his own experience in being a father to daughters. So, Alan, thanks so much for being here today.

Alan Mallory [00:02:41]:
My pleasure. Looking forward to it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:42]:
Well, I’m really looking forward to talking to you today. And as I said, even before we started, I said this is kind of a topic that’s a little bit different than ones that probably you talk about all the time. And I always start the interviews with an opportunity because I know that you have two daughters yourself, 12 and 8. And all of us as fathers want to create those moments, those meaningful moments, those things that we can share with our daughters that they’ll remember but also will remember and that bring us closer together. What’s one’s, what’s, what is the most meaningful moment that you’ve been able to share with your daughters and what made it so special?

Alan Mallory [00:03:15]:
I don’t know if I could boil it down to one meaningful moment, but I mean, I’ve kind of emulated what my father did with me and my siblings and that spend a lot of quality time, especially out doing adventures with. With my kids. And so in many ways, I’m kind of blessed in the vocation I’ve chosen. I because I’m traveling all over the place, often I’ bring one of my kids along and both my daughters always spent some amazing quality time. Even this past winter, different ski trips, for example, where it’s just kind of a dad daughter ski trip, or when I have events in Hawaii or in kind of tropical locations, often they put their heads up to come along with those. And I found those particularly special when it’s just the two of us and you can kind of connect on a deeper level and just have fun as well. It’s not a chore if you’re doing things that you would normally like to do anyway and that they’ll like to do. And so we go kayaking or stand up paddleboarding or do some sort of adventure.

Alan Mallory [00:04:11]:
And I found those are the most special moments.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:14]:
Now your daughters are getting older and you’ve got that daughter that’s a pre tween now and another daughter following not too far behind. And as they get older, they definitely push to get more independence. How do you balance guiding your daughters while still giving them that independence that they need to be able to grow into the people that they’re bec.

Alan Mallory [00:04:34]:
Yeah, I mean, that’s the balance that’s hard to strike. And we, all of us, that are parents really go through that. One of my programs I share kind of A curve between. It’s a parabolic relationship in that you have a mentor role that you want to kind of nudge your daughters in the right direction or what you believe is the right direction, but you can’t dictate that direction. And that’s what’s almost makes the parenting journey such a roller coaster. They’re their own people and sometimes they make. They need to learn through decisions that are made. And, you know, that’s how we learn.

Alan Mallory [00:05:03]:
If we kind of prevent them from discovering and innovating and all of that, then they just end up with bigger problems down the road. And so it’s through small. Allowing them the independence to make small mistakes in many ways, while providing that father mentor role that I think allows them to develop healthily. And it’s a difficult balance to get. And I would say in many ways it’s a balance that our society has really gone one way on. And that’s this kind of, you know, over controlling, bubble wrapping our children rather than allowing them to make mistakes in life, for example. But if you want them to be strong, independent people, you have to give them that latitude. I’d say that’s another thing that I learned from my father, for good or bad.

Alan Mallory [00:05:46]:
You know, he was always a very empowering person. We climbed Mount Everest in 2008, and this was with my father, brother, sister and I. And so also I was kind of learning from how he treated all of us, especially my sister in this case. There was one instance where basically we were in the death zone above 26,000ft. And he empowered her to kind of make her own decision, whether she wanted to continue on or not. And she was all by herself at that point because she had the altitude weakens your immune system. And so she had these awful sicknesses and she had actually internal bleeding, it was so bad. And.

Alan Mallory [00:06:18]:
But that was, you know, a difficult decision to make because obviously in a scenario like that, mistakes can be fatal, and often they are. But I think he’s always kind of had that mentality and I’ve tried to do that as well. You know, you start small so that when they’re young, allow them to make their own mistakes. You know, don’t always be there to provide. Well, I mean, you’re providing the safety rope kind of from a distance. I would say you don’t want them to get badly hurt or die, but that’s how they’re going to learn. You learn through adversity. And when we take that adversity away, which we do out of kindness in many ways, Certainly in the Western society, we’ve lived pretty, what I say, good lives.

Alan Mallory [00:06:57]:
We don’t have the same types of challenges that let’s say our ancestors had. So we try to make life more comfortable for our kids. Well, that can be detrimental because they just don’t learn. You learn through the adversity.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:11]:
Well, I’d be remiss to not push a little bit on the trip that you had on Everest. And, and I guess I’m not going to ask you to retell that story because you have some books that are specifically about that. But one of the things that I guess that I am interested in is having you talk a little bit about what you learned from that trip with your siblings and your f and how that experience has either helped you in being the father that you’re becoming or has made you make some pivots in how you’re fathering your kids in different ways.

Alan Mallory [00:07:45]:
Well, that was the ultimate family adventure, you might say. I mean, the stakes are very high. The need for healthy relationships is extreme because otherwise, 70 plus percent of the teens while we were there, they tore themselves apart from the inside out. And at that point it’s everyone on their own and they have to just pack up and head home. And so being able to resolve conflicts effectively and quickly and say what needs to be said, even though it might inevitably result in a conflict, I think that’s a big problem in a lot of families and father daughter relationships that in order to maintain the harmony in the here and now, you just don’t say what needs to be said. It might cause someone to get upset. Well, the problem is these issues, they bottle up within people over time. And so every one of those said, what would you call them, items in order to preserve the relationship in the here and now, it just compounds and eventually it explodes.

Alan Mallory [00:08:44]:
And that’s what tears apart family familial relationships. Now that’s obviously true in spousal relationships. We see that all the time. But there’s plenty of daughters that don’t hardly talk to their fathers when they get married and they move off. And I see that all the time. And I want to, you know, I don’t want that to be reality in my life. No, there’s lots of, of factors you can’t control. But again, I would say maybe I’m giving my dad too many kudos.

Alan Mallory [00:09:08]:
But when I look at his friend groups and so on and there’s just lots of broken family relationships and he doesn’t sugarcoat things, but more than anything, he just makes sure he creates time for doing things with his siblings. He still does. I mean, he’s in his 70s now and I can kind of see in his eyes how much he really appreciates that, that his kids, they keep coming back. I mean, they kind of want to spend time with him and my mother as well. So I would love to able to create the same type of environment where your kids really want to still enjoy spending time with you. And part of the secret to that is get them involved young in things that you also are going to be interested in doing throughout your life now. So it’s kind of a privilege. We all enjoy swimming and biking and mountain biking and kayaking and things like that.

Alan Mallory [00:09:56]:
And so it’s not so much of chore when we’re trying to get together. And I think if I can preserve that, if you aren’t taking an active role when they’re young, and I know some of our family friends, that this is exactly what happened. I mean, the kids kind of go a different direction. The parents are into hiking, the kids are into skateboarding, something like that. Now it’s really tough. And I see in those family relationships how they can hardly get together for Christmas dinner. There’s just no shared interests anymore. And certainly that tears the family apart, but certainly makes it a suboptimal situation to be in as you age.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:29]:
So how are you incorporating that mentality, that mantra into what you’re doing with your daughters?

Alan Mallory [00:10:36]:
If I’ve maybe taken it to the extreme, you might say in terms of the different adventures, but again, it’s kind of a. It dovetails well into the, the work I’m already doing because I’m traveling around. But we lived, for example, for a year on a fifth wheel trailer traveling around the. The southern United States. And every two days or so we were in some new amazing national park, state park. It was during COVID and so the kids were already doing online school. And so in the morning we would do schooling and then in the afternoon we’d be out biking and hiking and swimming and depending where we were. That was just an incredible trip.

Alan Mallory [00:11:15]:
I almost wanted to just stay on the rig and do a whole nother loop. It was so amazing. But those types of things, I mean, whether you like it or not, you’re in close proximity in those in a fifth wheel trailer, for example. So yeah. And then whenever I can, especially the skiing, they’ve really taken to skiing. Both my daughters are just amazing, amazing skiers. And, and it happened quickly too. My eldest, I take her to Whistler and she goes Right down the double black diamonds through the trees and you know, my heart’s skipping a few beats, but again, I tried it.

Alan Mallory [00:11:46]:
Well, she’s got to learn her own limits here. I don’t want her flying off a cliff and perishing. So I’ll kind of be in watching things, but let her own. Make her own decisions. And I remember when we were there, thinking, it was only a couple years ago when I was taking her down the bunny hill at our local ski resort, going behind her to make sure she didn’t kind of get out of control. But I think, did I teach them skiing? I mean, kind of the basics. But more than anything, I just gave them the latitude and the opportunity to figure out where their limits were and develop the skills themselves with a little bit of guidance here and then there when they wanted it. And so that’s just wonderful going on those ski trips now.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:29]:
None of us are infallible. We’re humans. We make mistakes. What’s a mistake that you’ve made as a father and what did you learn from it about fostering better communication with your daughters?

Alan Mallory [00:12:41]:
What is a mistake? Well, I’m probably always making mistakes of some sort. I probably don’t connect well on the emotional side as well as I should. I’m still a guy. I don’t necessarily understand kind of the emotions and things, especially at that. The age when they’re kind of going through puberty and so on. And so probably I could be better at just listening at times. I’m an engineer as well, and so I kind of like, like engineering our way out of these problems. But when there’s, you know, those emotional challenges that we all go through.

Alan Mallory [00:13:14]:
Yeah, I could probably think of a few times where I thought, well, maybe I should have been a little more empathetic to that and just listened and really tried to see things from. From their perspective.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:24]:
That’s definitely something that you have to do. I’ve heard that numerous times from numerous fathers and others about doing more listening than talking at times and. And being able to not come in trying to answer the question or to solve a problem, but let your daughter do what she can to be able to guide, whether it is either a solving conversation or a listening conversation. And that’s something that I wish that I had learned earlier than not.

Alan Mallory [00:13:52]:
Yeah, no, it’s interesting in some of my psychological background, you know, I remember reading this same type of thing over and over again when it comes to psychotherapy. You know, half the time the therapist is not really saying anything. You’re just kind of there nodding, allowing the other individual to kind of work true in their own mind, in their own life. And surprisingly, that has just tremendous benefit. You just, you kind of need to be this sounding board that the individual can’t do it on their own. They need someone there that’s almost doing, you know, it’s doing very little than listening, but it’s tremendously beneficial. So the engineer in me says that makes no sense at all. But having just read about it again and again now, I realize as humans, you know, the human mind is not something that can be reverse engineered very well.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:41]:
And speaking about your background in psychology and now trying to raise kids and raise daughters, talk to me about that. And the juxtaposition between having the understanding of how the mind works but also being able to be the father and being able to be there for your kids in different ways and not bringing too much psychology into it at the same time.

Alan Mallory [00:15:06]:
I went the psychological direction because I had my own mental health challenges in my younger years. I had quite a severe social phobia, an anxiety disorder, generalized anxiety disorder. And so because I’m an engineer by trade, which is the polar opposite of psychology, but I started studying the human mind as I was trying to work through my own challenges. And I think what got me more and more interested in it is it started to work. I developed these different cognitive strategies that would allow me to quickly bring down elevated baseline stress levels, for example. And you know, I’d play a lot of these mental games that I would read about and, and kind of develop for my own purposes that would change my emotional responses in the here and now. And so now there’s a genetic element to the predisposition to these types of mental health challenges. And I kind of see some of them in my daughters, for example.

Alan Mallory [00:15:57]:
And so I do want to be proactive in providing them the tools that are needed. Now I’m careful to even say that, that there’s a genetic element because so many people just, it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy for them. You know, my father had this, my mot had this, my grandmother had this. I guess it’s inevitable. I will. And I was actually told that many, many times by the different medical professionals that I thought saw my younger years throughout that journey. Basically you have this chemical imbalance that’s leading to this. And almost all the time they just suggested medication.

Alan Mallory [00:16:28]:
And now I don’t want to be too negative on medication because it obviously has a place, you know, when people are really at low points, sometimes anything that will help is the way to go. But I saw it as something that would kind of hide my symptoms rather than get at the root causes. So I never went down the medical pat. I developed cognitive strategies that would work. And I’ve tried to kind of, you know, when I’ve seen my daughters having, you know, who knows if they’re. I think every kind of preteen has that type of thing. They have to develop their own strategies. So I.

Alan Mallory [00:16:59]:
I’m not saying necessarily are they going to be more predisposed than others to this type of thing, but I also just kind of notice when I was going through a mental health journey, you become hyper sensitized to, you know, noticing little twitches and things like that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:14]:
Right.

Alan Mallory [00:17:15]:
Because I’m always so concerned about it in myself, or was at the time. So I’ve kind of tried to share those strategies that I’ve developed. Now. I wouldn’t say I’ve shared them very effectively, or at least they haven’t been adopted. And part of it is because I’m, I guess, the dad. You know, often they’re like, oh, dad, maybe that’ll work for you. But this is a different era and I can kind of relate to that because that’s exactly what I said to most people who tried to share strategies with me, including the different psychologists I saw. Oh, yeah, I mean, yeah, it’s easy for you to say that.

Alan Mallory [00:17:47]:
You’re not living through this. And so I would mostly brush off the different things they were trying to tell me. And there was always a bit of truth in each one of them. And I really listened. I didn’t really discover some of those, well, let’s call them things that really helped in my life until I kept reading from people that were going through the same challenges that I’d gone through. And. And we’re able to finally figure it out. And it was a combination of self education, learning how your mind works, but also kind of voluntary exposure therapy, and not getting out of your mind, stop fighting yourself, because it’s a response to those symptoms, really, and the way that leads to this rumination that holds us, that perpetuates the disorder.

Alan Mallory [00:18:31]:
So when I try to share those types of strategies, I have to be careful, mindful of how I do it. And if I’m really kind of rushed in my own work, it’s not effective. I think it’s going to be through many years of just kind of, you know, providing little tools here and there. And this is what you should try, maybe give this a try. It worked in my life. And so hopefully I’m able to, you know, just provide what they need and maybe they won’t. Sometimes this is just a natural stage of growing.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:00]:
And speaking of the mental health issues that you were dealing with yourself, how do you talk to your own daughters about that experience in relation to building that connection with them?

Alan Mallory [00:19:11]:
Well, in many ways I haven’t in a lot of detail. I’ve tried to encourage my eldest daughter to read my second book because that’s what it’s all about. She finds it too boring because it’s kind of psychological pace and she’s into, you know, romance and adventure stories and that sort of thing. So I haven’t. Wouldn’t say I have been particularly effective in kind of sharing the whole journey and all the those strategies I’ve tried at times, but there hasn’t been a lot of interest in it. It’s kind of. So I don’t know, maybe they’re still a bit too young. Maybe they won’t need those types of strategies.

Alan Mallory [00:19:44]:
I can certainly relate to how I found it frustrating to try to play the right mental movies in my mind, for example. Your mind almost fights back against it. It says, no, that’s not what you need. I mean, this is futile. I mean, I should just analyze more. Well, the constant analysis of your own symptoms certainly just makes things worse and worse.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:04]:
Worse. You’ve had your own passions, your dreams, your things that you have tried to push yourself to do through your life, and the things that you continue to do. Talk to me about how you support your daughters in pursuing their passions and dreams.

Alan Mallory [00:20:17]:
Well, it’s certainly giving them the opportunity. I guess they are still kind of discovering what their passions and dreams are. And I’ve seen that with my eldest. I would say, if anything, my wife and I are just trying to allow her to try different things because she doesn’t seem to have. Have gravitated to particular sport or dream just yet. There certainly have been things that have captured her interest. We had her learning sign language for a while. Right.

Alan Mallory [00:20:44]:
But it let things wane and as they should. I mean, that’s the whole idea. You want to just try as many things as you can and when you’re young so you can kind of see what tends to excite you, I guess, and ideally align your vocation with. With whatever that is. So got them. I play the violin and so I’ve got them in both playing the violin. And that’s just wonderful to me. And that’s was a little frustrating to me in the early years because like I was when I was a kid, I just didn’t want to do it.

Alan Mallory [00:21:10]:
I didn’t want to practice it where you know, spending the time and energy and money in many cases to pursue that. And I had to keep reminding myself, well I gotta. This really isn’t for them. Even though I’d love to be able to play with violin with my daughters, maybe they’ll go a different direction now. In recent years they seem to have taken it a lot more seriously and I think it says they’ve gotten into the different festivals and started playing some fun songs that they recognize and enjoy and so hopefully that that passion will. Will continue to grow within them. But. And we’ve tried lots of different sports too.

Alan Mallory [00:21:46]:
My parents never got me involved in organized sports and we are trying that a little bit. Like my youngest is playing soccer for example and seems to really have taken to that. I guess the challenges with some of those organized sports is it consumes your life and for a lot of the adventures and travel and so on the that that certainly my wife and I like to do. It’s tough if you’re driving every weekend to different hockey tournaments and so on and so on. Maybe plots could argue. Well, maybe there is a bit of a selfish motivator there and I don’t want to be a non stop taxi driver, but I see how it worked with my dad and he got us into running and biking and things that, you know, they were more like they’re kind of individual sports versus large group sports like that and there’s benefits in both. But they didn’t consume our life. And that can be the challenge with.

Alan Mallory [00:22:32]:
And I don’t want to sound like I’m being negative about organized sports. There’s lots of benefits and you learn camaraderie and teamwork and all of that. But I look at some of my friends and they do nothing but drive around to different sports events.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:46]:
Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our dad connection. 66 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. You ready? Sure. What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughter?

Alan Mallory [00:22:58]:
Empowering.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:59]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice you’ve ever received?

Alan Mallory [00:23:03]:
I don’t know if I’ve received very much dad advice, but probably if I had to just choose what I’ve discovered, it would be, you know, spend as much quality time with your daughters as you can before it’s too late, before they move on. Every, you know, every older father basically says the same thing. The time flew by.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:21]:
What’s one Activity that you and your daughters love doing together.

Alan Mallory [00:23:25]:
I would say skiing.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:26]:
If you could give your daughters one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Alan Mallory [00:23:31]:
Probably to align your vocation with something that really you’re passionate about.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:37]:
What’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Alan Mallory [00:23:41]:
Maybe I don’t have all the answers. I’ve still got a lot to learn.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:44]:
And what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Alan Mallory [00:23:51]:
That one’s easy. You’ve got to carve out the time. You’ve got to be doing adventures all the time. The father daughter relationships that fall apart. I think it’s dads that are just too busy with other things. And it’s a tough balance. I mean, you’ve got to also make a living, provide for your family in all of that. But you can’t go back.

Alan Mallory [00:24:10]:
Once the time is gone and you haven’t invested those important hours and days in the relationship. Then was it all worth it? I mean, there’s so many people that have regrets when they get older.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:24]:
So now, Alan, I know you’ve got a lot of things going on. If people want to find out more about you and your books and everything else that you’re doing, where should they go?

Alan Mallory [00:24:34]:
Well, my website’s pretty comprehensive. It’s just Alan Mallory.com a L a N and have a YouTube channel. And I put various videos on there. My electric violin and my different adventures and so on. And yeah, those are probably the. The two places to start.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:48]:
And I will tell you, check out his electric violin. He is an amazing electric violin player. And I was really impressed. I didn’t even know that he was playing at the event that I was playing. And then I looked up and I’m like, oh, this is Alan playing. And it was great. So I really encourage you to check out all of that. We’ll put some links in the notes today.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:08]:
And Alan, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for sharing some of your journey today. I look forward to hearing more about the adventures not only that you have, but the adventures that you’re having with your kids and being able to live a little vicariously through what you’re doing. And I just want to say thank you and I wish you all the best.

Alan Mallory [00:25:25]:
My pleasure. Thank you.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:26]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to be build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect. It’s about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes@dadanddaughterconnection.com until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Alan Mallory [00:25:57]:
We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers? We spend the time, we give the lessons, we make the meals, we buy them presents and bring your A game? Cause those kids are growing fast? The time goes by just like a dynamite blast? Calling astronauts and firemen, Carpenters and muscle men? Get out and be the world to them? Be the best dad you can be? Be the best dad you can.

Jared Mees on Fatherhood, Vulnerability, and Connection

July 27, 2026 by dadofdivas

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If you’re a dad searching for practical wisdom and heartfelt inspiration on building stronger connections with your daughter, you won’t want to miss the latest episode of the Dad and Daughter Connection podcast. Host Dr. Christopher Lewis sits down with Jared Mees, father, creative, and co-founder of Tender Loving Empire, for a candid conversation about the joys, challenges, and real-life lessons of fatherhood.

This episode dives deep into what meaningful connection really looks like between dads and daughters. Jared Mees shares his biggest bonding moments, like the summer road trips he’s taken with his daughters since they were little—unstructured adventures that have become cherished family memories. Whether braving uncomfortable camping trips or hours on the road, these simple, unplugged experiences spark genuine connection, laughter, and character-building for all.

As daughters grow up, the balancing act for dads shifts. Jared Mees opens up about learning to give his daughters independence as they get older—recognizing when to lean in, when to back off, and how to be present even when they aren’t seeking attention. For his younger daughter, it’s about reading and drawing together. For his teen, it’s understanding late-night chats and respecting her space.

One of the most powerful parts of the episode centers on vulnerability. Jared Mees shares honestly about a mental health crisis he faced and how it affected his family. Learning to admit mistakes, say “Daddy was wrong,” and seek real support reshaped his relationship with his daughters. His openness models strength and resilience—and shows that kids benefit deeply from witnessing their parents’ growth and recovery.

Other themes include the importance of encouraging kids’ passions without taking over, calling out the specific things that make them unique, and navigating the emotional transitions as daughters become teens. Dr. Christopher Lewis and Jared Mees also discuss letting go of ego, embracing imperfection, and being consistent in small, everyday ways.

If you’re ready to hear authentic stories and actionable advice about being the dad your daughter needs—through life’s ups, downs, and transitions—be sure to tune in. Head to dadanddaughterconnection.com, catch the latest episode, and start building those lifelong bonds, one day at a time.

Don’t miss this uplifting and honest look at fatherhood—listen now!

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to work together, to work on identifying ways in which we can build those relationships that we want to have with our daughters one day at a time. It is going to be a journey.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:09]:
Having those perfect relationships is going to come in ebbs and flows. It’s not always going to be easy, but there are things that you can do to make it a little bit better one day at a time. And that’s why this show exists. This show exists to be able to give you some tools for your toolbox, for you to be able to learn, to grow and to be able to be that dad that you want to be showing up for your daughter every day. That’s why every week, I love being able to bring you different dance with different experiences to help you to be able to see fatherhood in a little bit of a different way and to be able to see how they are fathering their own daughters, to be able to help you in your journey. Today we got another great guest. Jared Mees is with us today, and Jared is someone I’ve known for a number of years. Jared was on another podcast that I used to have called Dads with Daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:01]:
And at that time, it was about four years ago, we were chatting about some music that he was making with his daughters, and his daughters keep growing as they always do. So I’m excited to be able to have him back, to be able to talk about how things are going today and be able to check back in. Jared, thanks so much for being here today.

Jared Mees [00:02:20]:
Thanks so much, Chris. Appreciate it. Excited to be here.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:23]:
Well, I’m really excited to have you here today, and I always loved starting the conversation because this show is all about connection and how you build those meaningful connections with your daughters. And I. I know you have two daughters yourself. What would you say is one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share with your daughters thus far and what made it so special?

Jared Mees [00:02:41]:
Yeah, I have two lovely daughters. Piper is 8 and she’s almost 9. And July is 14 going on 24. So we’re. I’m super blessed to have them in my life. And I always thought I’d be a dad of a son or something before I had kids. But then, now that I have two daughters, I wouldn’t have it any other way. Of course, they’re definitely lights of my life.

Jared Mees [00:03:03]:
They’re both totally individual, different human beings, and they both need completely different things. And I try to provide it every day, whether I feel like it or not. And, you know, some days I succeed better than others, as we all do. But I would say, to answer your question, the biggest things that we do together are these road trips that we take every summer. Ever since COVID when Piper was two or three, two and a half, and July was eight, we’ve taken summer road trips to my hometown in Colorado from Oregon, where I live. So just driving around with them and exploring, mostly the western United States and just seeing things, camping. A lot of the. The funnest times are just when there’s no real plan and we just get into something.

Jared Mees [00:03:53]:
We’re on the beach or we’re having a conversation around a fire, or just all the little things that happen along the way. But the road tr. Definitely, we’ve taken one every summer since 2020, and they’re definitely a way to connect. And when I look back, I’m like, those are precious times. And, you know, they can be challenging. And sometimes the challenges, when you’re away from your home and you’re uncomfortable, you know, camping, they think they don’t like camping, but every time we go camping, they have a great time. They can be, you know, character building. And so I remember those fondly.

Jared Mees [00:04:29]:
We’re going on one this summer. This summer is going to be easy going. We’re just going to go down the Oregon coast.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:34]:
Those moments are so important, and they’re going to be things that your daughters are going to think back on, remember fondly as they get older. Whether it’s the. The fun times or the squabbles in the car, the moments where you pull off the road to be able to see something cool, you know, it’s going to be those memories that they’re going to relate to. So it’s. It’s so exciting to hear those things. Now, I know you said your daughters are getting older and, and as your daughters do get older, as all of us that have daughters get older, there is the struggle that we go through as dads, which is allowing for us to be able to help our daughters to find that balance, that balance in having independence while still being who they are. How do you balance guiding your daughter while also giving her the independence to grow into her own person?

Jared Mees [00:05:26]:
That’s a great question. And I don’t know that I really think about it as it’s happening, but there’s a lot of connection that I feel like I try to foster every day that just kind of lets them know that I’m there and that I’m around and present for them. I try to be there every day when they get home from school, there when they leave for school. And I think just the presence allows me to be just plugged into what they’re going through on a hour to hour, day to day, week to week basis that I don’t know, there’s. That ends up. It makes it where I don’t really get in their way so much. I would say we have a lot of things going on and so trying to just make space for the small things that they want to do. Like my 8 year old wants to play and you know, you don’t always want to play, but you get down on the floor with them for 20 minutes and it means the world to them.

Jared Mees [00:06:20]:
And then my 14 year old wants space. And so sometimes that’s just like coming in, saying hi and being like, I love you, what are you up to? And then if they don’t want to talk, then just letting them have that moment and then eventually they come around and they want to talk. I noticed that my 14 year old really gets talkative right before bed and right before she goes to sleep, which is kind of like the time you want them to be winding down. And so just being around for the moments that they want you and then being okay when they don’t want you. And I think that’s where I’m not like starved for attention myself. Keeping myself really trying to be my own best friend where I’m not like trying to just go get attention from them keeps me from like being too hovery. That makes sense.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:05]:
It does make sense. And I think each of us has to find that balance for ourselves and, and also allow for our kids to be able to have that space that they need to be able to be who they are. And that becomes hard as they are transitioning, especially transitioning from that phase where they Always want to be around you to that phase where they’re like, nope, I need my space, I need to be away and I close my door, whatever it may be. But yeah, I completely get it. And I remember times where I’ve gone through that myself. As you think about your daughters and what you’ve done to be able to really work on that bond with them, what are some intentional ways you think that you’ve worked to strengthen your bond with your daughters even through challenging times?

Jared Mees [00:07:50]:
Well, I think that I have a. We’ve got things that we focus on together on a day to day basis. My 8 year old is learning to read and so reading with her every day, it’s very basic. But reading, drawing, making art, it’s just day to day easygoing stuff that doesn’t feel like, oh, I’m building a bond with my daughter. But over time it kind of builds this repetition of like, this is what we do together and kind of gives them confidence in that they can, they’re developing skills and you’re watching them develop skills and encouraging them to be better while like really noting the improvement that they’ve made or noting something specific. Even if you don’t, you know, have the time to like look at like something small that they’ve made that they’re excited about, you can like, I always have the time to just be like, oh, that’s cool. I like this thing. And I think that’s like, I like this specific drawing of this the way that you did the cat’s whiskers or something versus just like, oh, that’s nice honey.

Jared Mees [00:08:52]:
And so I’ve really tried to like, because I don’t have all the time to sit down and praise them for everything they do, but there is an element of just calling out specifics of something that they’ve done that makes them feel seen. And that’s specifically my 8 year old. But you know, with my 14 year old I do it as well. And so I think that builds like the bond of like, I’m seen, I’m, I’m noted, I’m known. Even if it’s not a big time investment, just like calling out specifics of something that they’re doing. So that’s just like a little thing I do. I think I learned that from a book too. That said, even if you don’t have time, just noting a specific will make the connection for the kid that you are listening.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:34]:
Let me dig a little bit more on that because you know, showing them that they’re seen is important and I think One of the other things that I’ve noticed is that it’s so important with daughters to be able to let them know that they are both valued and heard. How do you show your daughters that they’re valued and heard?

Jared Mees [00:09:52]:
Well, my daughters are pretty loud and gregarious and like, in your face. And so it’s like, they are definitely heard all the time. I think it comes down to, like, important moments where they’re trying to say. It’s really like during moments of friction. That is probably where it really becomes like, am I being heard or not? Because we listen to them all the time talk about whatever they’re talking about. But it’s like there’s the moments where they need something specific or like, I didn’t. I don’t think that you did this. That you vacuumed even though I asked you to vacuum is like, I did vacuum.

Jared Mees [00:10:29]:
Well, you need to vacuum better. Let me show you how to do it. It’s like, I already know how to do it. You already showed me. And it was like, well, then why didn’t you do it correctly? And like, there’s these moments of altercation that stepping back and not allowing the heat of the moment to get in the way of. Of what they’re trying to tell you. You know, even if they, you think, you know, they did a bad job vacuuming, hearing out that they think that they did a good job and that they’re, you know, they did try and like, acknowledging that while then continuing to offer the input of how to do it better, I think is. Those are like the difficult moments, I think is really where you have to focus on making sure that they’re heard while also not letting them off the hook.

Jared Mees [00:11:16]:
Because I think it’s important to instill that kids know quality is necessary for them to be like a fully fleshed human. They’re going to have to be able to do things in a quality manner. But I don’t know if that makes sense. But it’s ultimately during moments of altercation or friction, allowing some space for them to say what they need to say while also not backing down from the truth that you’re trying to get across. And that can be a fine line. That can be difficult. I think as a man, it’s easy to get angry in those moments. And so you really have to keep your eye on what you want to get accomplished in the conversation versus being right or not being talked to in a sass with sass or anything.

Jared Mees [00:11:58]:
It’s like allowing what they need to say to get said, but Then knowing that the end of it, it’s going to be a. There’s going to be the. Some sort of, like, lesson is going to get taught, and you’re going to feel okay about it. I feel like dads and feel like they need to be heard, too, you know, because I live in a family with three women, and so it’s easy to, like, just have it be a lot of alternating energies and a lot of talking about disparate subjects. And, you know, you can kind of get lost in that sometimes. So it’s important to feel like you’re heard as well, you know, in those

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:31]:
moments that are challenging. I know that there are times as fathers where we’re not going to make all the right choices. We’re going to make mistakes along the way. There’s going to be errors of judgment. What’s a mistake that you made as a father, and what did you learn from it about fostering a positive connection with your daughters?

Jared Mees [00:12:51]:
Oh, I don’t think I’ve ever made a mistake. No, it’s. There’s mistakes, you know, get made all the time. And I think that the one thing that I’ve. I’ve learned to say is. And this, like, somehow fixes it all the time is just saying daddy was wrong and just saying it plainly and quickly. And it really does just, like, help the whole thing. And you have to swallow your pride a little bit to say it, but once it’s out of your mouth, everything is like, all the tension goes down.

Jared Mees [00:13:21]:
Once you’ve made a mistake, you say, daddy was wrong. And it’s generally the mistakes I make are in, like I said before, probably letting my anger or, like, my agitation get the better of me in a specific situation because I have a certain set of emotions going on that my kids are not privy to. And I decide to snap at one thing and say, oh, you didn’t do this or you didn’t do that. You didn’t do the thing I asked. And then they say, no, we did. And then I’ve just spent all this time yammering on and getting upset about something that I was just wrong about. And so those are the moments, like, think of growth for me really is like, just saying daddy was wrong. And I think it’s hard for men to admit they’re wrong, but it just feels good once you say it, because it just lets the pressure off.

Jared Mees [00:14:13]:
Like, we don’t always have to be right or get it right, but it feels good to kids to, like, understand that, you know, you’re a human who makes mistakes. And I think trying to hold up some sort of standard, gold standard where you never make mistakes or you’re never wrong or even the illusion of that is just too much pressure on a human. And so it’s kind of nice to, to be able to just admit that and admit it up front and quickly. And it just lets a lot of the air out of things. It’s like we think sometimes that if we say we’re wrong that like our life’s going to end or that we’re going to be less of a man or just there’s some worthiness factor that’s going to enter, but you know, that’s just a lie. And so just quickly copying to things that you’re wrong about is really helpful.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:00]:
Definitely. And I know that there’s plenty of times where I think being vulnerable will definitely open things up and allow your daughters to be able to see not only you in a different way, but see relationships in a different way and allow for them to feel differently about the way in which they kind of maneuver through life. So I know that you’ve done a lot of really cool things with your, your daughters and pushing them and encouraging them. You have your own passions and dreams. You have a lot of things with music that going on. You’ve done music with your, with your daughters along the way. Talk to me what you have done over your daughter’s lifetimes to be able to support them in pursuing their passions and dreams.

Jared Mees [00:15:41]:
Yeah, I mean, both my kids dance. They’re really into dance and acting. So it’s, it’s a lot of just driving to and from you. Just the work a day, driving, being in the car, taking them to the thing they want to do. And it’s. You don’t always want to do it. But the barometer I use is like, they’re happier when I pick them up than when I drop them off. And that is worth doing it.

Jared Mees [00:16:03]:
And like, I say that to myself and I say it to other people like, oh man, it’s so much work doing this driving for dance. But it’s like the happiness that you see on their faces when you pick them up from the thing they got to do, that you got to provide the money and time and effort and the car and the gas, et cetera. It’s worth it when you see that they are happier and consistently happier and like, that’s what ultimately makes a happy life. And then also, I don’t know, my 8 year old’s working on a play. She really wants to write a play and so she can’t really type or know how to like format a script or anything, but she knows exactly what she wants the play to be about and she has all these big creative dreams. So like we recently got her play from like in her head to. On a first draft and then we went through it and made it better and better and my 14 year old got involved and so she’s gonna be. We got it all printed out recently and we have.

Jared Mees [00:17:02]:
She had, they had picked the kids, they want to be in the play. And so my 8 year old is going to be directing it and my 14 year old is producing it and we’re going to put it on at the warehouse that we have and just kind of staying out of it and letting them. My 14 year old has a phone now, so she’s texting all the parents to get all the kids to show up for the rehearsals and you know, they’re working on all the costumes and stuff. So just like helping out with stuff like that and being involved while also not like taking it on as like my own project and kind of like letting it be whatever quality it’s going to be, it’s been fun. It’s like in a lot of times I would have jumped in and like made it this super extra over the top thing, but then it kind of becomes my project. It’s nice to sit back and have it be completely theirs. But providing the tech expertise to get things printed and to like share numbers with peop, you know, kind of the executive producer role, I suppose.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:01]:
You know, one of the things that I know that we talked about at the very beginning was that over the last couple of years you had a bit of a scare, you had a bit of a mental health issue that you were dealing with and you had to maneuver through that period, that period in your life with your kids. Can you talk to me about that? And some of the things that you had to do to be able to not only get yourself in a good place, but also to help your children to understand what was going on and help them to better maneuver through that time.

Jared Mees [00:18:35]:
Yeah, you know, I’m an open book about it, but I, I had a mental health issue basically. Like they used to call them nervous breakdowns, but it’s basically a mental health event where I was not really able to function in the capacity that I normally could function because my nervous system basically was shutting down. And so for about three months I was not really the person that, that I normally was. And while I was recovering and this was a Period of basically getting clean and getting sober. I wasn’t a huge alcoholic or anything, but I definitely, I smoked weed every day for 15 years just to deal with my anxiety issue. And so I, when I stopped doing that because I wanted to have a different modality for dealing with my anxiety, there was a transitional period basically brought on a long term anxiety attack slash nervous breakdown. So the transition to getting clean really was difficult. And you know, with my 14 year old I was able to discuss it a little bit because she knew that I smoked weed and we live in Oregon and it’s a very accepted thing but it was, you know, something I had to tell her.

Jared Mees [00:19:46]:
Like I’m doing this to get better, worse. But in the meantime it’s really difficult for me to just deal with things I normally deal with. Noise was a big problem, really difficult to deal with noise for like nine or 10 weeks. And so just being in a house in a normal volume house was really difficult. And so I was like, I had to just explain that I was going through a difficult time. And they’ve gone through difficult times. They go through difficult times every day, every week. And so they understand difficult times but they didn’t understand, I think that I had to go through a difficult time and they didn’t understand why it was taking so long.

Jared Mees [00:20:24]:
And so I was just having, just having to explain the nature of what I was going through in a way, way that they could understand. It was difficult. It wasn’t easy to. Because you can’t really get too clinical and detailed because they kind of tune out. So it was really just about like I just need things to be simple and you know, I’m getting sick in my brain a little bit but my brain’s gonna get better. That’s kind of what we had to tell our 8 year old. And then my 14 year old, I was a little more upfront with her about the, the way things were working in reality. But by and large they were the North Star in the end of it all.

Jared Mees [00:21:01]:
You know, I was doing this for them to be better, not worse. And I feel like I’m definitely a better dad today than I was. I wasn’t bad before, but it was like I’m a better, I’m more confident person and I like myself better. And I think that shines through to the way I parent now. So it’s been a positive thing for them overall. But the transitional period, it was sad. It was difficult for me to try to note. I couldn’t give them what I normally give them.

Jared Mees [00:21:30]:
And you Know, but knowing that it was the best I could do at that moment and allowing that to be okay, that was what I had to focus on, that this was okay and I wasn’t messing them up. And for them to see someone go through something hard and to be better, because they really noted, oh, you’re better. I just noticed we’re doing all sorts of loud stuff and you don’t have any problem with it. And, like, that was really awesome when that came around for them. And they just, like, noticed that I had gone through something at hard and how I dealt with it. And I don’t know, maybe they’ll remember it. They’ll probably remember it as they grow up, but I don’t think there was hardly any moments that were, like, traumatic. There was a few times where I yelled because I was just, like, overwhelmed by my own emotions and the noise.

Jared Mees [00:22:12]:
And like, those were the times that kind of, like, necessitated conversations afterwards. But I don’t think it was. They were pretty quick and dealt with. And I have a support. My wife was super supportive and my extended family was super supportive. My friends were super supportive. So it was. I was able to get away when I needed to get away and deal with my own stuff, away from the audience of my family when that.

Jared Mees [00:22:39]:
When that needed to happen. So I really am thankful to them for, you know, being the North Star and being the guiding light for, like, this is why I’m doing this and why I’m going through this difficult thing. It’s not just for me. It’s for me first and for them second. But definitely they were, like, a huge important thing for getting me through it. I don’t know. I could talk about this for, like, hours and have. Obviously.

Jared Mees [00:23:00]:
But that’s Cliff Notes.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:01]:
And what would you say to other dads that may be struggling with their own mental health issues and maybe they’re not getting the support that they need at this point.

Jared Mees [00:23:10]:
Um, gosh, say like that. Really examining at the bottom of it, like, what you need and whether or not you’re getting what you need and. And knowing that every day doesn’t have to be so hard. You know, often when you’re dealing with a mental health issue, it’s because there’s something underneath it that is basically just not working. And then we string it together and jury rig our lives so that it will work, and it’s often with substances and that really just examining what is it that’s not working and taking, like, a moment and knowing that just like, admitting it doesn’t mean you have to fix it. But admitting it is definitely a first step, and then deciding what you can do to fix it incrementally, if possible. And if you can fix something incrementally with discipline and with small changes, that’s definitely, I think, a better way than trying to go cold turkey like I did, and then, like, having to fall off the rails. But, like, the body keeps the score.

Jared Mees [00:24:17]:
And eventually you will have to reckon with the thing that is not working in your life, whatever it is. And to reckon with it slowly and incrementally over time is much easier than just having it reckon with you one day and having to deal with it all at once, one day. So I would say it’s just being honest with yourself about what you need. And it really takes time. Taking time away from your family and taking time away from the stress of life and examining what it is you’re doing and why you’re doing it and what is important to you and what you want to do better and what you think you’re doing great. And like, that’s probably through a journal or some sort of, like, cataloging of your life in an organized way can be really powerful. But we often don’t take time for ourselves. As fathers, we’re kind of the ox that has to just continually pull.

Jared Mees [00:25:15]:
And we think that to take time or to not to admit that we are not strong is a failure in and of itself. And I think it’s ultimately the opposite. To, like, take time and to admit that we need help, even if it’s just to ourselves, is super powerful and actually makes us twice as strong. And I think that there’s a current in, like, men’s health that is moving that direction, that examining your problems makes you stronger, not weaker. And I’m excited for that because I really think that a lot of men suffer needlessly just because they don’t think that. They think that if they admit they need help or that they aren’t as strong as they put on, that they are, that somehow that’s going to be the end of something. And really, it’s just the end of your ego. And your ego dying or being minimized is actually a really positive thing for your.

Jared Mees [00:26:14]:
For your life, for being a father, for being a provider, for being a man. It’s like, it’s super important that that happens. It feels like the opposite in the moment, but it’s really important that that happens at some point in your life. I think.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:28]:
No, I think that was great. And I guess one of the other things that I was Thinking about is you talked earlier about the fact that your daughter is now transitioned into middle school and she’s moved into this. You know, you were dealing with your own issues. She’s now going into middle school and there’s a lot of things that happen in middle school, a lot of changes that happen in the lives of our daughters. Talk to me about that transition for you and balancing supporting her going through this, but also dealing with the changes that come with that and maybe the interplay with the mental health challenges that you were going through.

Jared Mees [00:27:02]:
Yeah, you know, as my daughter turned 13, I was kind of going through the mental health transition and I just cried and cried like a baby for God, like an hour one night. And it was just like kind of mourning the transition that like my baby was gone, my little girl was gone, and not feeling like I knew the new person that they were. And it’s not so black and white like that, but it felt very black and white at that moment and that it was like a new person had been placed where the old and the old one had been taken away. And I think it was important to have that moment of like acknowledging the transition because I think often the transitions are kind of just glossed over as we go through life and that we don’t get the moments to really acknowledge internally what’s happening for ourselves. Like, of course we have birthday parties and quinceaneras and bat mitzvahs and whatnot. But there’s gotta be an internal reckoning with the transition that’s happening so that you can then treat them in the now and be like communicating with them in the now and not have this constant mourning or sadness that it’s time has passed me by and where did my little girl go? And I think there’s a element of letting that out and acknowledging it. And that’s what these coming of age parties are supposed to be about. But I think often fathers don’t really do the emotional work to truly transition for themselves and the way, and like the way they’re thinking of their daughters.

Jared Mees [00:28:42]:
And I think it’s healthy to have some sort of internal moment with a journal or with yourself, just to like acknowledge that you tried your best for them, you did your best for them when they were little, and now they’re. You’re going to do their best for them as they’re this age and every age after that, you know, and then it’s really. Nothing has changed in terms of your commitment to the person, but it’s like your commitment to them being this and not that I think is important to them, really living in the now, in the present. This can take some pressure off, at least for me. It’s like taking some pressure off just having some sort of like internal transition moment, like emotional acknowledgement, like a ritual or something that is yours, that is specific to you and feels right to you rather than this, you know, these big outward public displays. Those are great and those are gonna happen, but it’s like, did you really get what you needed out of that? Did you really acknowledge it internally to where you can now transition with her and not just continue to think you have a three year old when you have a 13 year old and be frustrated that you don’t and feel like the time where did all the time go and feel sad. There’s so many emotions that come up that we press down, you know, that are nostalgic memories and et cetera. And it’s like those need to be acknowledged.

Jared Mees [00:30:05]:
It’s important.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:06]:
Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call Our Dad Connection 6, which are six more questions that delve deeper into you, you as a dad. Are you ready?

Jared Mees [00:30:14]:
Sure.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:14]:
What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughters?

Jared Mees [00:30:19]:
Joyful.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:19]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice that you’ve ever received?

Jared Mees [00:30:24]:
Take life one day at a time.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:26]:
What’s one activity that you and your daughters love doing together?

Jared Mees [00:30:30]:
Let’s say drawing. We all like to draw together.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:33]:
If you could give your daughters one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Jared Mees [00:30:37]:
Let’s say to love yourself and love others.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:40]:
What’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Jared Mees [00:30:45]:
Life is long and there’s lots of transitions and to take time with each period because it will soon be gone.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:54]:
And finally, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Jared Mees [00:31:02]:
I would say letting your own ego go and letting expectations you may have on yourself go and just being present with your kids as often as you can in small ways is important.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:18]:
Well, Jared, I just want to say thank you. If people want to find out more about you and what you’re doing, where should they go?

Jared Mees [00:31:24]:
They can visit tenderlovingempire.com that’s my business. I run with my wife that we sell the art of 500 different artists and we run a record label here in Portland, Oregon. And or my Instagram is just aradmeese.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:38]:
Well, again, Jared, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for being here today, for being so honest and open. About the the highs, the lows, and everything in between of fatherhood and your own journey and being a father. And I wish you all the best.

Jared Mees [00:31:54]:
Thanks so much, Chris. I appreciate you having me.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:56]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect. It’s about about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes@dadanddaughterconnection.com until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:32:27]:
We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers we spend the time, we give the lessons we make the meals we buy them presents and bring your A game Cause those kids are growing fast the time goes by just like a dynamite blast Calling astronauts and firemen Carpenters and muscle men get out and be the want you now Be the best dad you can be Be the best dad you can.

Embracing Change: Strengthening the Father-Daughter Bond as She Grows

July 13, 2026 by dadofdivas

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

In the most recent episode of the Dad and Daughter Connection podcast, host Dr. Christopher Lewis welcomes special guest Colin Gray—podcaster, international speaker, founder of The Podcast Host, and a proud father—to discuss the evolving journey of fatherhood and the unique relationship fathers share with their daughters.

This insightful conversation revolves around the central theme of connection: what it truly means to connect with your daughter as she grows, how that connection changes, and the intentional steps dads can take to foster it. Colin Gray reflects on his experience raising his now eleven-year-old daughter, candidly sharing that as children mature, simple activities like park visits or ice cream trips no longer hold the same power to bond as they once did. Instead, it’s the “little weird normal moments”—joining in on a silly dance or matching her energy in the kitchen—that create genuine connections. He urges dads to let go of preconceived expectations and instead meet their daughters where they are, embracing who they’re becoming.

Another major theme is the balance between guiding and granting independence. Colin Gray shares that encouraging his children to try things for themselves, even if it means letting them fail, has been key to building their confidence and autonomy. It’s about being there with support and constructive feedback, but resisting the urge to always be in control or solve every problem.

Intentionality shines through as a guiding principle: intentionally seeking out your daughter’s interests—even if they’re outside your comfort zone—fosters meaningful conversations and establishes trust. Whether it’s learning about makeup and hair to connect with his daughter, or simply being curious about her favorite YouTube trends, Colin Gray models engagement and the willingness to step into her world.

The conversation is honest about parental imperfection—both Dr. Christopher Lewis and Colin Gray admit to making mistakes, but emphasize the importance of being open to feedback from their kids and growing together. They highlight the value of mutual respect, adaptability, and leading by example.

This episode serves as a warm reminder that strong relationships aren’t built on grand gestures, but on consistent presence, adaptability, and listening. If you’re a dad looking for real advice, encouragement, and stories from the trenches of parenthood, don’t miss this episode. Tune in to the Dad and Daughter Connection and keep building the bond your daughter needs—one moment at a time.

Listen now and join the journey!

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to learn, to grow, to reach, work together on those relationships that we want to have with our daughters. And I say that it’s learning and growing because every day we have to learn and grow.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:06]:
We have to be willing to put ourselves out there. We have to be willing to set aside things that we think we know and go with the flow a lot of times with our daughters. And it’s important to be able to talk to other fathers, learn from other fathers, hear what they’re doing, and to gain some perspective, because we don’t have all the answers. Let’s be honest. None of us are infallible. There’s going to be times where we make mistakes, and many of us may not have a lot of examples of what fatherhood is before we become fathers. So that’s why every week, I love being able to have different people with different experiences that can offer you some different perspectives to help you in your own fatherhood journey. And today we got another great guest.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:51]:
Colin Gray is with us, and Colin is known as the podcast host. Colin and I have known each other for a while, and I’ve loved listening to him and what he’s been doing, but he’s a podcaster, he’s an international speaker, a he’s founder of the podcast host and Alitu the podcast maker. But he started out in astrophysics before realizing how much math you had to do. So that being said, he turned to podcasting, and he has made a amazing, amazing life for himself and his family. And we’ll talk a little bit about the journey that he’s gone on, but also we’re going to be talking about his own journey in his journey as a father to two kids and especially his oldest, his daughter. And I’m really excited to have him Here. Colin, thanks so much for being here today.

Colin Gray [00:02:43]:
No worries. Thanks for having me on.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:45]:
It is my pleasure. I really appreciate you joining me. I know it’s the evening for you, the morning for me, and but I appreciate you taking some time to chat about this relationship with your daughter. And I love being able to start by really thinking about this journey that you’ve been on because every one of us as fathers wants to have those moments, those moments that we connect and we work hard to try to create those moments with our daughters. What would you say is one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share with your daughter and what made it so special?

Colin Gray [00:03:16]:
I’ll maybe avoid the question slightly, but give you a different type of answer perhaps in that. One of the things that I’ve found or I’ve learned, I suppose, over the last five years as my daughter’s become much more grown up. She’s 11 now and it used to be quite easy to make a connection with her when she was like three, four or five. You just go and you do kind of anything and they just become absorbed in what you want to do with them and just love spending the time with you and you know, they’ll often just do whatever you kind of lead them into playing, you know, a game or Lego or go outdoors to the park, whatever that might be. As my daughter’s got older, I found those things harder because obviously she has much more of her own mind, her own preferences, her own things, things that she wants to do. And I found myself even a couple of years ago when she wasn’t getting into 9 or 10, as she was getting much more of those preferences, I would choose to say, let’s go for a wee walk into town, we’ll go and have a wee walk around, we’ll grab like a nice cake or something in the shop and then we’ll walk home again. And because she’s much more her set, her own person now, she’d have preferences and maybe be a bit grumpy or, you know, it wouldn’t be perfect and I would end up getting grumpy because it wasn’t as perfect as I, you know, wanted this kind of connection to be. And I would kind of sabotage it for myself.

Colin Gray [00:04:30]:
These days I’m much more accepting of the fact that actually those connections just come in those little weird normal moments actually and it’s less about planning, like to go in for a three hour walk with her into town and a cake or an ice cream or whatever and it’s more just Actually, I walk into the kitchen and she’s sitting there, whether it’s reading a book or doing a dance or whatever it is she’s doing. And I’ll just walk up behind her and do the same thing. It’s like something about matching her energy much more. And because she’s kind of just learning who she is, I guess as a developing human, I find that’s what actually creates the connection these days. It’s actually just those little silly, messing around things where she’s doing a dance and I just walk in and join in in a super stupid, silly way, and that’s it. And it’s those little bits and it just takes like 30 seconds. But actually, those are the times when we just laugh and smile at each other much more. And there’s much less chance that the kind of budding teenager in her creates some kind of friction that ends up with both of us being angry at each other.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:31]:
One of the things that I guess that I would ask in response to that is you said that there was a little bit of a journey for yourself in the sense of, you know, getting from where you were to where you are today. What were some intentional steps that you had to take to be able to, I guess, in some sense, let go and just be present and be a part of the energy that she’s giving versus having those. Those, I’m going to say, preconceived feelings of what you wanted to happen and then being let down because you have to be able to grow from where that was to where you are today.

Colin Gray [00:06:04]:
I mean, you know what it’s like when they’re small. You are like the definitive boss, aren’t you? Because they’re liable to do something that could hurt themselves. Or you need to teach them how to be humans, you know, how to be. How to be decent and nice and kind and share and all that kind of stuff. But there’s a point they get where they’re. Suddenly they know those things. If you’ve done your job well enough, then they mostly know those things. And you can kind of let go of that a little bit.

Colin Gray [00:06:29]:
And then actually it comes to the point where you’re trying to do nice things with them and make those connections that you’re talking about. But you can’t be the definitive boss in those. You can’t decide what their fun is. You can’t decide what their preferences are. You can’t say, oh, well, I like, I used to love going for an ice cream with you, and you used to love it as well. So now, because you say you don’t want to do that anymore, I’m going to get annoyed and grumpy. And I went through a point of that. So, yeah, you said the words there, letting go.

Colin Gray [00:06:55]:
And it was definitely a letting go of that. Partly you’re the one that’s always in charge and making the decisions, and there’s still a bit of that, you know, as a parent, no matter what age they are, of course. But you have to let go of a lot of that, I think. And let go as well of the fact that you feel like you know what they enjoy. Because I don’t know what they enjoy these days. Like, both of my kids, especially my daughter, she’ll teach her mind every other week, and that’s fine. She’s just figuring stuff out. But I can be surprised one day when I go and ask her to do something and she’s like, no, don’t like that anymore.

Colin Gray [00:07:27]:
And she doesn’t say it like that, of course, but something’s changed. So there’s something around letting go of predictability as well and kind of thinking that, you know, what will make that connection or please her.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:38]:
A lot of the things that you’re talking about really talks to the fact that our kids, as they’re getting into the age that your daughter’s in, is really pushing and stretching that rubber band of independence. We’ll say they want more independence than they’ve had in the past. How, as a father, have you been able to balance guiding your daughter while also giving her the independence that she needs to be able to become the person that she’s becoming?

Colin Gray [00:08:06]:
I think if there’s many things I’ve got wrong as a dad over the years, one of the things I think I have done reasonably well is the independence side of things. And I think I was. Myself and my brother were really independent kids when we were younger. My mom and dad worked. Both of them, they had to work. And also they were just quite independent themselves. They were both like farm kids, so they grew up on farms, and therefore they were given a lot of responsibility when they were kids as well. And that passed on to us.

Colin Gray [00:08:31]:
And so I come from a family that is kind of from that point of view, from an early age, you get on and you just kind of look after yourself. And I’ve always encouraged my kids reasonably gently, but sometimes forcefully, to do things for themselves. You know, they ask for little simple things done for them, and I’m like, no, you know how to do that. I’ll show you how. I’ll help you do it, but you’ll do it. And so I’ve often done that all the way through. And it’s one of the things where my wife and I differ a fair bit. But she enjoys doing things.

Colin Gray [00:09:00]:
Like she really enjoys looking after the kids and like making sandwiches for them and stuff like that. But then when she’s away for the week, the kids make their own sandwiches for their lunch. And I don’t think it’s. It’s not only because I’m lazy, it’s partly because I want them to know how to do that as well. So I’ve definitely encouraged that from the very start. Like they need to know how to do things and I’ll leave them to do those things and fail at them as well. My daughter was cleaning the car the other day and she volunteered to do the inside and I offered to pay her a bit more for the inside. And I was like, I could go out and I showed her a few things, but I just left her to it for a few hours and she came back and I went back and I told her, oh, no, that’s not right, that’s not right.

Colin Gray [00:09:37]:
And it was just. I think it’s that kind of constructive feedback is something that I do. I tend to treat them a lot more like grownups right from the start and. But then, yeah, alongside that, just play silly games as well. So there’s a bit of a balance there, isn’t there?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:51]:
There definitely is a balance there. And it sounds like there’s some intentional things that you’re trying to do to be able to build that bond, those connections that we have with our daughters, you talked about when she was younger and the things that you like to do and some of the things that you’re doing now, as you think about intention in intentional ways in which you’re trying to build that bond, what are some of the things that you’re doing today that you try to be intentional about as you’re building relationship and building that bond?

Colin Gray [00:10:18]:
I’m constantly trying to find the things that she likes that I can talk to her about. There’s a period she’s going through right now where she’s definitely connecting a lot with her mum because she’s getting into quite girly things like makeup and hair and things like that. And that’s cool, that’s wonderful to see them doing that. And they kind of. They go for little shopping trips in and buy like a little, you know, two pound lip balm that she gets really excited about and all these kind of things and it’s, it’s lovely to see. I can try. I can kind of like learn a bit, a bit about these things, but I’m just like, I’m a guy with no hair, so I can’t get into the hair stuff. I’m a 40 year old man, so I can’t quite get into the makeup stuff.

Colin Gray [00:10:52]:
I’ll try on the lip balm for sure, but can’t get too excited about an extra good lip balm. So I think I’m just constantly trying to ask her things like what she’s into. I think, you know, it might be the same with yourself, Chris, like around the kind of being in this world of podcasting and media and YouTube and all that kind of stuff. That’s one thing that I do find I can connect with her quite well with actually, because I’m really interested in like, you know, trends on YouTube trends and podcasting, trends in media in general. So talking to them about who they’re following and who they like and who they’re becoming fans of and even in music as well, but more so the visual media side of things, I find that a really good conversation. That’s something that I bring up often, actually, because I find that that’s a good way to connect because I probably know more about that stuff than your average mid-40s dad, just through the jobs that we do. So that’s one thing that I do a lot is try and have those conversations. So, yeah, I don’t know.

Colin Gray [00:11:40]:
Do you find that with your set, with your own daughters, you know, a little bit.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:43]:
I find I still don’t completely understand TikTok. I still don’t understand it, but. But my youngest loves showing me tiktoks. And I’ll watch them and I’ll be in my mind saying, I don’t get this, but I’ll be here and I’ll be present and I try to figure out what the intrigue is. So. And I think that as podcasters and someone. For me, it’s all about storytelling, right? And it’s about how do we tell these stories or allow other people to tell their stories. And I think you do that as well.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:18]:
And I’ve tried to impart that on my own daughters to try to explain to them the power of story and the power of allowing them to not only tell their story, but allowing for others to tell their story. And I’ve tried to show them that as well. And I’m sure you have too, right?

Colin Gray [00:12:35]:
Yeah, definitely. And you know, it’s interesting, you bring that up because it’s not something that I’d put a label on before, but something that my daughter and I particularly connect around a lot is stories around characters in our house. So something we’ve always played around with, even when she was really small. But it’s grown into. I kind of thought this would fall away, but it hasn’t. Is around, like, soft toys and dolls and that kind of stuff. And she’s not into playing with, you know, dolls and teddies and stuff like that anymore. But we have these stories around them that ends up the two of us play around with them together.

Colin Gray [00:13:07]:
So when I go in to say night to my daughter at night, she’s got a few different soft toys lying around in her bed. And they all have their names, but they also. Big backstories that we’ve made over the last, like, five years. There’s a great one, this big, massive yellow teddy that we have, which we acquired in Japan, actually, when we’re on a holiday there. And there’s a whole backstory around how we acquired it, but equally, it went for the trip around with us, and me and her were just sitting around, like, making this teddy do things all the way around this trip. And ever since then, as well, it’s had that story where it’s from Japan, and it’s. We do things around the house, and it’s got a personality. And I think.

Colin Gray [00:13:40]:
I’m not sure maybe everyone does this, to be fair, but I feel like we go a little overboard in giving all these toys personalities and backstory and making them do things over the years. And that’s definitely something that we connect around a lot. But you’re right, it’s. As you said there. It’s the story. It’s all around the backstory. It’s all around the plot, what their likes and their dislikes are and all those things. Is that kind of like.

Colin Gray [00:14:02]:
Does that make sense?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:03]:
It does. My daughters are at an age that we don’t really have those kind of stories anymore, but I do try to get them involved in what I’m doing. They’re not always interested in it, but I try to show them, explain them. I actually. I just was talking to my oldest the other day about. I said. I said, you’re a storyteller. You like to talk to people you like.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:23]:
I said, you should have a podcast. And she’s, oh, yeah, yeah, whatever, dad. And. But you never know. I mean, they watch, they. They learn, and you never know, they might decide to pick something up along the way.

Colin Gray [00:14:36]:
That’s it isn’t it. It’s all example. I think there’s so much. I fall into this trap as much as anyone. But it’s so much so easy to find yourself telling them something while doing another thing, isn’t it? Whereas if you just do the thing, you don’t need to tell them anymore because they just see that as normal. So yeah, exercise is one of those. Daphne’s a dancer so she does a fair bit of dancing and different formats and stuff. So she does a fair bit of exercise.

Colin Gray [00:15:02]:
But I think some of that has come from the fact that she sees me and my wife like we, we make a big point of, you know, working out four times a week and doing a fair bit of exercise and being active and getting out in the hills and all that kind of stuff. So I think example is so powerful.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:16]:
It definitely is. Now every one of us as fathers want our daughters to feel valued, heard and to know that we are there for them. What do you intentionally do to help your daughter to feel valued and heard?

Colin Gray [00:15:31]:
I think the main thing I try and do, rightly or wrongly, is I’ve always tried to be as honest and constructive as possible. And I think I’ve certainly. My wife thinks I go too far with this sometimes to actually criticize a painting. They’ve done a painting or made something and you’re like, don’t criticize that. That’s not the right word. But critical feedback. Oh. So good effort on doing this.

Colin Gray [00:15:57]:
I wonder what do you like about it? Do you like this part and this part? I love this part about it. I wonder that year is not quite right. I wonder if we draw that dog. How would you normally draw a dog ear? So it looks a bit more accurate and I certainly think you don’t. This is probably something that many people would disagree on, but I’ve always done that ever since they were quite small. So I think that has built more trust over the years. So that when I do give my daughter a compliment or I tell her she’s done well at something, I think she trusts it rather than, you know, as a kid you always appreciate the praise from your parents but. But you begin to realize that your mom’s going to tell you you’re great at whatever you do, no matter how good you are at it.

Colin Gray [00:16:35]:
So I think that’s what I’ve always tried to do is to be quite honest and be a little bit critical friend when I can so that trust builds. So is that something to do yourself? Do you find that with more grown up daughters have you had any feedback on that?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:52]:
I do. I try and sometimes I fail. And I think that they’re much more willing to tell me when I’m failing. And I think that that’s okay. I think that all of us, as I said before, none of us are infallible. We all make mistakes. And I think that we have to be willing to learn and grow and not be so set in our ways that we’re not willing to take that feedback ourselves. I try to give feedback to my daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:22]:
But you also come to learn when you can push, when you can pull, and when you just need to be still.

Colin Gray [00:17:28]:
Yes.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:29]:
And I think as they get older, that’s definitely something. You have to learn that along the way.

Colin Gray [00:17:33]:
Yeah, absolutely. And you’re absolutely right there around making it mutual. It doesn’t work unless it’s mutual. And we do that quite a lot, actually, me and my wife. We say, like I often say to both of our kids, listen, I know I’m getting you in trouble for something here. I know I’m giving you, like, telling you what to do and all that kind of stuff, but if there’s ever any. I’m always willing to take feedback. If there’s anything you think I’m wrong about, I will always listen to you.

Colin Gray [00:17:56]:
If you say it to me in a reasonable, fair manner, if we can talk in normal tone of voice, and we’re not going to shout at each other. If you ever give me feedback, if you ever want to tell me something if you think I’m wrong, please just tell me and I’ll always listen to you. I might disagree, but I’ll always listen as long as we can talk about it in a civil manner. And I think that’s often built a decent bit of trust as well.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:15]:
And I think a lot of fathers and parents in general get in trouble when they don’t approach parenting in that way. Because I think when you get into arguments and you’re butting heads, especially during the teenage years, because that tends to happen, that’s when things go sideways. And that’s when you say things you regret in the end or you injure or hurt the relationship in a way that becomes harder to come back from. And I like the word that you said when you said you come at this with a mutual, you know, and it’s. I think there’s a mutual respect. Right. You need to be able to provide respect for your child. You want them to have respect for you, too.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:57]:
But ultimately, as they get older, you need to show that mutual respect for the decisions that they’re making as they become adults, while at the same time knowing that you may not be agreeing with the decisions that they’re making.

Colin Gray [00:19:09]:
Yeah, yeah.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:11]:
Because I’ve had that happen.

Colin Gray [00:19:12]:
Yeah. I’m sure that’s one of the areas where I have a big weakness. Like my. Probably my biggest weakness as a parent is I can end up stuck on a road. Stubbornly. My wife will back this up. That I have a stubborn streak whereby if I have started down some kind of path, I say it relates to what we were talking about earlier. Like I’ve decided we’re going to have a good day by walking into town and having an ice cream and then we’re going to have a nice chat and then we’re going to come home.

Colin Gray [00:19:37]:
And that’s in my head. And stubbornly I’ll stick to that. Even though I realize my daughter’s not really into this anymore or she’s actually just had a bit of a bad day because her and her friend just had a little fight or something has happened which means that we should be changing plans. And it’s kind of ironic because I think run my own business. I do a bunch of other stuff that means I need to be flexible. I need to be flexible and adapt to plans. But with my children, sometimes I’m very bad at that. I’m not good at adapting.

Colin Gray [00:20:02]:
So when something starts and I end up on a track and I stubbornly stick to it, that’s when I end up seeing things I’ll regret all the time because I’ll somehow just refuse to be able to change my mind or to be able to go back on something. Even though I realize that I’ve ended up. It’s at least half my fault, if not more, that we’re now shouting at each other.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:21]:
And I think that showing them that adaptability is important because so often in life we have to be resilient and you have to bounce back. I just had an example of that with my oldest daughter up till Monday of this week. She was supposed to be flying out yesterday to go on a month long mission trip to Kenya. It got canceled Monday afternoon.

Colin Gray [00:20:45]:
Okay.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:45]:
Because of the diseases that were happening in and around Kenya.

Colin Gray [00:20:51]:
Yeah.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:51]:
And of course she’s devastated and you have to understand and you have to try to help her to be resilient. But there’s also that understanding of where your daughter is at the time to be able to be in the mindset of hearing that message while knowing that she may not be able to take that message in at the Right.

Colin Gray [00:21:13]:
Time. Yeah, yeah, totally. That’s a pretty general human thing, isn’t it? There’s certain times when we’ve had bad news or we’re in a bad mood, the last thing you want to hear is, oh, don’t worry, it’s going to be okay. Like, I don’t get. It’s not going to be okay. Yeah, it’s hard to find that empathy, though. That’s. Yeah, it’s difficult, especially with a teenager, I think it is.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:33]:
So, you know, I think, though, that showing them that adaptability, though, leads them to be resilient and to be able to see that it’s okay to change plans and it’s okay to move in a different direction. Now, I will say that if you have neurodivergent children, changing plans and being adaptable may be harder. And I’m just going to recognize that because I know that that can be more of an issue. I don’t want to say that all kids are going to be the same in doing that, but I think that it is still important to help them to be able to understand how can we be adaptable based on the life of what’s happening in our life, what’s happening today, what’s happening tomorrow and beyond.

Colin Gray [00:22:14]:
Yeah, definitely. I think. I don’t know. I’d be interested to hear your thoughts on this as well, Chris. But like, when we were in Japan last year, I found that a really interesting trip in the. We planned a lot less than we usually would. So we were there for a few weeks and there were so many little problems came up on that trip. Like something went wrong, something didn’t turn up on time, and it was all because we didn’t actually plan it that well ahead because we wanted to be quite flexible.

Colin Gray [00:22:37]:
But there was so many, like, great experience moments in there, around that hopefully the kids again, from example, isn’t it like seeing my wife and I say, all right, okay, so we can’t get that train after all. So can’t get to our hotel tonight. Which means pretty unfortunate, but we’ll find something else. So we just start looking for other things and kind of about. And talking to folk. And I think that’s sometimes actually a great way or I found a great way to show them that and to teach them that is actually to take a chance on something that’s a bit less. A bit more unpredictable. Maybe plan a bit less than you would normally or try a type of trip that you wouldn’t normally take or things like that.

Colin Gray [00:23:13]:
And then obviously attempt not to entirely Panic when it goes, goes wrong yourself, which is not always the easiest thing, but give it a go at least. Have you ever tried something like that?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:23]:
I have. You know, and I think I find that I tend to like to be busy when I’m on vacation, like you’re saying. And I tend to like to know what’s around and, and I try to plan things but sometimes the, the best trips that we’ve been on have been ones where we have a general sense of what we’re going to do but then we leave it open to a bit more chance of okay as we’re driving around. You know, it’s not that we have to be there right at 10 o’, clock, but hey, that sign says something’.

Colin Gray [00:23:55]:
Here.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:55]:
Maybe we, let’s, let’s take that little side trip and we don’t have to be there right at 10. We could be there at 10:30. Let’s go check that out. Or you know, you’re, you’re walking and you’re headed toward a direction but then you see a, a side shop that looks really interesting. Is it going to matter that you’re 10 minutes late? Maybe it will. And if that’s the case, then you can come back. But if there, if you don’t have the specific things that you have to do at the right time, at the right, you know, in the right order, sometimes it’s fun and it makes it even more memorable.

Colin Gray [00:24:27]:
Yeah, definitely more memorable. I mean some of the most memorable things we’ve done all together as a family were completely unplanned, completely unpredictable or even it’s just a complete mess ups. Like when the car breaks down and you have to walk a mile to the garage and you get stuck somewhere in a bog because you try to take a shortcut. You know, silly things like that, that’s the stories that stick around. It’s never the ones that you, you plan for like the beautifully crafted Christmas dinner or the, or the, you know, the trip that was planned within an inch of its life that was meant to be most memorable. It’ll be, it’ll be the silly, the silly one thing that went wrong on those things every single time that comes up, isn’t it? It’s always the family stories.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:03]:
Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our dad connection. 66 more questions to delve into you as a dad. Are you ready?

Colin Gray [00:25:10]:
Go for it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:10]:
What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughter?

Colin Gray [00:25:14]:
Feisty.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:15]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice that you’ve ever received I that it’s

Colin Gray [00:25:20]:
always just a phase. So if it’s something good that’s happening right now, if they’re in a great mood, if they’re all like, if the relationship’s going well, then appreciate it, because it will probably change. But if it’s all going terribly, if they’re behaving terribly, if there’s something bad happening, you can’t get them toilet trained, whatever it might be, it’s just a phase. It’ll pass. So either way, if it’s good, appreciate it. If it’s bad, it’ll pass.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:42]:
What’s one activity that you and your daughter love doing together?

Colin Gray [00:25:45]:
Piggybacks still. Even though she’s getting way too heavy and it keeps me strong.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:51]:
If you could give your daughter one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Colin Gray [00:25:55]:
I think it is something around what we were talking about there, around resilience and change. It’s like things will change, but you have the strength and the intelligence and the resilience to adapt it. No matter what goes wrong, you’ll figure out a way that our family is a family of problem solvers. That’s what we all do. So we love to solve problems. So just see it all as an interesting challenge.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:17]:
What’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Colin Gray [00:26:20]:
That I am a much better person to be around when I can abandon my preconceived expectations and actually just go with the flow more.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:29]:
And what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Colin Gray [00:26:36]:
There’s something around probably the hardest thing which is holding them more loosely than you feel like you should, whether that’s how much you need to protect them, whether it’s how much you need to guide them or whether it’s how much you need to tell them the way to do things. We should probably. I certainly I should. I have learned certainly to do that more loosely than I naturally would otherwise.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:59]:
Well, Colin, I just want to say thank you. If people want to find out more about you and what you’re doing with podcast host or anything else that you’re doing right now. Where should they go?

Colin Gray [00:27:08]:
Yeah, probably the best place actually is just go over to Colin Gray. So my name, Colin Gray link. That’s kind of links to all the stuff I’m doing. So yeah, just Colin Gray link.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:16]:
And I’ll put a link in the notes today to for you to be able to connect with Colin. Colin, thanks so much for being here. Appreciate the time today. Appreciate you sharing your story. I know it’s continuously evolving and it will continue to evolve as your daughter gets older, but I really appreciate your time today and for you sharing with us and I wish you all the best.

Colin Gray [00:27:39]:
No, thank you very much for having me on. It’s always a pleasure to chat. It was good to catch up. So, yeah, cheers.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:44]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect, it’s about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes@dadanddaughterconnection.com until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:28:14]:
We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers we spend the time, we give the lessons, we make the meals we buy them presents and bring your A game Cause those kids are growing fast the time goes by just like a dynamite blast Calling astronauts and firemen Carpenters and muscle men get out and be the world to them Be the best dad you can be Be the best dad you can.

Laughter, Listening, and Lessons: Keys to Raising Confident Daughters

July 6, 2026 by dadofdivas

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

If you’re a dad eager to strengthen your relationship with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’ll want to tune into the latest episode of the Dad and Daughter Connection podcast. This episode dives deep into real stories, practical advice, and genuine reflections on the journey of fatherhood.

Hosted by Dr. Christopher Lewis, this episode welcomes guest Daryle Brown, a retired director of Social Justice and IT at Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago, and a father of two adult daughters. What emerges is a warm, honest conversation filled with the kind of wisdom every dad could benefit from.

Consistency and Open Communication:
Dr. Christopher Lewis and Daryle Brown emphasize the importance of being consistently present and level-headed in your daughter’s life (03:03), regardless of the circumstances. Daryle Brown shares how maintaining open channels of communication allowed his daughters to feel comfortable coming to him with anything, even the difficult topics.

Balancing Guidance with Independence:
A recurring theme is the challenge of balancing parental guidance with granting daughters the freedom to make their own choices (06:27). Daryle Brown explains how crucial it is to support, not control, and to accept their individualism—even when their paths or decisions differ from our expectations.

Intentional Engagement:
Being an involved dad is about more than just showing up; it’s about active participation (09:35). Whether attending soccer games or offering life advice, Daryle Brown highlights the impact of being genuinely engaged and available during both the ups and downs.

Listening and Patience:
Another heartfelt takeaway is the power of listening—really listening—before offering advice (15:16). Patience is key, both in conversations and in the natural progression of a child’s growth. Daryle Brown also credits humor and shared laughter as essential elements in building enduring connections.

Lasting Wisdom for Dads:
In his closing advice, Daryle Brown urges dads to be patient, listen deeply, and infuse their relationships with laughter. As he reminds us, “Humor is so critical… it just melts the challenges and the difficulties.”

This episode is packed with down-to-earth insights and encouragement. Subscribe to the “Dad and Daughter Connection” and discover practical ways to show up as the dad your daughter needs. Listen now and keep building those strong, lasting bonds!

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week I love having you come back to learn, to grow, to be able to find new ways to be able to build those strong relationships that you want to build with your daughters. And that’s why this show exists every week.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:07]:
I love being able to have you here to gain some hints, some tips, some tricks, some things that you can use right away, to be able to demystify some things and to be able to figure out some ways in which you might be able to adjust what you’re doing, to be able to create those connections. And I do that every week by bringing you different people, people with different experiences that have done fatherhood in different ways. And I love being able to do that because I think all of us can learn even that no matter where we are in this journey of fatherhood. You know, I’ve got two daughters. I know you’ve got daughters, and that’s why this is important. I learned from our guests. I know you do, too. And today we’ve got another great guest.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:51]:
Darrell Brown is with us. And Darrel is someone I’ve known for a number of years. He actually was a guest of a past podcast that I did in the past, and I talked to him about fatherhood then, but we’re going to be talking it more. Darrell just retired as the director of Social justice and IT for Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago and now is living on a farm. So a little bit different and different experiences, but I’m really excited to be able to talk to him, catch up and talk a little bit more about his own journey with his daughters. Darrell, thanks so much for being here today.

Daryle Brown [00:02:24]:
Thank you. It’s a pleasure.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:25]:
Well, I’m really excited to be able to have you here today. And I guess I know you’ve got two daughters. They’re adults now and doing Their things. And I know that they’ve some really amazing things happening in their lives. I’d love to have you think back to your relationship with your daughters and what’s one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share with your daughters and what made it so special?

Daryle Brown [00:02:47]:
Well, I think that it’s hard to gauge a moment that was just life changing, so to speak. I think what’s been more important in the relationship I have with my daughters is consistency. Them understanding that they could pretty much talk to me about anything, being level headed. When you hear things that may not exactly be along the path that you may want them to go or have them thinking along the lines that you want them to be thinking and to be able to accept their individualism. I think that’s kind of the tone that I’ve taken with them over the years. And it’s worked to the extent that we still communicate very openly, very freely when alcohol or marijuana, those types of things. When my children decided to experiment, so to speak, it was not something that they did secretively. I took my girls out for their first drinks.

Daryle Brown [00:03:38]:
Well, not really, but it was supposed to be that way. I remember now this is my baby daughter, Kamara, my youngest daughter, so she’s 31 now, I think. And I remember her coming to town because she was in college, out of town, she came to town and I remember finding her id, her drinking eligible ID that wasn’t real and being just terribly concerned because what if you get caught with two driver’s licenses and you get pulled over? What kind of damage is that going to do to your whole life? And of course she minimizes, she was like, oh dad, you know, it’s no big deal, everybody does it, blah blah, blah, blah, blah. But for me it was, it was very concerning. It was a prayer moment because I know how the system can react to these types of situations and you never know how deep that rabbit hole is going to run. So needless to say, she grew out of that. She’s always been brilliant and that has come to play through these later years. And I think I may have mentioned to you she just defended her dissertation at Harvard and we’ll be going to the graduation in a few weeks.

Daryle Brown [00:04:43]:
So she turned out all right, even though that was a pretty scary moment. But you have those occasions when they will surprise you and not necessarily understand all the ramifications of decisions that they’re making. So my older daughter’s actually been married. She was married for five years and she’s been probably divorced for five years now, maybe longer. We had a interesting. I wouldn’t call it traumatic situation. Again, these things affect me more than they affect them sometimes. So when she was going through her divorce, she didn’t tell anybody? Well, she didn’t tell me there were people that knew her sister, knew my wife’s best friend, Cynthia, knew she had support in that portion of her life, and it just wasn’t me.

Daryle Brown [00:05:29]:
And I don’t think my wife either. And when she finally told us the dirty deed was done, paperwork was signed, it was, like, over. And I think part of it was that she thought that we might try to talk her out of it. And again, that’s my trying to understand why she didn’t tell us about what she was going through at the time. But at any rate, you know, it happened. There were no children involved, so it was pretty much a clean split. I was pretty sad because I liked him, but of course I liked him based on the relationship that he and I had. I wouldn’t have liked him if I had known the relationship that he and my daughter were having.

Daryle Brown [00:06:03]:
So that was. I don’t know if these were monumental or as you had described it earlier. Hopefully they kind of fit in the.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:10]:
Sure. And one of the things that I know, I mean, is that you’ve been busy in your career, and you’ve had lots of different things that you’ve done in your career. You’ve been a busy person, and there’s been lots of things that you’ve balanced as a professional, as a, you know, personally, in your own life, et cetera, and as a father, you have to balance. So talk to me about balance. And how did you balance not only what you were doing, but really how did you balance guiding your daughters while also giving them the independence to grow into the people that they became?

Daryle Brown [00:06:38]:
Well, Christopher, it starts with having a good partner. And even though my wife was a career person also, I think early in our marriage, she probably did a lot more with and for the kids than I did. I think I probably got better once we moved to Chicago. Part of the stress was a lot of travel. I did a lot of travel on my job, but we made it through. And I certainly tried to give my kids the attention that I could when we were together. When I was around, I may have been busy with work, but I wasn’t super busy with other stuff. So it was like, yeah, I was busy with work, but I was pretty family focused.

Daryle Brown [00:07:17]:
So, I mean, that helped, I think. I think church helped. The fact that we regularly attended church. As a family, our church happened to have a good child children’s church. So we had that going for us. It was a bit of a challenge moving to Chicago away from family, because, as I may have mentioned before, we moved to Chicago when my youngest daughter was like 2 and my older daughter was maybe 9. So that moving away from the whole support structure that we had in Detroit, lots of family, lots of friends, to a new city, that created a bit of stress, but it also, I think, created a bond. We were very, very lucky to have great neighbors, both on one side of us and behind us, with kids the same age as my younger daughter.

Daryle Brown [00:08:21]:
So that that helped very well. We discovered a wonderful Montessori school for my younger daughter that was a great contributor to kind of a steadiness in. In her life. So a lot of different pieces have to come together. And Christopher, I’ll tell you, the reality is we were very fortunate that we were financially pretty well off. Not rich, but, you know, pay a lot for the bricks in Oak park, so we could afford to live in Oak Park. They have very good schools there. They have an incredible.

Daryle Brown [00:08:56]:
I guess I’ll call it a recreation department for the township. We have two beautiful facilities with pools, and they’ve added things since. I’ve kind of aged out of that group. But, I mean, it was a great town to raise a family. So that’s another thing that went very well. Very fortunate. Between church and picking a good town to live in. Very fortunate.

Daryle Brown [00:09:14]:
I don’t take for granted the fact that we could afford to do it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:17]:
Every father has to really think about the things that they’re doing to be able to build those bonds. And this show’s all about creating those strong bonds. What are some intentional ways that you worked, either in the past or even currently, to strengthen your bond with your daughters, especially during those challenging times?

Daryle Brown [00:09:35]:
First of all, you got to be participatory. If the girls play soccer, you got to go to soccer games, you got to be there. You got to be yelling on the sideline. And more importantly, don’t get me in trouble on this. You have to be able to give them that additional coaching that the coach may not give them. So there was this one team, and this is a soccer league. They were just incredible. They had great players at every position.

Daryle Brown [00:09:59]:
They had speed, they had attitude. And the attitude was the part where I had to coach my daughter. Now, I don’t know if you’re familiar with the concept of playing the dozens. Have you ever heard about playing the dozens? That’s kind of an African American community thing. And it’s when you talk about people’s parents. So my daughter was complaining about how these girls are always talking about us, but I can’t hardly get my head wrapped around it. And I said, next time she does that, you just look her in the eye and say, your mama, and keep it moving. So, you know, sometimes your teachings are a little unorthodox.

Daryle Brown [00:10:32]:
And mom was not happy. Mom was not happy about it. But the reality is, it’s something that me and. Me and Kamara still laugh about today because it worked. You know, it’s just kind of shocking. Just like, what did she just say? So, yeah, I taught my daughter how to play the dozens. I’m not proud, but it happened. So just to say, though, the point of it is, you got to be engaged to the point where, you know, they tell you what’s going on, they tell you their ups and their downs, and they seek your counsel.

Daryle Brown [00:11:01]:
And sometimes the coaches can get them through it, but sometimes the parents have to kind of boost them. Now, I. I will say one of my disappointments was when Kamara was about to move from green belt to brown belt in karate and instead said, dad, I’m done with karate. And that was it. She never went back to another class. And I. I had lots of conversation about it, and nope, didn’t work a comparable thing for my older daughter, Nia. So I don’t know if this is great communications, but when she was going to college, decisions.

Daryle Brown [00:11:37]:
So she had decided that she wanted to go to Boston College. And the reason why was that Boston College, as it had a great international relations program, and she was talking about international relations, they had lots of opportunities to travel abroad, and my wife and I relented, and it was outside of our range, but we said, okay, this is going to be great for you. This is what you want to do. And so she’s up there at orientation, and she’s calling home, just kind of check in, blah, blah, blah. And she says, oh, and I changed my major to psychology. And I’m like, psychology, psychology. Every school in the country has a psychology program. So she ended the conversation with, dad, you ruining my best day ever.

Daryle Brown [00:12:20]:
So I like to tell you I work my way out of that, but I didn’t. She was mad at me for some time, but. So all the communications we do are not necessarily going to bear fruit.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:32]:
No, they’re not. They’re not. They’re definitely not all going to bear fruit, as you mentioned. And none of us are infallible. We are human. And we make mistakes. I guess, as you think about fatherhood for yourself and raising your daughters and even, or even today with adult daughters, what’s a mistake that you’ve made as a father? And what did you learn about it from. No.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:55]:
And what did you learn from it about fostering a positive connection with your daughters?

Daryle Brown [00:13:02]:
I don’t know if I list this as a mistake, but this past Christmas, we vacationed in Jamaica with my older daughter’s partner and his family, and things were going great. We had a great time. But the roads on this particular island were loaded with potholes. And so we’re driving. I don’t know, we may have been driving to the airport with the rental car, and my daughter was in the front seat, my Navigator, but she kept trying to tell me where to drive on the road. You’re too close to the center. You’re too close to the edge. You’re too close to this.

Daryle Brown [00:13:32]:
And we got into basically a screaming match to the point where when we finally got to the airport, I was like, just get out. And we ended up as. I don’t know what exactly went wrong, but we ended up missing our flight and having to reschedule. And as far as I was concerned, it was her fault. And I was like, don’t, don’t. I won’t talk to you. And I would say that the lesson learned is give it time. Because we were a heated argument, we’re fussing at each other.

Daryle Brown [00:13:59]:
We don’t want to speak to each other anymore, and we didn’t for, I don’t know, two, three weeks maybe. Eventually, we talked again. We didn’t go back into this conversation, however. We just picked it back up, you know, So I don’t know how great that advice is. It would just be, hey, sometimes you just got to let it go. There’s not going to be a person that’s right or a person that’s wrong, and you just have to, you know, just have to move on. And that’s okay, too. It’s okay not to define who was

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:24]:
right as you think about your daughters, too. Every one of us, as fathers, have to find ways to be able to show our daughters that they are valued and heard. What did you do intentionally to help your daughters to feel that they truly were valued and heard?

Daryle Brown [00:14:41]:
Well, I have a background in restorative justice practices, but that came later. I think I’ve just been fortunate to have been in situations and places where listening was important. In rj, certainly listening is important. My wife and I participated in a Program, I don’t know, 40 years ago, maybe 35 years ago, where we went into schools and we taught. I say taught, but it was kind of an enrichment type program in struggling schools. And as part of that, one of the important components was learning to listen and hearing people. And there are lots of other things to it, and a lot of those we implemented in how we raised our own children. But I think the important thing is being able to hear them out.

Daryle Brown [00:15:26]:
Before you offer up your life wisdom, you’ll be surprised at what you’ll learn. I think being available to listen. I think my daughters have always felt like they could talk to dad, that there was no subject that they couldn’t broach with me. I mean, I. I’ve been in lots of conversations about boyfriends. I certainly would tell them if a boyfriend rubbed me the wrong way, but for the most part, I let them have their own age appropriate experiences, I would say. And I think that’s worked pretty well. They’re going to make their mistakes with their relationships.

Daryle Brown [00:15:57]:
I made a few myself. So I think I lucked out and found a good gal. And we celebrated 40 years of marriage last year. So as she reminded me recently, when I came down here, before we were married, we came down to the farm, this is the farm that we’re living at now, to meet Uncle Fred and Ahmaud and help them celebrate their 75th wedding anniversary. And my wife was like, this is how we do it in my family. So that’s been a mantra of ours that we’re shooting for 75 years.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:26]:
That would be an amazing milestone for you.

Daryle Brown [00:16:30]:
40 is good for me too. Now it’s a matter of living right, eating right. Let me tell you, this farm life, I’ve only been doing it for maybe four weeks, really being here all the time. And it’s a great exercise program.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:45]:
I can only imagine. Now, I know both of your daughters are very different people. They went off and are doing very unique things, different than each other, and had different dreams, passions. Talk to me about how you supported your daughters in pursuing those dreams and passions.

Daryle Brown [00:17:05]:
I think you just have to be there on the. During the down times, when things are going great for them, all you have to do is ride along. But when things aren’t going great, when they’re stressing out about tests or milestones and things that need to come up, being able to talk them back from the edge with confidence, understanding that no matter what happens, it’s not the end of the world. But at the end of the day, you got this. You’ve got a whole history of success behind you. There’s no reason in the world that you should be stressing yourself out about whatever comes next. I mean, it’s just another step. I’ve had those phone calls when they were both of them on their own paths where they were just not feeling it.

Daryle Brown [00:17:47]:
I think that Camara, when she was working her way through her PhD, she took a year off. And some of my friends that had been through programs like that said that sometimes that’s good. Of course, as a parent, your concern is that they’re never going back. This is the end of the road. Not the kind of stuff I would ever share with her. I may have negative thoughts creeping in my head, but I would not share that. My conversations with her were always supportive and uplifting. And you can do this and just stick to it, take some time off, get your head together and then get back to it and you’ll be fine.

Daryle Brown [00:18:18]:
Similarly, Nia had her struggles when she was in law school. Law school is a burden. And a lot of it they do on purpose. You know, it’s a weeding out process and we managed our way through it. But I think for us parents, we need to be able to bear some of that internally and not necessarily be in that same rhythm. When they’re down. We can’t be down with them. We have to be that positive, that positive notion that kind of brings them up a little.

Daryle Brown [00:18:45]:
You’re not going to necessarily bring them from a depression of getting a C minus on one of your law school papers. You’re not gonna bring them up immediately, but you need to stay positive. I think that’s the moral of the story. As parents, we need to stay positive. They don’t need the pressure of us leaning too hard on them. We need to be able to help them get back on an even keel and not be down there waddling in the mud with them.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:09]:
One of the other questions that I wanted to ask goes down to, and this could be from the past or currently, is what’s one way that you show your daughters that they can always count on you?

Daryle Brown [00:19:20]:
I think that unfort I’m not as good at this with my wife as I am with my daughters, is not overreacting, not getting out of phase, not getting angry, not showing anger, being able to maintain that equanimity. I think that’s important. They have to be able to know when they come to you with something that they know is going to piss you off, that you’re not going to go over the edge about it and that you’re going to be able to deal with them and deal with the conversation or whatever the struggle or helping them with a solution that you’re going to be able to do that without overreacting. I think that’s a very important thing and not easy, not easy to always master. And as I said, you know, it’s okay to walk away sometimes if you feel yourself going over the edge, because I don’t know how many chances a child gives you if you continually go over the edge, yelling, screaming, cussing, fussing, whatever. I don’t know how many chances you get if that’s going to be your reaction, because pretty soon they’re going to seek other people to. To get that kind of counsel. So that would be a caution for parents, especially young parents.

Daryle Brown [00:20:23]:
You can’t be jumping edge every time they do something that makes you mad. They’re kids now.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:27]:
We always finish our interviews with what I like to call our dad connection. 66 more questions to delve a little bit further into you as a dad. Are you ready?

Daryle Brown [00:20:35]:
I’m ready.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:35]:
What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughters?

Daryle Brown [00:20:39]:
I’m struggling between warm and humorous.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:41]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice that you ever received?

Daryle Brown [00:20:46]:
You know, I think that for me, I grew up in a relatively complicated dad orientation. I had a genetic father, I had an adopted father, and then I had a stepfather. So I had three men that could be framed as dads. And I would say that the lessons, the lessons I learned from my stepfather and the kindness that he displayed to my mother and me, his own children, to some degree, that is a model that I’ve used. So I don’t know how that fits your question, but I have more of a model that guides me than anything else. Else.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:23]:
What’s one activity that you and your daughters love to do together? And it could be different for each daughter.

Daryle Brown [00:21:30]:
Cook.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:31]:
If you could give your daughters one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Daryle Brown [00:21:35]:
Take time to have fun. And we do.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:38]:
What’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Daryle Brown [00:21:42]:
I think I’ve learned how to be patient. I’ve learned how things don’t happen right away. And by the way, daughters helped me learn that. Gardening helped me learn that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:51]:
And finally, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Daryle Brown [00:21:59]:
First of all, be patient with them. Listen, have fun. Laugh. Oh, my God. Laugh. That’s. That’s critical. My daughters and I, we laugh.

Daryle Brown [00:22:08]:
We have fun together and we laugh a lot. Everybody can’t be a comedian and my wife will tell you that I crack myself up. But definitely humor is so critical in any relationship. It just melts the challenges and the difficulties and the differences. So have fun with each other.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:24]:
Well, Daryl, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for being here today. Thank you for sharing all that you have shared. If people want to find out more about you, where should they go?

Daryle Brown [00:22:32]:
Oh boy. You know, I’m. I’m retired and I’m just kind of building my socials in a new direction. So I would say just send me an email for now. Darrell D A R Y L e q@gmail.com my link tree is justice work.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:49]:
Well, I truly appreciate you sharing that. We’ll make sure to put links in the notes today. And as I mention mentioned, I really appreciate your time. I wish you the best in your farming journey and I look forward to hearing more about what this journey brings.

Daryle Brown [00:23:04]:
I’ll be tapping into you when I get some stuff going. I got a few things. I got eight trees planted. By the way, it’s a hell of a lot harder to plant a tree than you think. I got some big pots, I got some wildflowers, little things because I got whole fields I got to worry about. But we’ll get to that. Next Thursday we’re going to start the cultivating and the tilling and. And it’s a farmer’s life for me.

Daryle Brown [00:23:23]:
Oh, that’s a pirate’s life. Oh, I missed it. Wrong one. Christopher, wonderful. Thank you so much for inviting me on. It’s been a pleasure.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:33]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect. It’s about being, being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes@dadanddaughterconnection.com until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:24:03]:
We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, we give the lessons, we make the meals, we buy them presents and bring your A game. Cause those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast Calling astronauts and firemen carpenters and muscle men get out and be the world you down Be the best dad you can be Be the best dad you can.

The Art of Fatherhood: Lessons in Letting Go and Growing Together

June 29, 2026 by dadofdivas

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

How do you nurture independent, confident daughters while creating a deep, lasting relationship as a father? That’s the question at the heart of the Dad and Daughter Connection, hosted by Dr. Christopher Lewis—and in a recent episode, guest Art Eddy, host of the Art of Fatherhood podcast, shares relatable, hard-earned wisdom every dad (and parent) can appreciate.

Cherishing the Small Moments

One central theme is the value of everyday experiences—the dinners, shared jokes, and simple activities that reveal how “the small things make the big impact” in your relationship. Art Eddy recounts favorite moments: attending chorus performances, bonding at Bruins games, and even just sharing movie nights or video games at home. These aren’t grand gestures, but they’re where connection is built.

Letting Go and Fostering Independence

A recurring challenge, as discussed by both Dr. Christopher Lewis and Art Eddy, is finding the right balance between protecting your kids and gradually letting go. With both dads preparing for daughters to leave for college, they reflect on that poignant “crossroads”—learning to trust the foundation you’ve laid, and accepting that your children need space to stretch, fail, and grow. Art Eddy shares a particularly touching story about watching his daughter walk a college campus by herself for the first time, a real-life metaphor for this parental transition.

The Power of Listening and Honest Conversation

Listening—truly hearing your daughter, not just advising her—is another core message. Art Eddy emphasizes “two ears, one mouth—listen more, talk less,” offering support when asked, and encouraging self-reflection instead of top-down instruction. This nurtures strong communication and respect, especially as children become teens and young adults.

Imperfectly Present

Both speakers candidly share their own mistakes, whether it’s not asking for help, occasional impatience, or the struggle of balancing technology and quality time. The takeaway? No one is perfect, and being present—putting the phone down, engaging authentically—is what matters most.

Fatherhood Is for Every Dad

Finally, Art Eddy speaks passionately about celebrating diverse stories, real fatherhood from all walks of life, and creating positive, supportive communities for dads.

If you’re a dad (or parent) looking for practical wisdom, honest conversation, and plenty of heart—and maybe a few laughs—the Dad and Daughter Connection is for you. Listen in, and start building those small moments that make the biggest difference.

TRANSCRIPT

Art Eddy [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week I love that you show up.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:56]:
You’re showing up not only to learn, to grow, to be able to be that dad that you want to be, but you’re showing up for your daughters. Because every week you have an opportunity to be able to learn something new, to be able to meet new people, people that have gone through what you’re going through, people that have something that they can share with you to help you to be that dad that you want to be. That’s why this podcast exists. This podcast is here to be able to help you build those strong connections with your daughters who one day at a time. Because it’s not always going to be roses, it’s not always going to be easy, but showing up, being there, and being willing to put in the work, you’re going to have a ton of dividends in the end. That’s why every week, I love being able to bring you different people with different experiences, people that can give you some of their own experiences as being either dads, two daughters, or other people with resources that can help you to be that dad. Today we’ve got another great guest, Art. Eddie is with us.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:55]:
Art and I have known each other for a long time. He is a father of two daughters. He’s also the host of the Art of Fatherhood podcast. Great podcast. If you haven’t listened to it, definitely check it out and we’ll be talking about that. But as I said, he’s a father of two daughters. So we’re gonna learn a little bit more about his own parenting journey, and I’m really excited to have him here. Art, thanks so much for being here.

Art Eddy [00:02:17]:
Chris, appreciate being on the show. Love the work that you’re doing. It’s always good to catch up. Even before we started recording, we had like a 30 minute, like, awes podcast of just a reunion podcast. It was so good, man.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:29]:
It really was. And we didn’t record it. We probably shouldn’t have recorded it.

Art Eddy [00:02:33]:
Yeah.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:35]:
But it was still fun.

Art Eddy [00:02:36]:
Yeah. No, it’s good, though, because, like, I miss these connections. I miss, like, you know, I mean, we were just talking about how fast time flies with our, you know, your daughter is in college. My daughter, my oldest. Your oldest is in college. My oldest is going to be going to college in the fall of this year. And it’s just like, where’d the time go, man?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:55]:
Oh, the time just flies by. I mean, my youngest is going to college this fall, too, so our daughters are my youngest. Your oldest are both the same age, so we’ll be going through that together as well. And things change, I tell you. I. I’m. I’m a little nervous about the empty nesting type of thing going on to see kind of what that dynamic brings. It’s definitely going to be a lot quieter in the house, and I don’t really know what to expect yet.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:23]:
So it’s gonna be a different situation at home, you know, and your relationship with your significant other is gonna change in different ways because you don’t have the kids around to be a part. And the things that you focus your time in also change because for so many years, as you know, I mean, we put all this time and effort into raising our kids to being there for their activities and their. And the things that are important to them. And then as they go away, then we have to, we have to do other things. And, you know, we’re focusing back on each other and going back to the beginning and, and really. And it’s just different. So it’s going to be interesting.

Art Eddy [00:04:01]:
No, 100%. Like, things, like, all right, how do you do things? Like, my wife and I got a little taste of it a couple weekends ago. Like, my daughters were hanging out with, like, some of their friends together, and they had like a sleepover like a Friday night. And they had something all the way through, like, Saturday. And it was just like, like Saturday night. And my wife, like, this is what it’s going to be like, huh? We had, we went to go see a movie. We had like a nice breakfast together on Saturday morning. I was like, this is cool.

Art Eddy [00:04:27]:
But we also miss, like, it was funny. Like, one of the things, like, I love hanging out with my daughters, but, like, one of the college visits, they separated the, the parents and the kids. The kids were doing like these different, like, one on one interviews with some of the admins and we had the adults, like, getting in this one room to kind of talk and, like, this one, like, couple song. They’re like, I can’t wait. You know, this is my last kid. And then, like, I get to, like, take care of their room and change it into, like, their gym. We’re so excited. And it was like, yeah, I can’t wait.

Art Eddy [00:04:55]:
I’m like, what? I was like, oh, my gosh.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:00]:
I can’t say that I. I can’t wait. I mean, I. I am going to miss having them around.

Art Eddy [00:05:05]:
Yeah.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:05]:
I mean, there are days. I think we both know that there are days.

Art Eddy [00:05:09]:
Yes. But I had one day yesterday, actually, where I had to go search everywhere for a broken. For a. To replace a broken dryer knob that was like, I didn’t want to, like, pay or, like, get some sketchy thing from, like, a secondary source. So like, I found here in, like, North Carolina, a place that, like, sold that stuff. But I had to, like, take time out of my day, then fix it. I was like, ah. I didn’t like this.

Art Eddy [00:05:33]:
My day just got totally upside down.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:36]:
I know that you’re really engaged with your daughters, and you have had some amazing moments with them throughout their lives. As you think about some of those moments and some of those moments that have been most meaningful for you, what’s one of the most meaningful moments that you would say that you’ve shared with your daughters and what made it so special?

Art Eddy [00:05:54]:
Yeah, for me, I would probably say, you know, as a collective, when they both are in chorus. So when I see them perform and when my youngest was playing the saxophone, it was great to see that, just to see, like, their achievements and different things. When my oldest got accepted to the college she’s going to, which was great. The trials and tribulations, you know as well as I do of, like. Like, when we were going to college, totally different, but, like, the process is totally different, and I appreciate her journey into that. And then my youngest, she and I will go to Bruins games when they play here in North Carolina, and we have those moments where we joke around. And, like, she, like, my youngest and I kind of share the same type of humor. We have different senses of humor, but we share, like, if you have a Venn diagram, certain parts of our humor, like, coexist.

Art Eddy [00:06:40]:
And so, like, we’re at the dinner table, like, one of the things that we always strive to do most of the time, I’d say, like, out of the seven days of the week, probably four to five times we’re having dinner together. And we’re all talking about our days, and we’re just kind of like, learning, like, the ups and downs and stuff. But, like, I’ll say something, and my youngest will like, look at me. And we’ll just like, have this moment and everyone, like, the other two, like my wife and my oldest, like, what? What? And I’m like, don’t worry about it. So it’s just like, those are the moments that you cherish seeing my youngest right now, she went to regional for track for her high school, and she got her own personal record, which was awesome to see that. And then I think also too, like, when you hear a teacher or in. In for me, for my oldest, when she gets a compliment or she got, like, employee of the year for the ymca, I was like, that was impressive. Like, those are the things where I’m like, that’s awesome.

Art Eddy [00:07:31]:
And I. I say, like, I’m proud of you. You should be proud of yourself. And we just kind of talk about, like, how they got to that certain spot and stuff like that. So, yeah, there are certain times where you’re having to fix a broken dryer knob and you’re just frustrated and I don’t have any hair, so I can’t pull any hair out anymore. But then there’s the good. Totally outweighs, like, the. The frustrating parts of being a dad.

Art Eddy [00:07:52]:
So, like, it’s good, but it’s just like, just those moments where I can celebrate their wins together with them and share those jokes or share those laughs. Like, my youngest and I went to see Mortal Kombat 2 recently. We had fun, and she got the different jokes from, like, playing Mortal Kombat with me and stuff. So it was just like, it was cool. Like, those moments, the bonding and listen to them, you know, man, like, is. You’ve talked about this. I love when you have, like, on LinkedIn or different places where you have those, like, five minutes of, like, hey, this is how you can connect to your daughter. Right? Like, I appreciate those because I’m, like, nodding my head listening to you.

Art Eddy [00:08:24]:
I’m like, yep, I have experienced that too. So it’s the small things. And my kids have taught me it’s the small things that make the big

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:32]:
impact of those memories, really is the small things. And a number of the things that you talked about really make me think about. You’ve done a really good job of being able to help your daughters as they’ve been older to become more independent. And you, you’re doing a lot to be able to prepare them. You’ve got your oldest going off to college. And, you know, I’ve done the same in trying to help my daughters to be able to be those independent people. But that’s not always easy. It’s not always easy to find that balance between kind of guiding your daughter while also giving them independence.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:06]:
How did you do that in your own parenting journey with your daughters?

Art Eddy [00:09:10]:
It’s tough, man, because I think you’ve heard this probably before on your podcast. We probably had this conversation before, years ago, or at the different conferences we might be at together. But, like, your job is to make sure that you are no longer relevant in their lives anymore in the sense of, like, them needing you. Like, they can, like you said, be independent. And that’s tough. But, like, there was one time earlier this year when a metaphor actually came into reality, because you’re at that crossroads of, like, letting your daughter or your child be more independent, and they’re going off to college and they’re going to be their own. I remember we were touring the. The campus of Clemson, and it was when spring break was happening, like, right.

Art Eddy [00:09:46]:
Right around, like, March Madness. So the campus was, like, empty, according to, like, the people we’ve talked to. And it was like alumni weekend. So the weekend was kind of, like, busy with, like, alumni and all that other stuff. But, like, there are no kids there. All the buildings, for the most part, are shut down. And we’re walking the campus, and my youngest and my wife are kind of, like, looking at this one, like, plaque or memorial. And I’m in the middle between, like, the distance of them and my oldest, who’s walking it by herself, and I’m just like, oh, should I run up to her, like, you know, catch up with her and see what she’s doing? And I’m like, no, this is something where, like, the metaphor actually is happening in real life, where I’m at a crossroads of, like, maybe it was a brick crossroads, but I’m like, I’m gonna stay here in the middle, wait for my youngest and my wife to catch up, let my daughter do her own thing, because that’s what she’s going to need to.

Art Eddy [00:10:32]:
And for me to physically feel that. I was just like, this is life, man. And I think the first time that my wife and I, Reese, like, in, like, I’d say a couple years ago, really got emotional is when our oldest. I’m in the process of teaching my youngest how to drive right now. She’s almost done with her hours and requirements. But when our daughter, our first one, went off, drove by herself. Like, it was emotional. This is growing up, but it’s also scary out there.

Art Eddy [00:10:57]:
So those are the things you, like, have to trust. You can’t be that helicopter parent you were when you were, like, when they first were learning how to walk. And you’re just near them and making. Making sure that they don’t, like, fall and hit their head or something like that. But now it’s totally different and you’re letting the reins go. You have let the reins go for a while now, but it’s just those are the moments where life gives you a little push. And it’s like you got to make sure that you did the best you could. And I bet you probably when your oldest was going off to college, you’re like, did I say everything I needed to say before she left? And it’s just, like, frustrating when things pop up and it’s like, I’ll talk to them later about it, but, like, are you going to find that time? So it is always that struggle of letting go, but also making sure you give them all of your, like, the wisdom you think that they’ll need in the future.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:42]:
And you’re never going to be able to unpack everything. You’re never going to be able to give them everything. The way I look at it is, is that what you at least can hope for is that you’ve given them enough and that you’ve given them the tools to one, figure out things for themselves, or two, give them the ability to be able to say, hey, I need to call dad. I need to ask and see what he has to say. And know that you’re always gonna be able to be there if she needs you. But that at the same time, you want her to fail, you want her to learn, and you want her to grow. Now, speaking of that, in regards to helping your daughters to be able to kind of learn, grow, and be kind of ready for the things that they want in their life. Every one of our daughters has passions, they have dreams, they have things that you talked about.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:34]:
Music and track and things that in high school are important to them. But as they get older, they start to up ideas for who do they want to be, what do they want to do? And those become the passion and dreams that they’re aiming for. The light at the end of the tunnel, the goals that they’ve. They’ve set for themselves. How do you support your daughters in pursuing those passions and dreams?

Art Eddy [00:12:55]:
Great question. Listening. I think the biggest thing is listening. And when they ask for advice, you can give it and say like, you know, I always preface saying, when I was around your age, things were a little bit different. But there are some similarities. Cliches happen, are there for a reason because they happen throughout eons and all that. I remember one of the podcasts I had, I was talking to a gentleman and he was saying the best advice he got from his father in law is like, things change. Technology changes.

Art Eddy [00:13:22]:
Everything here and there is like the one thing that’s constant is people having babies. In parenthood there hasn’t been like this huge advancement in the sense of like yes, certain things through a medical system and all this other stuff. Yes. But it’s like for the most part nothing has really changed. So it’s like people have been doing it, people have been making mistakes, but the generations are still living on and I think just making sure that you’re listening into seeing what they want at that time. There are certain things that I’ve watched from the quote unquote sidelines being like, that’s what they want to do. But I don’t see them like having any drive or what I would have done. Like, it’s hard to separate what, how I would approach it versus how they would approach it.

Art Eddy [00:13:58]:
And there’s certain times where they’ve experienced, whether it’s through school, I mean they get good grades, great grades, they do really, really well with friends and some other things. But whether it’s like managing a budget or sometimes not studying as much, I said, hey, you know, mom and I were saying you should have kind of done this. But like, what did you think? What did you feel? Did you feel like you were online with your friends more than you should have, like playing Roblox or something? Like that’s like the whole rage where like after dinner and they get all their work done, they’ll stay up for a while and playing out. I’m like, you guys go with everything. Like, yeah. And then there’s certain times where like she had to make my youngest or my oldest had to like prepare their lunch for the next day because like I’ll get them the ingredients from like you have to, to make it, this is your lunch. If they’re running late or something, or not feeling good, sure I’ll make them breakfast and all that other stuff. But for the most part you want them to be self sufficient.

Art Eddy [00:14:44]:
But there are certain times where like you just kind of like smile and wave. And then there’s other times you’re like, how’d that turn out? And then you don’t be like mean or something. But you’re like, seriously, like, how did you feel like that worked out? And did you think you could have probably done better? And you just want to give them those learning moments while it’s in the moment. If they don’t listen to you, that’s fine. But then if they succeed doing it their own way, perfect. But if there’s other things, like, hey, I might have probably let down, like, I probably would have played less Roblox, my friends online and studied for us a little bit more. But again, like, they get great. They get great grades, but I think sometimes they get ticked off if they get a B or something.

Art Eddy [00:15:19]:
And it’s like, well, like, if you wanted the better results, you needed to put more work in. And they’re like, I know that, but we’ve all had that. This is an adult. There’s certain things I kind of need to do X, Y and Z around the house. But there’s a new Star wars animated series that just dropped two episodes. I. I’m going to watch that right now. And then my day gets a little pushed on the next day, a little bit more busy just because I kind of should have done stuff on, like, Monday.

Art Eddy [00:15:40]:
Now it’s left for Tuesday, if that makes sense. And so there are certain times where my kids call me out and I’ll be like, yeah, you’re right. I should practice what I preach. And this time I didn’t. So thanks for calling me out. And you want to make sure that you, like, I think nowadays as you see this as well, like, there are so many, whether it’s online or in conversations where if someone knows that they’re wrong, but they’re still, like, trying to prove that they’re right. It’s like, it’s okay to admit that you’re wrong and move on, say you’re sorry, or like, hey, I should have known a little bit more information before I jumped into that conversation. So those are the things that, like, we have these conversations where, yes, I’m still the parent, they’re still the kid, but we.

Art Eddy [00:16:13]:
As they get older, you’re gonna. There’s that gap where it’s shortening and letting them be more vocal instead of just telling them, like, no, it’s bedtime, like when they’re a toddler. So those are the things.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:24]:
One of the things that that says to me is that none of us are perfect. Right? I mean, our daughters aren’t perfect. We’re not perfect. We’re humans. We might make mistakes, and they may make mistakes. It’s about how do you talk about it, how do you communicate, how do you work through it in the end? You know, speaking of mistakes, I know that as fathers, we always make mistakes and we don’t always show it, but we do make mistakes. What’s a mistake that you’ve made as a. As a dad, and what did you learn from it about fostering, I guess, more positive communication with your daughters?

Art Eddy [00:16:56]:
I would say. And I think this maybe is a stereotype or something that dads kind of go through. There’s different levels of suffering and silence, but, like, it’s like, on a smaller scale where it’s most of the time and just with our schedules and stuff like that, even, you know, teaching a class at UNC or, you know, running the Art of Fatherhood, I’m the one that mostly picks up my youngest teaches, like, you know, gets a drive time hours and makes the meals, does the cleaning, does the cooking and all that stuff, because I’m very robotic and I’m very strategic in my weekly. I know Tuesday is going to be cleaning day, and all of a sudden, like, my laundry pattern is down to, like, a science, right? Sometimes I’m going to need help, and sometimes, whether things get, you know, more things get piled on my plate, I don’t ask for help. And there are some times where I get frustrated. If someone didn’t pick up the thing, I asked them, like, three times in a row, and then like, the fourth time I’m like, fine, I’ll just do it myself. And I. And they’re like, well, why are you upset? I’m like, because I’m doing everything.

Art Eddy [00:17:46]:
Like, well, tell us. You need help, right? So, like, I think sometimes asking for help and what stinks is you think, like, we can put all the burden on ourselves. It’s not a great model to teach our kids. So that’s the thing where it’s like, I’ve messed up a couple times. And that’s the thing where maybe in the beginning, as when I became a dad, like, learning how to be patient. Now it’s like, I need to, like, ask for help. And that is really hard for me to do because I don’t want to burden anybody with stuff I need to do, if that makes sense.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:13]:
It does make sense. And you’ve talked about your podcast a few times, and I want to talk a little bit about that because you’ve been doing Art of Fatherhood for many years now and probably of fatherhood podcasts that I know of. I think yours is probably one of the longest standing That I know that is still running today, but not everyone has listened to it. And I guess I want to go back in time a little bit first and talk to me a little bit about why art of fatherhood. Why did you decide that you wanted to do this? I know that your background is in radio and in media, and you worked in that for many years, but when you pivoted and you went to create the art of fatherhood, you didn’t have to do that. You could have kept doing the radio thing. You could have done something else, but you went all in. So talk to me about that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:56]:
Why did you decide to do that? And why have you kept doing it for this many years?

Art Eddy [00:19:00]:
Yeah, thank you for asking. I appreciate it. I was working in radio. We had our second child, and my wife and I were like, all right, let’s. We don’t want to go to the daycare route. And again, like, for anybody doing daycare, I’m not. I always feel like I have to say, like, I’m not judging. Like, it was just something like, every family pieces of advice for new dads, if they’re listening to this.

Art Eddy [00:19:17]:
It’s like, your family does not have to keep up the Joneses or that Instagram family that looks like everything is glamorous on every photo. But my wife and I were like, yeah, one of us. You need to stay home. And radio wasn’t the most secure landscapes in career field. So I was like, all right, I’ll be the home dad. And I started writing for, like, maybe Yahoo, Bleacher Report and some other things. Once I started getting my own pattern down of being the stay at home dad and then the different groups, like, you know, meeting you, the dad 2.0 conference. I started working for a fatherhood site, doing a lot of creative and writing stuff, and then started doing the podcast.

Art Eddy [00:19:49]:
And then that kind of disbanded years ago. And so I’m like, I still want to do this because I have a passion for talking about it. I feel like not only do I love talking about father, but I feel like it makes me a better father because I’m in forest and like, I understand, like, all the different conversations and all the. The conversations that I have and me reflecting on fatherhood as through my writing, I’m like, it makes me better. And I feel like there’s a space that you and I are doing this because not just to hear ourselves talk, but we have a passion for making sure that we’re not only being good dads ourselves, but highlighting other good dads. And you Want to break those stereotypes here and there of what dads look like. And we’re not. We’re not looking to create these awesome Instagram accounts.

Art Eddy [00:20:29]:
And, like, these are the words of wisdom. It’s real life fatherhood. And so that’s my passion. So I went out on my own, obviously, have a little dad joke in there, the art of fatherhood. And sometimes, you know, people will be like. When emails are like, hey, what’s up, Eddie? I’m like, actually, my first name’s Art. And they’re like, oh, I get it now. It’s like, yeah, it’s like, so I just love it.

Art Eddy [00:20:52]:
But it’s really, for me, just seeing the different viewpoints of fatherhood. I was just. Last night, I was with. I run at our church, like a men’s ministry group, me and a couple other guys. And we try and like, throughout the year, we have, you know, some service events where we’ll clean up the church or we’ll clean up other. Do other things around community service, but then we’ll have fun events. This one was a fun event where we had some pizza. It was just a bunch of guys playing can jam and, you know, talking to just having fun, like pizza, soda, seltzer, all that good stuff, and just hang out at a park.

Art Eddy [00:21:22]:
And we were just talking about, like, how people pretty much are more connected than they see than they seem on the media, where there’s such this great divide, right? And I think for you and I, we’re trying to have positive examples of father, but also too, like, we’re seeing the connections that we’re more similar than we are different, and we’re not as divisive as different news organizations want to pin us to be. So my passion is to, like, have a great conversation on fatherhood, positive examples of fatherhood, and a community of dads are looking to do things. Like, I even feel bad we’re white guys, right? But, like, you see black dads or other minority dads, maybe in this country or worldwide, have a bad reputation and have, like, go on these stereotypes. I love bringing all guys from different walks of life, whether they’re Christian, Jewish, Muslim, whatever the case may be talking about fatherhood in a positive way, seeing that you might look different, but you actually have the same goal of raising great people in this world. We need more of that instead of just looking for clickbait, like. Like, I have seen even parenting sites, and you’ve probably seen this too, where they create this controversial question just so where they can, like, create more clicks or Whatever. Like, I’m not about that. I’m just.

Art Eddy [00:22:34]:
You and I are both about positive things. Like, especially people listening to your podcast, you want dads to connect with their daughters in a healthy and positive way. So, like, you and I are on the same page with that. So that’s where, like, the art of fatherhood and, like, that’s like, what fuels my passion all the time.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:49]:
And I know you’ve had a couple of different podcasts, and in the past, when you were affiliated with the Life of Dad podcast, you had a book with John Finkel called Life of Reflections on Fatherhood from Today’s Leaders, Icons, and Legendary Dads. But since then, like you said, going off on your own and having art of fatherhood, you’ve continued to have those conversations, and I guess you’ve had many of them. And I’m sure that in those conversations, some trends have popped up, some things have come out where you like. Either one, yep, it reinforces the idea. Or two, you know, I never thought of it that way, and I think all dads need to be thinking about some things in this way. So what are some of those trends? So what are some of those things that you found in all of these conversations that you’ve been able to have?

Art Eddy [00:23:40]:
Yeah, great question. Some of the trends are. I mentioned it before when I was, you know, when my kids were younger, like, having patience. I think when I ask, you know, like, a piece of advice for, you know, new dads that I’m asking my guests so that they can offer to them that are listening, it’s like, no, it’s like, you need to have patience. Everyone’s going to work on that. And another thing, too is like, people, like, especially nowadays listening to this finances, right? Like, people think, like, kids are expensive. Yes, kids are super expensive. I think if you have kids in high school and they’re kind of on the border of going to college and all this other stuff, like, like, I felt like this was the most expensive year of school and, like, getting ready for college for me and my wife, like, just, just in general of, like, all these different trips, all these different new.

Art Eddy [00:24:24]:
Like, one of my daughters went to, like, a brand new school and they have the only two classes, sophomore and freshman, and she’s a sophomore. So it’s just like all the different expenses with this and that, and it’s like, like finances. Like, there’s always going to be finances, but you find a way. And then two is just the idea of putting the phone down. Like, you hear people say, I need to Put the phone down. I need to put the phone down. And the more and more I hear about that, like, I remember my mom worked in the medical field, like, working for, like, you know, working in, like, in the office space, like, helping out with the doctors and all that other stuff when I was in, like, elementary and middle school and high school. And then my dad worked in the medical device field.

Art Eddy [00:25:03]:
So, like, he was, like, busy with certain things, but when they got home, they were home.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:08]:
Home.

Art Eddy [00:25:08]:
Chris, I’m. I’m guessing there are certain times for work or for your podcast, there’s just other things, like the phone bings and it’s like a notification. Even you have no notifications off. You might still like, did I get that email that I was waiting for, for the end of the day? And then you miss that opportunity to talk with your kids. So putting your phone down. Putting your phone down. And that’s why we love having, you know, dinner. There’s no devices at the table.

Art Eddy [00:25:29]:
And then there’s certain times we’ll be watching a show together, or my wife and the girls will go to the gym together. Whatever, whatever. I work out at home. I used to work out at the gym with them, too. But, like, when the pandemic came, I got all the stuff. I’m like, well, I’m just working out here. So, like, that’s. That’s the, like, I guess the downside, but, like, when I go to the gym as a guest pass, like, they love having you here.

Art Eddy [00:25:47]:
I’m like, yeah, just whatever. It’s just my routine. But I would say those are the trends of, like, putting the phone down. Finances. There’s always going to be tough battles that you’re going to have, like, make sure you’re communicating with your spouse about that and the patient. So those are, like, the trends I see. And then the things that I’ve learned, like, you’re asking me, I’d say, say in terms of finances, I’ve had guys who are in the financial area and just like, in the industry and. And work and different things.

Art Eddy [00:26:11]:
And it’s just the idea of, like, teaching your kids about money at an early age, I thought was like, man, I wish I kind of did that. I wish I had this conversation when my kids were, you know, 10 and 8 or something like that. Like, they have an allowance. They. We told them how to budget certain things here and there. But there’s more certain things. I was like, that would have been better if I told him that. So what about, like, managing finances and having those being, you know, financially responsible.

Art Eddy [00:26:36]:
And we’ve been having more and more conversations with that, especially with our oldest as she gets into getting to go to college and all that. I was gonna say getting into the real world, I hate that. I feel like we’re always in the real world, but like, it almost like dumbs down our kids experiences because they are in the real world. Going to school, having a part time job, all these other things. So that’s why I kind of paused for that. It’s like everyone’s like, why, why? What was going on there? So I just almost had to catch myself. But I wanted to explain it. But like just the idea of learning the finances, but then also too embracing technology is something that I’ve kind of had to learn because we always like, I think when you and I were in our heyday, when, you know, I’d say around like 2015, 2016, like dads were having a moment and I remember you and I were kind of doing campaigns on like screen time and digital age and all these other things.

Art Eddy [00:27:22]:
But if you, you negate your kids learning the technology that’s happening around them, but you want to do in a healthy way and there’s different ways you can do that, different companies and different apps and all that other stuff. But like if you tell them like, oh, they’re not having any screen time, okay, that’s fine. Like maybe they’re not watching shows. If you teach them about technology, whether it’s a smartphone or whether it’s an app or something, like developing code or whatever, that’s a thing where you got to kind of embrace that. And that was the thing where I was just like, like, oh, screen time. Okay, yes, but how do you manage that? And how do you teach the kids about the future? Because like our, like our parents growing up, their rate of technology change was a lot slower than ours. And the, the rate of technology change for our kids is super fast compared to when we were growing up. You picked up a phone, a landline, and we were online doing like a report on Abraham Lincoln for high school.

Art Eddy [00:28:15]:
The Internet just got disconnected because someone picked up and had to make a phone call. So I’m just saying like technology and learning how to embrace it and the health, but also talk about the negative sides as well, I think are certain things. And then also too, you see, I don’t know if you’ve read this as well, but a lot of kids are underage, drinking is going down, but now that weed and some other things are available, like that’s popping up like Gummies and other stuff. Like, so that’s the thing where it’s like, how do you. You gotta also be, like, talking about certain things where. When we used to say, like, oh, yeah, you know, weed, that’s illegal now. It’s legal in certain things in a certain age. Like, how do you teach your kids about that, too? And navigating that space.

Art Eddy [00:28:50]:
So that’s another thing that I’ve learned talking to some other, you know, dads and moms along the journey, too. If you shy them from everything, then as soon as they get out and expose, they’re like, what’s this? What’s this? It’s like, you should have those conversations before things get. When they’re out of your home. And like, they’re like, I wish dad and mom talked to me more about this. You know?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:07]:
Completely understand that. Now. As you think about the future of the art of fatherhood, I ask two questions. One, what’s in store if you can unveil and lift the curtain a little bit? But two, who’s that elusive guest? Who’s the one that you’ve been. Because you’ve had a lot of celebrities, you’ve had sports people, you’ve had. I mean, you’ve had a lot of people and had a lot of opportunity to have a lot of people. But who’s the unicorn? Who’s the one that you’ve really wanted to have that you’ve not been able to capture yet?

Art Eddy [00:29:37]:
Nothing to, like, unveil or nothing, like, behind the curtain, so to speak, for the art of father. I just, again, like, just kind of like you. Like, I see the work that you put in week in and week out in. It’s. I wouldn’t say slow and steady. It’s steady because I don’t think the work that you and I do are slow at all. It’s just the. The pace that we need to.

Art Eddy [00:29:54]:
It’s steady in terms of this and in the content that people expect from you and I. So, like, that’s the thing where I’m like, okay, keep it going. There are some other things I’m trying to maybe work out. Maybe some new columns, some new ideas in terms of maybe the certain questions I ask or whatever. But for the most part, if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it. I appreciate the feedback I get from people and the reviews and the subscriptions, all that good stuff. People, when I talk to them about sponsorships, like, I really love what you’re doing. Like, all right, cool.

Art Eddy [00:30:19]:
The elusive guest, I would say, like, and and it’s funny. It’s more of, like, being a Jordan fan. My friends are like, when are you gonna get Jordan? Because I’ve had, like, Mark Ham. I’ve had. I’ve interviewed Bo Jackson, Dave Robinson, like, Jerry Rice, Joe Montana, like, my sports idols. Like, people I appreciated as a kid growing up. Like, when you get in Michael Jordan, I’m like, do you know how hard it is for people in the sports landscape to talk about, like, to get an interview? I said, like, if it happens, that’d be great. But, like, right now, he’s doing this nascar.

Art Eddy [00:30:44]:
Like, I think most of my friends, especially my friends from high school, being like, oh, I see you interviewed so and so when you get in Jordan, I’m like, thanks, man. Let me celebrate this win first, and I’ll try to see if I can get Jordan. So I think that’s, like, that was the thing. And teaching at unc, everyone’s like, you’re gonna get Belichick. And I’m like, unc’s huge, man. Like, I. I don’t know, like, the. The intricacies of, like, trying to get everybody.

Art Eddy [00:31:06]:
And I don’t want to, like, put that card out there and be like, hey, like, I’m not going to be that guy, right? So it’s just the idea of, like, for me, it’s Jordan. And like I said, it’s mostly my friends being like, cool. You got this person. That’s awesome. When’s Jordan? I’m like, all right, thanks. So I’d say Jordan, yeah.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:20]:
For me, I have always wanted to have Dax Shepard on, and I’ve tried numerous times. Never been able to get him on. But I love the. How engaged he is as a father of daughters and how protective he is, too. But also, I think he has a lot that he could share beyond what he already shares on his own podcast. I don’t know if it’ll ever happen, but being someone. He’s also from Michigan, so love to have another Michigander and also a good dad on the show.

Art Eddy [00:31:49]:
But yeah, man, like, I keep again, like, it’s always, you gotta keep. And that’s another thing you can teach your kids, right? Whether they. They listen to this episode, but they’ll see the work that you’re putting in and what you want to do, right? And if you get him, then it’s like, they will see that win, and it’s just like, you might get 75 no’s. Sorry, he can’t do it. He’s busy. Nope, can’t do it. But then that’s 70 time. He’s like, how’s next week sound? Is there a good day? And you’re like, I’ll make it.

Art Eddy [00:32:14]:
Like, I’ll move heaven and earth to make sure this works. So, yeah, I hope you get a man. I really hope you get them. And again, it’s just, I think all the things that we try and do, not just in this fatherhood space, but we should share our victories with our kids just so that they know, okay, it is going to take work, I think, especially nowadays with the. I’m talking on both sides of my mouth about social media and technology. But, like, social media, like fomo, exists now because people are seeing other things. I think when we were kids, FOMO promo was like, you. You’re riding your bike and you see all your friends at one house with other bikes just standing in the lawn and be like, why don’t I get called? Or, why didn’t someone get me? Right? Like, now everybody has it right in their face if they, you know, are on social media and stuff like that.

Art Eddy [00:32:50]:
So, like, there is that grind that a lot of people sometimes don’t see that you’re putting in. So hopefully you get them.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:56]:
Man, I appreciate it. Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our dad connection. 6. Six more questions to delve a little bit more into you as a dad. You ready? Yep. What’s one word, word that describes your relationship with your daughters?

Art Eddy [00:33:08]:
Communicative.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:33:08]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice you’ve ever received?

Art Eddy [00:33:12]:
Yeah, two ears and one mouth for a reason. Listen more, talk less.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:33:16]:
What’s one activity that you and your daughters love doing together?

Art Eddy [00:33:19]:
I would say any type of, like, video games, whether it’s NHL or whether it’s Mario Kart or something on the Nintendo Switch. A certain plane like that. Or go and see movies we love, like checking out movies.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:33:29]:
If you could give your daughters one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Art Eddy [00:33:34]:
You’re enough.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:33:35]:
And what’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Art Eddy [00:33:38]:
How much love you can have for another person.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:33:40]:
And finally, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Art Eddy [00:33:48]:
Talk to your kids on their level. Never say, like, oh, don’t worry about this. It’ll pass. Understand where they’re at, meet them where they are, then they’re going to meet you where you are, and you’ll have a great relationship.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:33:59]:
Well, Art, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for being here today for being a part of the show, for the work that you’re doing. If people want to find out more about you and the art of fatherhood, where should they go?

Art Eddy [00:34:09]:
Artofatherhood.net podcast comes out every Monday. Different articles throughout the week. But again, I really appreciate the time. I love the work that you’re doing. Again, like, our friendship is great and over the years we’ve like, you know, we can just like text each other or just send, you know, DMs or something like that to make us chuckle. But again, it’s really cool to see not just your wins, but also your family’s wins, too, and different things that we see out like that you post on social media. But yeah, it’s always been a blast and I always appreciate taking time to chat with you, man.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:35]:
Same here. And I wish you the best as you get your daughter ready for college and as you transition into being a dad with one daughter in the household. It does change things and it, and it definitely takes a little bit of time and patience, but you’ll get there. And as always, thanks again for all that you do.

Art Eddy [00:34:54]:
Appreciate you, man. Thank you. That’s a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Connection.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:58]:
Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect. It’s about being present.

Art Eddy [00:35:09]:
If you enjoyed this episode, be sure

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:35:11]:
to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad.

Art Eddy [00:35:14]:
And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes at dadanddaughterconnection.com until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Performer

We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, we give the lessons, we make some meals, we buy them presents and bring your A game Cause those kids are growing fast the time goes by just like a dynamite blast Calling astronauts and firemen Carpenters and muscle men get out and be the world to them. Be the best dad you can be. Be the best dad you can be.

The Power of Presence: Building Strong Bonds Between Dads and Daughters

June 22, 2026 by dadofdivas

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

What does it mean to truly connect with your daughter? That’s the central question explored in the latest episode of the “Dad and Daughter Connection” podcast, where Dr. Christopher Lewis welcomes guest Brandon Smith for an honest, insightful and at times emotional conversation about fatherhood, mistakes, and building resilient, confident daughters.

From the start, Brandon Smith distinguishes between “intended” and “unintended” moments in parenting, emphasizing that the unscripted, everyday experiences often make the deepest impact. Whether it’s a trip for just the two of them or sitting quietly in support during a crisis, simply showing up consistently is the anchor of a strong bond. As Brandon Smith shares, “the small moments mattered the most” — a lesson he learned not only in his journey as a dad but also through the advice of other fathers.

The episode dives deep into the challenges dads face: resisting the urge to “fix” everything, sitting with difficult emotions, and learning to ask open-ended questions that give daughters the space to vent, reflect, and find their own solutions. Dr. Christopher Lewis and Brandon Smith steer the conversation toward agency, urging fathers to build their daughters’ confidence and resilience by empowering them to make decisions — even allowing for failure as an important part of growth.

It’s not about being perfect. It’s about being truly present — listening, apologizing when you get it wrong, and making your child a priority. Brandon Smith reminds listeners that kids are far more forgiving than we think, as long as we’re willing to acknowledge our mistakes and keep trying. Traditions, whether as simple as a regular dinner or a unique holiday ritual, also play a role in creating a safe foundation daughters can count on, even as they gain independence.

Fathers of daughters — whether your relationship is close or still growing, this episode of “Dad and Daughter Connection” is packed with real advice, vulnerable stories, and practical tips to help you show up as the dad your daughter needs.

Ready to deepen your connection? Tune in to the full episode and join Dr. Christopher Lewis and Brandon Smith on the journey to raising strong, independent women.

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week I love that you come back. You come back to learn, to grow and to find new ways to be able to build those intentional connections with your daughter.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:06]:
And it’s so important because we have to show up. We’ve got to show up every day. We’ve got to learn from the things we do well. We got to learn from the things that we mess up on as well, because there’s going to be times that are going to go perfectly and then other times where we’ll. They may be an epic fail. And that’s okay. That the fact that you do show up, the fact that you do come back and you’re willing to, to learn and to hear others stories about their journeys says a lot about you and it says a lot about where you want to be as a father. This podcast is here to give you some help, some perspective, some thoughts on fatherhood.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:42]:
Every week I love being able to bring you different people with different experiences that have gone through their own fatherhood journey and they’re still going through their fatherhood journey. And today we got another great guest. Brandon Smith is with us today and Brandon is a return guest, I’m going to say, in some aspects, not he wasn’t a return guest from this podcast, but for those of you that have been listening to me for a while, you know that I had another podcast called Dads with Daughters, and Brandon’s a past guest from that show. So if you want to find that episode, go over to fathering together, you can check that out. It’s still out there. And he’ll add some hot sauce to your fatherhood as well. And I’ll leave it at that because and tease that out. But I’m really excited to be able to have Brandon on.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:26]:
We’re going to be talking about his own journey with his daughter. And I look forward for you to get to know him as well. Brandon, thanks so much for being here today.

Brandon Smith [00:02:33]:
Chris. I’m thrilled to be on and I love, I love what we’re going to be talking about here today. I’m very, very passionate about it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:38]:
You know, one of the things that I love starting off with when I think about fatherhood is all of us as dads want to create those meaningful moments where we, we truly are able to, to connect with our daughters. What’s one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share with your daughter thus far and what made it so special?

Brandon Smith [00:02:58]:
So I’m going to answer that in two ways. So there was the intended moments where you get to plan them, but then there’s the unintended moments that you, that you don’t get to plan them. I would argue the unintended moments are probably more impactful. But let’s talk about the intended moments. So I’ve got three kids. My daughter Abby is my oldest. She’s 24. She’s graduated, working a full time job.

Brandon Smith [00:03:18]:
She’s doing great. We’ll talk more about that then. I have a son who’s Noah, who’s 21, and then a son Aaron, who’s 18. Well, whenever my kids were 12, I would always take them, just me and that kiddo, to Disney World, just me and that one kid. So we could just do whatever they want to do. They didn’t have to negotiate rides and restaurants with their siblings. And we just get that time together. And I kind of kept that tradition going with Abby.

Brandon Smith [00:03:38]:
So when she went off to University of Georgia, she was in a sorority. The nice thing about sororities is they have a lot of planned events. So they’ve got like parent weekends, but then they have mommy daughter weekend and then they have a daddy daughter weekend. So I did that with her every year. So there was always times I was going there, just me and her for weekends and time together. And then even during her summers when she was doing internships and things, you know, she would, we would find time for just she and I to meet up in the city some where and just kind of explore together. So there was those schedule times which I think were really, really important. I would argue that the most important times were the times when she was in crisis.

Brandon Smith [00:04:11]:
And I just sat with her. I was just with her, just being present, not trying to solve it, not trying to offer advice, just sit and listen. And that’s really hard now to be fair. We haven’t Talked much about my background. I have a slightly unfair advantage. I was trained as a clinical therapist, so I do bring that to bear. So I know how to ask questions and listen and do kind of reflective, which does help. But I think those moments were probably the most important, and there were several.

Brandon Smith [00:04:38]:
There was one where when she was graduating from college and there had been a death in her sorority, it really rattled my daughter. And on top of that, she had broken her leg, and she was a big runner, so she couldn’t run. That was her stress relief. Let me tell you, Chris, I’m not sure if I’d want to go relive that weekend with her, but it was an impactful one because I just got to sit there with her while she just kind of raged and vented and just had all those emotions just kind of flood. I once heard somewhere that part of the role of the difference between kind of dads and daughters, or men and women, husbands and wives, and in those dynamics, women are often like the waves of the ocean. They kind of come and go. And sometimes when two. When a wife and a daughter kind of come together, sometimes those waves can create some storms.

Brandon Smith [00:05:18]:
Men are kind of like the rock wall on the side of the coast, and the water’s supposed to kind of hit it, but not move it. So we’re kind of almost supposed to be there kind of that steady, steady, consistent force. I don’t know why that image has always stood out for me, but I know that there’s been moments when I’ve been that kind of that. That rock wall and just allowed her to just kind of vent and rage and not be overwhelmed by that. The most impactful. So a long answer to your question, my friend.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:41]:
Not a problem at all. You know, I have heard what you said earlier about being willing to just sit and listen from many people and not to solve. And that’s not an easy thing for dads to always do. It tends to take a little bit of reprogramming in our brains to be able to get to that point. Talk to me about that for yourself. And I know you said you have a unfair advantage, so maybe you can give some advice for dads that are struggling with that in regards to what either you had to do or what you might recommend that dads do, to be able to reprogram their brains, to be able to be more of those quiet listeners versus the solvers.

Brandon Smith [00:06:20]:
I think the first thing is to recognize that those emotions don’t mean that something’s broken or something’s wrong. So the Things that we want to not do is either jump in and say, no, you must not feel this way. You must feel this way. Trying to change what they’re feeling. Not a good idea. That’s really bad. Dads and daughters, moms and daughters, not good. You don’t want to do that.

Brandon Smith [00:06:38]:
Second, it’s okay to sit in that discomfort. I know it was my own case of. With my father, he was very different. He could not handle any kind of uncomfortable emotion at all. There was if I. If you just got excited and passionate about a topic at dinner, he’d get up and leave the dinner table. He’s gonna handle it. And my entire life, if I talked to my dad, he’d stick his hand out in my face, wave it back and forth, and he’d say, stop talking.

Brandon Smith [00:06:57]:
None of my business. He really just couldn’t handle that. So I would encourage dads first to just be okay with sitting there. You don’t have to fix it. And. And that negative energy isn’t going to hurt you or hurt them. We need to give them a safe space to let it out. So that’s first.

Brandon Smith [00:07:14]:
Second step. How do you help them let it out? It’s by asking a lot of questions and just reflecting back. Just. Just by saying things like that sounds really hard. How are you doing with that? And just letting them go or say, wow, that is just. That’s a lot. Or one of the great therapist lines, which you can always use in your playbook, works really well in life. Say more about that.

Brandon Smith [00:07:32]:
You can never go wrong with. Just say more about that. And you can start off by saying that. That guys, that sounds really hard. Say more about that. What’s the hardest part? So really sit in it now. Where dads are going to go wrong. Another part where they’re going to go wrong is they’re going to go, so how do you think we need to fix it? You don’t need to do that.

Brandon Smith [00:07:46]:
You don’t need to jump to fixing it. Just let them go. Let them go until that energy really starts to wane. Now, to be fair, my daughter’s grown up with me, and she has very good skills like this. So there’s times I was doing that with her on that moment, I told you, and she said to me, I know what you’re doing. Stop it. So I had to pivot. And one of the ways for my daughter that works really well is when I then get vulnerable, talk about something I’m struggling with in my life, or I get really kind of authentic.

Brandon Smith [00:08:12]:
She connects really well to that my daughter has never done, she came out this way. She’s never done well with people being not performative but, but, but not being real, not really saying what’s really going on. She cannot handle that. So she actually does really well with me just kind of being open and honest and just calling things the way they are. That actually settles her down. So just having some more of that honest dialog and just being present and not trying to change it. I think those are, those are the moments. And she’ll say today, she’ll say, you know, one of the things I’m most proud of, she’ll say if Brandon Smith me says he’s going to be there, he’s going to be there.

Brandon Smith [00:08:42]:
And as a dad that’s really meaningful. I’m feel myself even getting tearing up a little bit just saying that because what dad doesn’t want to hear their kiddo say that? So I would say those are probably two good tips. Just learning to be comfortable in that and then learning how to just ask questions to help it release. By helping it release, you’re fixing it. So I think that’s probably the last thing I’d say. For dads, you don’t have to have a plan of action with three steps or five steps or a phone call you’re going to make today. It doesn’t have to be that clear cut. Just by helping that emotion go, it’ll make a difference.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:08]:
As our daughters are born, for many years they, they rely so much on us and as they get old they become more and more independent. How did you balance guiding your daughter while also giving her the independence that she needed to be able to grow into the person that she has become?

Brandon Smith [00:09:28]:
It’s a really good question. And this is where we often. So in my professional world, I take a lot of my coaching background and my counseling background and bring it into the workplace and helping leaders get better and those sorts of things. Do a lot of executive coaching kind of work and, and what I think makes this so challenging, it’s kind of like leadership is an art and a science. Parenting is an art and a science. I mean every, every K is a little different. Every situation’s a little different. There’s no one size fits all.

Brandon Smith [00:09:51]:
Sometimes you got to pivot with your recipe. And so where it’s tricky is I’m always trying as a parent, I’m always trying to instill agency. It’s my favorite word. If you ask me, my favorite word on this planet is it’s agency. And for those of you that don’t kind of know the word agency. What we’re talking about when we’re talking about agency for a person, when you have a sense of agency, it’s almost like you tell yourself, I’m enough in the world. I’m not perfect. No one’s perfect.

Brandon Smith [00:10:13]:
But I’m enough. I can get through it. And we have high levels of agency. We have competence and confidence, and we have resilient, and we handle change well. Change doesn’t overwhelm us. What we don’t have when we have high levels of agency is heightened anxiety. Anxiety is the absence of agency. So if you got a really anxious kiddo, just really fearful, kind of struggling with dealing with life, agency is a great antidote.

Brandon Smith [00:10:35]:
I’m always trying to instill that. So the way you instill that is you ask a lot of questions. So, wow, that sounds really hard. Well, what do you think you can do about that? What do you. What do you think you need to do? How do you think you can solve that? How can I help you with that? But you’re. But you’re putting the answers, you’re putting the solutioning, you’re putting the authorship on that, kiddo. So book I published in 2022 is called the author versus editor dilemma. That’s a lot to do with workplaces and leadership and management.

Brandon Smith [00:10:57]:
But I always do a chapter in every one of my books on parenting, and there’s even a chapter in Author editor about that. Like, when should I sit in the author seat and tell them what to do? When should I sit in the editor seat and they tell me what they’re going to do and then I can respond to that. So you want them to have that agency, all solutions to problems. That sometimes means they’re going to fail, and that is okay. Where we need to kind of watch closely is we don’t want the failure to be catastrophic. Failures are good. That’s when you learn. We learn the most in times of failure.

Brandon Smith [00:11:22]:
My midd kiddo, he just went through the college internship process this year. It’s been really tough on college students and interns to find internships this year. It’s a tougher cycle. He had a couple lined up. He waited too long. The offers exploded on him and he had to scramble. And my wife and I were thinking how we could help him. Well, he ended up coming up with an internship on his own.

Brandon Smith [00:11:40]:
He found one, and he’s loving it. And I think the fact he recovered on his own, I mean, that’s really what you want. You Want that level of agency. So all that to say, you know, you’re trying to equip them to solve problems on their own. You’re going to support them. And even when my kids were little, they come home and say, oh, the teacher’s being me. The teacher’s bullying me. It triggers that inner parenting instinct.

Brandon Smith [00:11:58]:
You want to jump in and say, talk to that teacher. I always stopped myself and said, I’m not going to do that. And I would say, what conversation do you think you need to have? I know you can do it. I believe in you. And I said, I’ve got your back. I’ve got air cover for you. It doesn’t go well, you can call dad. Dad will jump in.

Brandon Smith [00:12:12]:
Dad will fix it, but why don’t you take the first crack? I did it with all my kids. I never had to have a conversation with the teacher. They would go back and they had it on their own because I was trying to again equip them to the agency. And also, those are great skills. You’re gonna have to have a conversation with your boss one day. Why don’t you learn that now? So then when you have to neg negotiate your salary or say you can’t work on the weekend, you learn how to do that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:30]:
Those are great examples. And I think, you know, I’ve. I feel like I’m going through a lot of those myself with my daughter that’s in college right now and figuring out, okay, where do I push, where do I pull, where do I just sit back? And that as you kind of talked about the author role or not. And so that’s always a challenge. And I think it always continues to be a challenge as you sit back and you’re like, I’ve been there. I’ve done that. You can learn from me, but you may need to make these mistakes yourself. And I get that too now, talking about intentional things and thinking in my head of what you just said.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:04]:
Some of the things that we do are very intentional. What are some intentional ways that you’ve worked throughout your daughter’s life to be able to strengthen that bond that you had with her, especially during those challenging times.

Brandon Smith [00:13:16]:
So my daughter’s a lot like a cat. You have to let her come to you. If you try and go to her too quickly, it’s not going to go very well. So being intentional, I think, is really important. I will say this. I think going back to the word agency, I often joke with my wife. My daughter kind of came out of the womb just frustrated because she didn’t have any agency because she’s 4 and she wants to do stuff. She’s 8 and she wants to do stuff.

Brandon Smith [00:13:36]:
She’s 12 and she wants to do stuff, and she can’t. And it got frustrated. Well, now she’s 24 and she works for a consulting firm, and she can do all the stuff. So I think that’s helped a lot. But I will say the hardest time for us was probably those high school years where it was the most pressure. And every year she went off to college, her feelings towards us improved, her connection towards us improved on her own, she made those things happen because I think she was just seeing her friends and some of their dynamics with their parents, and she realized we’re not so bad. And every time she called, we always made that time for her. So she calls my wife every day.

Brandon Smith [00:14:10]:
She talks to my wife every day. But she knows she can call me and I will drop whatever I’m doing if she calls me. So I think part of it is just being present with her, not being too pushy, but, you know, letting her come to me. The other thing was I always schedule time with her, and I always tell her, you are one of the most important people and most important relationships in my life. I really want to make sure we get to spend time together. And I find things that my kids like. My daughter likes to go to nice restaurants. She likes to try new food.

Brandon Smith [00:14:32]:
So we’ll go try the local Portuguese restaurant, or we’ll try the Persian restaurant or whatever happens to be. And so now that she’s on her own and she’s figuring out career stuff and life stuff, we try to do quarterly dinners. So we’ll do quarterly dinner. She’s still in Atlanta. I live in Atlanta. So we’ll meet up for dinner somewhere and just have a nice dinner and just talk about life, Talk about her career, her boyfriend, all the other things. I think it’s a little bit of both. It’s always kind of being there when they want to come to you.

Brandon Smith [00:14:57]:
That’s an intention and making them a priority. So that’s kind of more of a firefighter on call kind of intention. When the phone rings, I answer it. But there’s also keeping that connected. And I think when you plan something with someone, you’re signaling to them that they’re a priority. So when I tell my daughter, you mean a lot to me, and our relationship is very meaningful. I want to spend time with you. I’d love to take you out to dinner.

Brandon Smith [00:15:15]:
She never turns me down. So those are Some examples.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:18]:
I love those examples. And I try to have similar things with my own daughters. And I know that it makes a difference. Sometimes they say it, sometimes they don’t. And you have to know that. That you just have to realize that even if they don’t say it, it still matters. Now, none of us are perfect. We all make m mistakes.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:37]:
What’s a mistake that you’ve made as a father and what did you learn from it about fostering a positive connection with your daughter?

Brandon Smith [00:15:44]:
Oh, goodness. I’m going through my very large inventory of mistakes, Chris. So if I’m pausing, it’s because, wow, kind of a lot. Well, I would say I’ve done the opposite of a lot of things I’ve said. Like, I pushed on her too hard, pushed on solutions, pushed, pushed on answers, pushed for answers. That doesn’t go well with her. So that’s not good. But on the flip side, sometimes I don’t come to her when she’s upset.

Brandon Smith [00:16:06]:
That gets her really mad. So if she’s upset, upset, and she’s sending all the signals that she’s upset, and I’m not going to her saying, hey, you seem upset. And maybe I just don’t want to deal with it. I’m going to be honest. Maybe it’s just one of those times where I’m really tired. I don’t have much in the tank. Like, I can’t deal with her just, you know, her upsetness today, that makes her more angry because I’m not coming to her and acknowledging how she’s feeling. So I think there’s a lot around those things.

Brandon Smith [00:16:27]:
Yeah, it’s tricky. Parenting is such a startup experience. Fail fast or fail forward. You’re always trying to adjust. So, you know, I can tell you another great example, like when she was in high school and applying to colleges and she wasn’t getting the SAT score she wanted and she had one last shot, I mean, take the sat and like, I think it was October of your junior year last time. She could really take it and have it count. And she was procrastinating on studying for that, studying for that, studying for that. And whether this was good or bad to me, I’m not sure.

Brandon Smith [00:16:52]:
But I finally told her, I said, look, you don’t have to study for it. You can keep your same SAT scores, and then you’re going to go to this slate of colleges and they’re all perfectly fine. But if you want to go to this slate of colleges, you’re going to need to get that SAT score up. So you’re going to make a choice. And I said, if you want to go here, you’re going to have to do some studying, which means you can’t go off doing brunches on the weekend with your friends. You can’t do that. You got studying to do. You’re running out of time.

Brandon Smith [00:17:12]:
Time. Well, she went off. She said she wanted to do that. She wanted the other schools. She wanted a better score, but she kept doing the brunches. So finally, I had to go in one day and say, I’m sorry, Abby. I hate to do this. I’m your dad.

Brandon Smith [00:17:22]:
I want to honor your request of what you want. I’m grounding you for the next two weeks. You’re going nowhere. You can study. That’s what you can do. Now, I don’t know if that was the right decision or not. She did end up getting the score that she needed at the end of the day, so just barely by the skin of her teeth, but she got that score. But that was an example where I had to step in and ground her on something that she said she wanted, but she wasn’t living up to her own expectations of herself.

Brandon Smith [00:17:45]:
So. I don’t know. Plenty of times I’ve lost my temper with my kids. But I will say this. One of the big things I did learn in life is your kids really want to have a relationship with you. They are actually way more forgiving than we give them credit for. But they will not be forgiving if you don’t apologize. You have to be the first one to go say, I’m sorry.

Brandon Smith [00:18:02]:
Dad screwed up. I shouldn’t have handled it the way I did. I promise I’m not going to do that again going forward. And she. And she had a moment with me a few years ago. It was Christmas, and my wife and I were kind of in a little bit of a spat. And it was happening on Christmas Day, and my daughter was not happy about that. And so she came over to me and she pulled me aside, and she’s like, what’s going on? She was really upset, and I committed to her.

Brandon Smith [00:18:20]:
I said, I’m sorry. You’re right. This shouldn’t be happening on Christmas Day. I’m going to fix it. It’s not going to happen again. And that’s what I did. But you got to be willing to say you’re sorry, and you’re got to be willing to adjust. And if you do that, our kids aren’t expecting perfect from us.

Brandon Smith [00:18:31]:
They’re expecting, like, that effort that we’re trying so when you say you’re going to make a change, you make the change. But they don’t expect perfect.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:37]:
And what do you do intentionally to make your daughter feel valued and heard?

Brandon Smith [00:18:43]:
I saw an interview with Reese Wither Witherspoon at some point and she, she made a comment and dad, the words that a dad says to their daughter, it’s like permanent marker on their brain. And so I always want to feed her in that way. My daughter, you know, she doesn’t have a lot of money, but she likes to kind of get good fashion. So there’s like you could all these services, you rent clothes and she’ll run clothes, she’ll come downstairs and she’ll be wearing a new dress. And I’ll say, oh Abby, that dress is beautiful on you. You look absolutely just beautiful. And she’s like, oh, thanks dad. But I know that’s, I know that’s feeding into her self conscious and her level of confidence about herself or self talk.

Brandon Smith [00:19:15]:
I always tell her, you’ve got great skills, you’ve got great intuition on people. So I really look, lift up and reinforce her strengths. So not only does she feel kind of seen, but I’m also trying to tell her, you’ve got some great things, don’t lose those. So those are things I really try to be intentional about in my talk with her and also trying to give her support and guidance. Now sometimes it also means not answering her questions. So the recent one she was doing was she’s got a boyfriend who she really likes and we really like. And she’s asking me, she’s saying, dad, I mean, what do you think? I mean really, what do you think? I mean, do you think he’s a good fit for me? I mean, and we like him. And she had a particular thing she was asking about.

Brandon Smith [00:19:49]:
I said, you know, Abby, that’s not my answer. That’s not for me to answer. It’s a question for you to answer. And I laid out some scenarios and things for her. I said, but it’s not for me. She kept pushing on me, pushing on, trying to get me. I wouldn’t answer. I wouldn’t, wouldn’t answer.

Brandon Smith [00:20:00]:
A few days later she came to my wife and she said, tell dad I’m sorry for pushing him so hard. I was having a, it’s one of the phrases that you probably heard your daughter say recently. She’s like, I was having a crash out and I was pushing dad a little too hard and I, I shouldn’t have been telling actually everything’s okay. I’m fine with my boyfriend. So I think knowing sometimes when not to insert your opinions is also important.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:21]:
You don’t want to have those insert foot in mouth moments as you’re talking to your daughters and, or having to backpedal. So sometimes being silent or as you said, kind of pushing back and allowing for them to work it through probably makes a lot of sense.

Brandon Smith [00:20:36]:
It reminds me there was a Seinfeld episode where, you know, I think, I can’t remember, maybe Kramer had a girlfriend that no one liked. And so they all told him he broke up and we’re like, oh, we don’t like your girlfriend. And then they got back together. Then now it was awkward because they told Kramer we don’t like your girlfriend. But now he’s back with her girlfriend. So I think there’s times when you just have to some things or for them to figure out. And frankly, if she’s happy, that’s, I mean, that’s one of the things we’re going for.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:00]:
And how did you support your daughter in pursuing her passion and dreams?

Brandon Smith [00:21:04]:
It’s a challenging one. So in high school, she would come at my wife and me and she’d say, you guys put high expectations on me. You hold me an unfair standard. And it’s funny, Chris, we never did. We never did. We never did. My wife and I are little, a little Gen X in how we raise our kids. We’re a little, wouldn’t say feral, but a little more.

Brandon Smith [00:21:23]:
More like that in this way. We Never had life, 360 on any of our kids. We didn’t track them where they go. We never, once they got into high school, we never looked at the report cards again. Now I’ve never seen a report card for my kids in high school or college because what I told them was I said, your grades are your grades. And my expectation is you work hard and own and be proud of whatever grade you get. If you got a C and you didn’t work hard, then decide to make an adjustment. But if you got a C and you gave it everything you got, that’s great.

Brandon Smith [00:21:47]:
So I think part of it is setting that, pushing kind of that ownership and agency properly on them. It’s your life. Your grades are the beginning of that, but it’s just going to evolve into more decisions that are yours. I think the second thing is I’m always trying to remind her and reinforce to her what her natural gifts are, what her natural gifts and talents. I think so hard she’s trying to fit herself into a box. Like when she was in high school, she took a lot of computer science classes because she thought, oh, I’m a girl, I should take computer science classes because it’ll round me out. It was not her love language. It’s not her love language and she would tell you that.

Brandon Smith [00:22:17]:
But she has a lot of great love languages that she’s really passionate about. And I’m always trying to remind her of that because she’s in this early part of her career where she’s trying to figure out what does she want her career to look like. And so I’m trying to encourage her to pursue those areas where she says more natural strengths and passions because it will. It’ll play out in a much, much more fulfilling way for her. So I think it’s just lifting those things up. That doesn’t always mean that she hears it in the moment. I think that’s another important thing too. Like, if dads are looking for kind of, I do this and I get an immediate kind of response.

Brandon Smith [00:22:47]:
It’s not, it’s not like that. I often, I’ll chat in my author editor book and you want to talk to my clients when they’re like, doing too much for their teams. I’ll say to them, are you trying to win an mvp? Are you trying to win a world championship? Because are two very different muscles. And I think sometimes as dads, we’re trying to win MVPs, like, we want the immediate hug and the gratification in the moment, like we just scored a touchdown. And really we should probably be thinking about more like winning a world championship because, like, those are lag indicators. You don’t really know how well you’re doing until you start to get further into the season. Then you got to get in the playoffs. So touchdowns don’t.

Brandon Smith [00:23:18]:
The touchdown itself doesn’t really matter. So I’m getting more of the payoff way after the fact from her. Not in the moment. And sometimes she’ll dismiss my comments in the moment. But I know I’m planting seeds.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:27]:
What’s one way you show your daughter that she can always count on you?

Brandon Smith [00:23:31]:
I would say the simple answer is if she knows. And she’s very respectful of this. She knows if she calls me during the day, I’m going to answer as quickly as I can. If I have to call her back, I will. And I will then clear my calendar to whenever she wants to talk. I will cancel other business calls that I have to make that time for her. Now she does, she does not abuse that. She’s very, very respectful of that and sometimes I’ll tell her I’m tied up, I can’t have a public, let’s talk tonight.

Brandon Smith [00:23:55]:
But I always try and make her a priority when she needs to talk. And so I think that’s the number one way.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:00]:
And when you think back to relationship with your daughter in the past now, what’s a tradition or routine that you’ve created together that really strengthens your bond?

Brandon Smith [00:24:12]:
I think there’s a couple, one for sure is are just going out to dinner together. We love to do that and traveling together. When my daughter and I did our 12 year old trip to Disney, we stayed at a different kind of Disney hotel. And we just walked around all the hotels one night and she picked out what she’s like, oh, I love this one. We should stay here from now on as a family. And sure enough, that’s what we started doing. So I think finding things that your daughter likes that you can share with her is really good. And that can be a variety of things.

Brandon Smith [00:24:36]:
My daughter, she likes sporting events because she likes to sit with people that she cares about and have conversations, but she doesn’t actually care about the event itself. But she’ll go because she likes to have that time together. I think finding those things that we can do, I think are definitely one. And then we have other traditions that we’ve always done as a family, which she actually appreciates. We always try to have dinner together as a family as much as we could. We thought this was normal. Apparently it’s weird. We live in Atlanta, so we live in the Southeast, but every Christmas Eve after church we go to Waffle House.

Brandon Smith [00:25:02]:
Waffle Houses are Christmas Eve tradition. And just things like that that she really likes, I think it provides a lot of that stability. I’ll also say, like as I mentioned to you before, my daughter was never very touchy feely. Like she was never like daddy’s little girl in the sense that she just worshiped me and always wanted to spend time with me. But that has gotten more and more as she’s gotten older. Last time she was over to her house, she gave me probably three hugs before she left the house. And so I do think that, you know, it’s definitely a marathon and a long race, more like trying to win a world championship than it is winning an mvp.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:31]:
Now we always finish our interview with what I like to call our dad connection. Six, six more questions that delve into you as a dad. Are you ready? What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughter?

Brandon Smith [00:25:42]:
And this isn’t Meant to be creepy, but I really like this word. It’s intimate. We cover the can. I’m open and honest and things I’m kind of working through. She’s open and honest with things she’s working through. So there’s just a commitment, openness with sharing. Kind of our. We’re very authentic.

Brandon Smith [00:25:54]:
We’re vulnerable. We share needs and wants. We just, we’re just have a very open relationship. So I would say that what’s the

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:59]:
best piece of dad advice that you’ve ever received?

Brandon Smith [00:26:04]:
I would say the best piece of d. Bad advice I ever received actually came from a client of mine. And it was because he had worked a very long career with a big company. It’s a privately held company. He wasn’t going to get the CEO job. He was right below it. So he decided to retire and he traveled all the time. And one day his kids told him and he made it a point.

Brandon Smith [00:26:22]:
He was like, I was always going to be there for the big events. I’m always going to be there for the soccer matches and the award ceremonies. And he would fly back in town, he’d go to those events and he thought like, ah, being a great dad. And then his son one day said to him, he said, dad, you were always there for the big moments, but you were never there for the small ones. And the small ones mattered the most. O so I do think the soccer matches really don’t matter. They really don’t. The dining room table, that matters more.

Brandon Smith [00:26:45]:
The being able to like go in your kids room when they’re sad and crying and just sit with them. That matters way more than seeing their baseball tournament or their dance recital. I’m not saying those things are bad. I’m not saying you should dismiss them. But it’s not the same thing because frankly we over index on that stuff. We’re like, ah, I was with them. Dance recital. You were sitting in an Auditorium.

Brandon Smith [00:27:03]:
Auditorium 20ft away from your kid. You weren’t talking to them, they weren’t talking to you. They were doing something and you were watching. It’s not much different than watching your kid play video games. It’s really not any different. It’s not connected. But we tend to think it’s some kind of connection. So I think those small moments are the key.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:17]:
What’s one activity that you and your daughter love doing together?

Brandon Smith [00:27:21]:
Definitely restaurants. That’s an easy one to plug in. Travel. She’s always game for travel. So if I said let’s go to a city and then I’ll and I let her plan it, and we go around and do things. Things, that’s great. So I think those are things that she loves to do that I like to do, too. So those are the two big ones.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:34]:
If you could give your daughter one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Brandon Smith [00:27:39]:
Be true to yourself. It’s probably cliche, but what that really means is understand how you’re hardwired and find a swim lane that honors that. Life’s much easier and more fulfilling. If you go in the direction of the current, you’re already wired to go down. If you try and force it and fake it and go down another path, you’re not going to be happy. If you try and chase other things, you’re also not going to be happy. So I think just finding, really get a good understanding of who you are, figure out, plug that into the world, you’re going to feel a lot, a lot better. And I think that’s hard for daughters today because there’s a lot of pressure.

Brandon Smith [00:28:06]:
You should be a career woman, and you should put off having kids. And that is a choice for some women. They can do that. But some women might decide, I want to have a family. And there’s not as, maybe as much discussion and balanced conversation on different options for women. So I think today, ironically, it’s kind of like almost gone the other way. It’s like, you got to have a career, you got to make as much money as possible. And I know she’s felt pressured to do that, and she’s adjusting what she wants, so being able to help in that process.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:30]:
And what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Brandon Smith [00:28:38]:
Two quick ones. So first I would say tell them that. Tell them that I want to build a relationship with you. You are one of the most important people in my life. I would love to explore what that might look like or how we could do that. So I think that’s one second that I mentioned earlier. The secret sauce to all this is being able to apologize. That’s the equivalent of fail fast in the entrepreneurial world or fail forward.

Brandon Smith [00:28:56]:
Apologize dies quickly. When you make a mistake, go in quickly and be like, I screwed up. Dad screwed up. I’m sorry. Here’s why it happened. But it’s not going to happen again. They will quickly forgive you. But if you don’t do that, that emotion will see them fester.

Brandon Smith [00:29:08]:
And then that’s when you get World War iii. And daughters are good at waging World War iii. If necessary so you can avoid that with a quick apology.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:16]:
Now, if people want to find out more about you, where should they go?

Brandon Smith [00:29:20]:
Yeah, the simplest place is just Google the workplace therapist. That’s my handle. So you can Google the workplace therapist. I’m the only one. Well, there’s one other person in Australia now, but I’m the only other one. So you’ll look for the guy not in Australia and you’ll find me.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:34]:
Well, Brandon, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for being here and thank you for sharing this journey that you’ve been on with your daughter. I know it’s not over, it’s definitely going to just continue. But I truly want to say thank you for sharing this and I wish you all the best.

Brandon Smith [00:29:49]:
Thank you. Thank you for all the great work you do for dads out there trying to be better. So thank you for having me. That’s a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:06]:
It’s about being present.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:09]:
If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes@dadanddaughterconnection.com until next time. Keep showing up, keep connecting and and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Performer

We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers? We spend the time, we give the lessons, we make the meals, we buy them presents? Bring your A game? Cause those kids are growing fast? The time goes by just like a dynamite blast? Calling astronauts and firemen Carpenters and muscle men? Get out and be the world to them Be the best, best dad you can be? Be the best dad you can be.