Intentional Parenting Archives

Presence Over Perfection: Creating Meaningful Dad-Daughter Connections

October 5, 2026 by dadofdivas

Building a strong, meaningful relationship with your daughter takes intention, patience, and a genuine commitment to growth—for both parent and child. That’s the heartbeat of “The Dad and Daughter Connection,” a podcast devoted to helping dads nurture confidence and independence in their daughters. In the latest episode, host Dr. Christopher Lewis sits down with returning guest Arpan Shah to discuss what it really takes to create lasting, positive connections, even in challenging circumstances.

One of the episode’s central themes is being truly present. Arpan Shah opens up about his journey as a dad navigating dual custody, and how—even when parenting comes with logistical and emotional hurdles—intentionally showing up matters more than perfection. He shares the powerful impact of simple, everyday rituals: from regular FaceTime check-ins and nighttime meditation to asking thoughtful questions like, “How did you help someone today?” or “What new thing did you learn?”

Another key takeaway is the importance of leading by example. Children learn more from their parents’ behaviors than their words. Arpan Shah explains how volunteering at school, coaching basketball, and making time for shared hobbies like hiking and music aren’t just fun—they show his daughter that she is valued and supported, while modeling lifelong curiosity and resilience.

Honesty and forgiveness are woven throughout the conversation. Both Dr. Christopher Lewis and Arpan Shah talk about the inevitable mistakes that come with parenting. The real magic, they suggest, happens when we use those moments to communicate openly, learn together, and even let our daughters teach us a thing or two about empathy.

The episode is full of practical advice for fathers who want to build a deep, trusting relationship with their daughters, such as:

Prioritizing quality time over material things or work distractions
Supporting your child’s interests—from robotics and coding to sports and music
Establishing meaningful routines and traditions
Creating space for honest, two-way conversations—even when they’re tough
Focusing on presence instead of perfection

If you’re looking for real stories and actionable insights to help you on your fatherhood journey, this podcast is for you. Tune in for inspiration, support, and a reminder that your heart already knows the way—sometimes, you just need to be still, listen, and be present.

Subscribe today and start strengthening your bond. Listen to the latest episode of “The Dad and Daughter Connection” now!

If you enjoyed this episode we ask you to take a moment to take our Dad and Daughter Connection Survey to let us know more about you as a dad. You can also sign up to get our newsletter to stay connected to our community and we will send items of interest to you to help you to be the dad that you want to be. Feel free to follow me on the following social media platforms: Facebook, Facebook Group, Instagram, LinkedIn, X.

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to The Dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and The Dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started. Because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the Dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to Work together on these relationships that we want to build with our daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:02]:
And I just want to say thank you. Thank you for coming back every week, for you putting yourself out there, for wanting to continue to keep learning, to keep growing, and to keep being present for your daughters. Because that’s what it’s all about. Each one of us has to put in the work, put in the time to be able to do what we can to be able to help our daughters grow into the women that they’re becoming. But also, we need to put in the time for ourselves to be able to be the fathers that we want to be. And that’s why this show exists. This show exists because I want to provide you with resources that are going to help you, give you some tools for your toolbox that’ll help you to be that dad that you want to be. As you know, I’ve got 2 daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:44]:
I know you’ve got daughters. And I love being able to allow for you every week to learn something new from new people that can provide you with some of the experiences that they’ve had. in their life. Because every one of us as fathers is going to father in a different way. But we can learn from each other and take little pieces here and there to be able to help us be even better dads in the future. That’s why every week I bring you a different guest, a different person with different experiences. And this week we’ve got another great guest. Arpan Shah is with us today.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:15]:
And Arpan is a, actually a past guest of another podcast that I used to do called Dads with Daughters. And I was really excited to be able to ask him to come back to join us and to, and to have us have him back on to talk with us about his own journey as a father. And I’m really excited to introduce him to you. Arpan, thanks so much for being here today.

Arpan Shah [00:02:38]:
Thanks for having me, Chris.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:39]:
I’m really excited to be able to have you here today and for you to share some of the experiences that you’ve had. I always start these interviews with an opportunity to learn a little bit more about you as a dad and talk about you and the relationship with your daughter. I guess first and foremost, as you think about the relationship that you have with your daughter, I know she’s 9. So as you think back to that relationship that you have with her, what is one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share together with your daughter? And what made it so special?

Arpan Shah [00:03:07]:
I think the special moments is now that she’s 9. My last podcast was when she was about 4 or 5. And I was in the midst of a really bad custody battle. And so I was going through all kinds of emotions that many fathers go through in the treacherous waters of family court. And so what has changed And what’s meaningful now is those little random hugs and bursts of, I love you, for no absolute reason, where you can see the unconditional love just pouring out of each other’s eyes and souls when you embrace your child. And knowing that you’re doing a good job, knowing that she’s smart, she’s got a good heart, and that she is a kind person, and she helps me out as well. And those are some of the most meaningful little milestones. Just if we can have that connection as the child grows and blooms, to nurture that and to have a hand in that is extremely humbling.

Arpan Shah [00:03:57]:
And something to be very grateful for.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:58]:
As you think about what you just said, each one of us is trying to do things to intentionally build those moments and be able to have those opportunities to be able to connect with our daughters. What are some intentional ways that you’ve worked to strengthen your bond with your daughter, especially during challenging times?

Arpan Shah [00:04:16]:
Well, recently, as she’s gotten older, this is much different, as I have not pondered these questions you’ve asked for some time now, is There is a struggle when she goes from home to home. Our parenting schedule is such where she is 7 days with me with a break in the middle where there’s a date night with the other parent and with her mother. And then on 7 days with her mom, I have a date night in the middle of the week as well. So during those times, there are FaceTime calls every day. And then we do a check-in. We meditate or pray every night before going to sleep. And the way I started that was a count to 10, just a breathing to 10 where you clear your mind for those 10 seconds. And I kind of assist her in doing so.

Arpan Shah [00:04:59]:
So, and we’ll take deep breaths, we’ll hold them, we’ll let them out, and we’ll try to clear ourselves of all our thoughts and whatever might be on our minds. We just clear it. And it’s just me and her, her voice and mine. And then we find peace. And then we touch base every day where that grows. I can get into that a little further, but I think that’s something that everybody should do is just unwind with your child and debrief. How was your day today? What were some of your best moments of the day? How have you helped somebody today? What did you learn today? Those kind of questions are very important to ask. And then getting a habit of that, it keeps it in your mind throughout the day.

Arpan Shah [00:05:35]:
It helps you have a more positive impact as a parent. And then the child ponders those questions a lot more than you might think. Children learn more from behaviors than what you tell them to do. So it’s important for you to exhibit that as well.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:46]:
And following up with that, you talked a little bit about the fact that getting her back onto a routine and moving from routine to routine, and some fathers like yourself have a similar type of a family dynamic that has to happen based on time with mom, time with dad, you know, whatever the situation is. And you said that you’ve tried some different things that have worked, maybe some things that didn’t work. For other fathers that are in dual custody type of situations like that, what’s some advice that you would give them to be able to help the child to be able to maneuver from environment to environment?

Arpan Shah [00:06:21]:
There’s a couple of things that we can do to help the transitions. The most important being Don’t badmouth the other parent when the child is around. That’s very important. You want to love the child more than you might have some grievances with the other parent because that child is half you and half the other. And so it’s important to know that if the child hears that, it’s heartbreaking because the child is part of both and it’s confusing as well. So it’s important not to do that. On the contrary, if you are fortunate enough to have a good relationship, it’s important to maybe just watch the child interact— you both interact politely. respectfully with each other.

Arpan Shah [00:06:57]:
And then maybe do an exchange at a playground where you’re both present for a little while, things like that. In the beginning, attorneys can really make things complicated. So I would have imaginary phone calls with the other parent to show that, hey, you know, we’re laughing, we’re good. And it felt— made her feel really good growing up. I think it’s important for dads to be present, not be on your phone. And you know what, work may come in the future, spend time with your child. When you’re older, you’re not going to look back and wish that you had worked the extra hour to get that overtime pay or whatever it is. If you’re in that situation.

Arpan Shah [00:07:28]:
I know it’s easier for some than others. But I have turned down opportunities, and even relationships and commitments to spend time. And I’ve never regretted that. As far as spending time goes, it’s like, what do I do? I mean, if you look in the marketplace, or the— or even TV shows, it’s changing slowly. But usually, historically, it’s frustrating to me that the dad is more of a sort of like a bumbling idiot, if you will, in these TV shows like Al Bundy and Homer Simpson, and etc., etc. So it’s important for you to find those positive figures or exhibit that yourself. Doing things, learning something together, taking a cooking class with the child, putting together one of those crafts like a mechanical toy or Lego set, building it together. Those things you’re creating together with your creation.

Arpan Shah [00:08:14]:
And that’s one of the reasons I wrote Daddy Goes to Work, my book, because it’s a book that I was looking for when she was young. Because she’ll grab your leg and be like, Dad, where are you going? Dada, no! And then she’ll whine. And you have a schedule, you have to be at work, and the kid has no idea where you’ve abandoned her for 8, 9, 10 hours. So in a good connection with one’s father, especially girls, it’s important for their sense of joy and self-confidence later in life. And more and more research and science is showing this and proving that to be true. A father’s love is no less, especially with a girl, although it’s also prevalent with males too. So anyways, Daddy Goes to Work is what I wrote, and I’m glad I did. Every child that reads it has a better connection and makes the world a better place, in my opinion, one kid at a time.

Arpan Shah [00:09:00]:
It’s a story of a father that goes to work and explains to a young child— it’s more for kids under 7— what happens in the day and how much the father loves her, and that he’ll always come back. And that message is very important, and it’s nonexistent until now.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:13]:
You know, and we talk a lot more about that book in the first interview that I mentioned. I’ll put a link in the notes today so you can learn more about the book and kind of the impetus behind that to be able to learn a little bit more. One of the questions that I have, and it goes back to kind of what you were talking about in regard to The work that we all do, many of us are working full-time. We’re trying our best to provide for our families. We’re wearing a lot of hats as we are being fathers, and we have to try to balance all of those different things. Talk to me about how you balance guiding your daughter while also giving her the ability and the independence to grow into the person that she’s becoming.

Arpan Shah [00:09:49]:
So I incorporate her with my day. I will take vacation days like many, but instead of sitting around or going on a guys trip, I’ll volunteer at her school. I’m involved. I’m her basketball coach for the 3rd graders last year. As a children’s book author, I’ll do author readings in the school. I’ll help any way I can. So I make myself known. And I’ve always noticed when I was a kid and other parents would volunteer, I always thought it was so cool.

Arpan Shah [00:10:12]:
I thought it was so special. And I could see it in her eyes and heart, how joy she gets seeing me in her classroom. She’s like, whoa, what are you doing here? And then now people have gotten to know me as Mr. Shah. Like, she thinks I work there. So that’s really special. So I’m very involved. And I encourage every father to do that.

Arpan Shah [00:10:29]:
Show up at their appointments, dentist, doctor. It’s important for you to be there. These norms are changing. And especially in the future with AI and stuff, I think fathers are more involved now than ever in the last century, at least, and volunteering, doing activities together, and just being present. Or, and if you can’t, debriefing with her, asking her specific questions on her day. Because young children can be very vague. It’s like, yeah, it was good. It was fine.

Arpan Shah [00:10:53]:
What’d you do? Nothing. You know, like, well, did you play with any friends? And back to those questions that I mentioned earlier, have— how did you help somebody today? What’s something new that you learned today? What is something that you need to work on? How can I help you? What was your favorite part of your day with me if you had spent the day? So those are all very— make things more meaningful. And then when you go putting action to your thoughts, you’ll be surprised how your soul will carry you forward in this relationship.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:19]:
Now, none of us are infallible. We’re human. We make mistakes. And I guess as you think about yourself as a father in working with your daughter, what’s a mistake that you’ve made as a father And what did you learn from it about fostering better communication with your own daughter?

Arpan Shah [00:11:35]:
Well, I learned something new every day. I just never stopped looking for ways to improve. This is a very common thing. The way my custody battle started, it was my child was removed from the state and we kind of saw it coming and she was held without contact for an extended period. So I think that’s why I’m so intense and present in her life right now, because I was so connected to her. I’m the oldest out of like 9 cousins and we were raised very close together. Like I was in Chicago. They’re in Indiana, and we would visit every weekend.

Arpan Shah [00:12:03]:
So they were like siblings, but I was the oldest. And my best friend in the family has always been the youngest one. Like I said, I’m a big kid. I love goofing around. And I missed that. But I won that pretty quickly. But it was very difficult, very traumatic. And that kind of helped me be extremely present.

Arpan Shah [00:12:18]:
I did some positive parenting classes that were free I found online, just voluntarily. I talked to other dads. I went to some parent mentoring stuff. And I’m just always trying to be a better dad or make other fathers better. I currently help freelance as a divorce coach and a parenting guide for fathers and some mothers too. I’ve helped a lot of people out, so I learned from their experiences. I learned from mine. I’m trying to think.

Arpan Shah [00:12:40]:
We’re human, like you said, so you can get angry sometimes, or you want to make sure that you’re always communicating so that you can grow together. In relationships, you learn when you fall and from when you rise. So you want to make sure you’re there to carry her up, and then you want to empower your child to lift you up when she notices things and to have honest conversations with— because you are not a god.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:00]:
One other question, which is really going to some of the things that you do, because you’re already talking about things that you’re doing to be able to show up for your daughter. What do you do intentionally to make your daughter feel valued and heard?

Arpan Shah [00:13:12]:
I’m always present. I think presence is what’s important for fathers more than ever. I’m there before she’s awake. I’m there to put her down. When I’m picking her up at school, I’m, I’m on time. I’m there taking her to activities and not just leaving, checking out at the playground. I’m not just leaving her at the playground sitting on the bench on my phone. I’m interacting.

Arpan Shah [00:13:29]:
You know, while I still can, while I have a good back. And it’s the engaging, it’s the wanting to be there, it’s the presence. And I think as long as you’re present, the love that you have for your child will tell you where to go next.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:40]:
And before we started the show today, one of the things that you told me was the story of the conversation that you had with your daughter about teasing. I want you to tell that story because I think that really connects with this question as well.

Arpan Shah [00:13:53]:
I can be immature sometimes, and then we tease each other, but I got to realize that one time she was joking around with me, and then I can’t remember I don’t remember exactly the situation. It was some time ago, but I do remember what she said afterwards. She sat me down like she was my mom and she’s like, hey, if you treat somebody and do blah, blah, blah to them, how would that make you feel? And then I was like, ah, man, I wouldn’t feel very good at all. And she’s like, well, that’s how I feel. And I was just like, oh my God. I apologized. It was just so sweet to see her put me in my place and the maturity. I was just so proud of her.

Arpan Shah [00:14:27]:
Even when she was 3, she had those kind of tendencies. One time we had people over, me and my wife, and And then it was about 9 PM. So what she did— and we had music playing, we had some food on the dining table, and people were kind of scattered throughout the condo. And then she walks up out of her room, turns the music off, slams her door before she says, I’m going to sleep, everybody be quiet. And then the mic just dropped and everybody was like, oh my God, that was so beautiful. It was so awesome. And then, I mean, eventually, you know, people got quiet and they were trailing out anyways. There were other children there.

Arpan Shah [00:15:00]:
So I just thought that was really cool. She’s like 9 going on 90.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:04]:
So, you know, every one of us as fathers also try to support our daughter’s dreams and passions. How are you supporting your daughter’s dreams and passions?

Arpan Shah [00:15:14]:
I’ve exposed her in her earlier years to so many different activities. We’ve tried all kinds of sports. She did love basketball. I didn’t think she would because probably that I was one of the coaches there. So I’m really proud of that. And we play every chance we get. And when we find a park, I keep a ball in my car. Something else is she’s really taken a liking to building and programming and coding.

Arpan Shah [00:15:36]:
Like engineering, whether it be Legos or Roblox, Minecraft. I’m not a big fan of Roblox, but there’s also editing videos and sounds. I play several instruments myself, so that way she’s become somewhat of an audiophile. She has an appreciation for good music and the technology that’s behind it. Her school is a performing arts and fine arts magnet, so they do have a music technology class that they start at a young age, which I thought was cool. I didn’t have that when I was young. I had a recorder, but I found a place called iCode. Where they did like a YouTube Creator Week where you modify sound waves and add text to video and make, make like video editing basically.

Arpan Shah [00:16:15]:
And she just loved it. After school, she pulled up my laptop, downloaded some app, and started finding stock videos and footage, adding text, and then finding music clips, uploading them, and doing that. And she’s just turned 9, and I can’t even do some of this stuff. So I was very impressed, and I felt grateful that, hey, I put in this effort. I got her into this camp over the summer instead of something else or just sitting at home. And she’s learned something new that she’s passionate about. The way I found it was a trial class in robotics where you kind of code a robot to like make a left turn, go straight, because, you know, the future is AI. So we gotta— I don’t know what the future holds, but I do know that you can’t go wrong with this stuff for now at least.

Arpan Shah [00:16:54]:
And it’s good to have a background in it. So I’m looking forward to seeing if I can get her into something else like our Battle of the Bots. That’s the— that’s something coming up in August, which is a week-long course about programming a robot. The other student programs one. And then you fight and then you see who wins and you learn something and you have a fun time.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:10]:
And what’s one way that you show your daughter that she can always count on you?

Arpan Shah [00:17:13]:
When she confesses something to me or says something serious, she knows that I have her back. Like if there’s some bullying happening or if she gets in trouble, there’s one way to discipline. And then, but in private, you want to give the advice and know that you’re on her side, that you are supported, that she is not alone. Even though there are going to be consequences for her behaviors and actions, you have to explain that to her. You can’t just be like, you’re going timeout, or Like, you know, I’m taking your tablet away for a week or whatever else you do to discipline your child. You want to explain that this was you, this is your choice. You can choose to do this or you can choose to do that. You have to give them the power.

Arpan Shah [00:17:50]:
And then once you give them the choice and they make the wrong choice, they’ll understand that there are specific consequences to making those choices in their little minds. And that’s how they’re gonna learn it. If you just yell at them, they’re just gonna learn to resist slightly and outsmart. But, and kids are smart, so you have to be on top of it and you have to be present and you have to be involved in everything we’ve set up to this point.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:10]:
And what’s a tradition or routine that you’ve created together that strengthens your bond?

Arpan Shah [00:18:15]:
It would have to be the evening meditation. And we did jiu-jitsu for 5 years. You know, we need to empower our girls, especially if they’re not bullies. If they are, then don’t empower them. But now she’s recently taken a liking to boxing. She loves it. Actually, as a bachelor, I might— I’m actually shopping for a 40-pound punching bag to put in my living room. Between my living room and dining room.

Arpan Shah [00:18:37]:
So I’m really happy that she loves it so much. And it’s something good, something fitness-oriented. I go to the gym, I make sure I bring her with me. Gyms have daycares with toys and fun stuff. So it’s important, like I said earlier, kids learn more from behaviors. You can tell a kid that it’s important to work out and eat healthy, or you can demonstrate that. And then she enjoys doing push-ups, mountain climbers, bear crawls, and all kinds of stuff just by watching me. And then you break a sweat, you come into the break room or the childcare area sweating, and you’re like, hey, just checking in on you.

Arpan Shah [00:19:07]:
How are you doing? You having fun, great. And then you go back. And I think those are really important.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:11]:
Now, we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our Dad Connection 6. 6 more questions to delve into you as a dad. Are you ready?

Arpan Shah [00:19:18]:
I am.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:18]:
What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughter?

Arpan Shah [00:19:22]:
Blissful.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:22]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice that you’ve ever received?

Arpan Shah [00:19:27]:
Always be honest with them.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:28]:
What’s one activity that you and your daughter love doing together?

Arpan Shah [00:19:32]:
Hiking.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:32]:
If you could give your daughter one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Arpan Shah [00:19:36]:
Pain is mandatory. Suffering is optional.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:38]:
What’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Arpan Shah [00:19:41]:
Resilience.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:42]:
And finally, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Arpan Shah [00:19:50]:
Your heart already knows what to do. Cut out your programming that you might have had from your parents and the parents before and be present with an open heart and mind.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:58]:
Well, Arpan, I just want to say thank you. Thank you so much for being here today, for sharing what you shared. If people want to find out more about you, where should they go?

Arpan Shah [00:20:06]:
Well, they can Google Arpan V. Shah, A-R-P-A-N, and my book is Daddy Goes to Work. You can also find me on Facebook as A.V. Shah. It’s just capital letters, A.V. together, space, Shah.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:18]:
Well, again, Arpan, thanks so much for being here today. I really appreciate the opportunity to talk to you again, and I wish you all the best.

Arpan Shah [00:20:24]:
Thank you so much, Chris. I appreciate the opportunity. It’s been a long time. Always a pleasure.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:28]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect; it’s about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes at dadanddaughterconnection.com. Until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:20:58]:
We’re all in the same boat, and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, we give the lessons, we make the meals, we buy them presents. Bring your A-game, ’cause those kids are growing fast. The time goes by so fast. I’m gonna go get some sleep. Time goes by just like a dynamite blast. Calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters and muscle men, get out and be in the world too now. Be the best dad you can be.

Musical Outro Performer [00:21:51]:
Be the best dad you can be.

Building Stronger Bonds: Matt Haviland and his Daughter Olivia’s Father-Daughter Journey

September 21, 2026 by dadofdivas

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

At the heart of The Dad and Daughter Connection, featured in this week’s episode, is the steadfast belief that the strongest father-daughter relationships are built one intentional moment at a time. In a conversation brimming with honesty and warmth, Dr. Christopher Lewis sits down with Matt Haviland and his 20-year-old daughter, Olivia Haviland, to explore what it truly means to connect, support, and empower our daughters to become confident, independent women.

Listening With Intent

One of the most powerful themes from this episode is the importance of truly listening. Olivia Haviland reflects on her high school years, sharing how her dad’s willingness to listen without judgment made her feel seen and valued. Rather than resorting to harsh discipline, Matt Haviland chose to open a dialogue, striving to understand Olivia’s perspective and guide rather than simply correct. This practice, inspired by a national survey in which teens wished their dads would “listen more,” is a reminder for all fathers: be present, and let your daughter’s voice be heard.

Meaningful Moments Big and Small

Connection isn’t always about the grand gestures. Matt Haviland and Olivia share memories ranging from epic squirt gun battles to heartfelt college essays, and even “loud and obnoxious” declarations of love at McDonald’s. Whether it’s a shared joke, a drive together, or simply showing up at a dance recital, these moments accumulate into a reservoir of trust and comfort. As Olivia Haviland puts it, time spent together outweighs any material gift.

Guidance and Independence

Balancing guidance with independence is a recurring theme. Matt Haviland, a former single dad, emphasizes being intentional with the time he shared with Olivia, supporting her dreams while encouraging self-reflection and growth. For Olivia, this support translated into confidence in her career and life decisions—bolstered by her dad’s encouragement to think long-term and his faith-based guidance.

Real Advice for Real Dads

This episode wraps with practical wisdom: prioritize time with your kids, apologize for your mistakes, and let your actions reflect your family values. Both Matt Haviland and Olivia Haviland urge dads everywhere to listen deeply and value presence over presents.

Ready to strengthen your bond with your daughter? Listen to this heartfelt episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection and discover how every day can be an opportunity to connect, grow, and become the dad she needs.

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to The Dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and The Dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the Dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to work together to build those connections that we want to have with our daughters one day at a time. You know, I love it that you come back every week because that shows a lot about who you want to be as a father, but also who you want to be and what type of relationship you want to have, relationship that you want to have with your daughter.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:16]:
And it takes time, it takes effort, and it takes work. And we have to keep showing up. And it is so important for us to be able to put the work in for ourselves, but also put in the work with our daughters to be able to have that solid relationship that we wanna have. And that’s why this podcast exists. Every week, I love being able to bring you different people with different experiences that allow for you to be able to learn, to grow, to get some tools for your toolbox, and to be able to take those and use them for the future. So I am really excited today to have a, I’m gonna say a return guest. It’s not really a return guest on this show, but Matt Haviland, is with us. And Matt and his daughter are with us today, his daughter Olivia.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:02]:
And Matt is a past guest of a past podcast that I did called Dads with Daughters about 4 years ago. And I’m really excited to be able to have Matt on, but also this time his daughter Olivia, to be able to talk about the relationship that they’ve been able to build together and also what they’ve learned along the way to share that with you. Matt, Olivia, thanks so much for being here today.

Matt Haviland [00:02:26]:
Yeah, Chris, thanks again for having me back. And this is a really It’s a really special moment to have Olivia with me today. So say hi.

Olivia Haviland [00:02:33]:
Hi.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:33]:
I’m really excited to have you both here. And I want to go back a little bit because I know, Olivia, you’re 20. You know, you’re an adult now. You’re doing the life thing. You’re doing the work thing. You’re out there. And as you think back to the relationship that you’ve been able to build with your dad, what’s one thing that your dad did for you that helped you and made you feel truly seen, heard, and valued as a daughter?

Olivia Haviland [00:03:02]:
Um, I would say in high school, I was struggling a lot with my mental health. And then I was getting myself into a little bit of trouble. And he didn’t ground me. Well, there was like boundaries where he grounded me a little bit, but he was more open to like listening as of like why I did the things that I did, instead of just like not hearing me out and just screaming at me, taking my phone, not letting me hang out with my friends and everything. So that meant a lot to me.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:32]:
And Matt, I guess, take me back to that point for you, because I know you had your own journey as a youth and went through your own stuff. And we talked about, we talked about a lot of that in the first interview that we did. So talk to me about that for you and hearing that from Olivia and how you had to be able to kind of take what you learned to be able to help her?

Matt Haviland [00:03:57]:
Yeah, I was very grateful for a lot of the experiences that I had, not only personally but also professionally or through mentorship as well. I guess where I can go with that, Chris, is Olivia was born when I was 30 years old, so I wasn’t super young. So by the time she’s in high school, you know, I’m in my mid-40s. I would like to say I’ve learned a few things over those 14 or 15 years of parenting her, but I also Just like a lot of people, either parents or— I, I work with fathers also in a professional setting. You know, we learn a lot from our own previous experiences. So the things my own parents did or did not do, so learning how to correct that and apply that as much as possible. Plus working in a fatherhood field for so long, I’ve obviously picked up tips, either again things that I’ve taught guys or other men have taught me as well. But it really becomes a lot different instead of me just telling a dad what to do when I actually have to live this out.

Matt Haviland [00:04:54]:
But I think I could attribute a lot of it to— I was at a conference many years ago, probably 2010, 2012, and they revealed a survey result, a national survey, and they said all these teen kids wish their dad would fill in the blank. And the number one answer was listen more. And that was something that, just like Olivia just said, instead of flying off the handle, telling her how much trouble she’s in, let me hear her out first.

Olivia Haviland [00:05:18]:
Yeah.

Matt Haviland [00:05:19]:
And then we can go from there.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:20]:
Now I know that a lot of times, Matt, we as fathers are trying to build those moments, those meaningful moments that connect us with our kids. And what is one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share with Olivia and what made it so special?

Matt Haviland [00:05:35]:
Okay, she said the water fight, so clearly that must have been one. It was April Fool’s Day, probably about 4 or 5 years ago. She pranked me in the house and that turned out to a full-blown squirt gun war in the house, actually Super Soakers in the house.

Olivia Haviland [00:05:49]:
Well, I pranked him once and then he forgot to take the tape off the faucet and pranked himself again.

Matt Haviland [00:05:55]:
Yeah, she did the old, you know, she tied the rubber band around the sprayer on the kitchen sink. So when I turned on the kitchen sink faucet, it hit me, and then I shut it off and hit myself again. And yes, that is a very— we’re gonna remember that forever, having a squirt gun fight in the house. Not recommended. My wife had something to say about it when she got home, but it was very meaningful. Another really meaningful moment on a more emotional level was a couple years ago, Olivia wrote a paper for college, and they were to choose somebody that’s inspired them inspired them, and she wrote the paper about me. And it starts out with the words, I am who I am today because of my dad. And I don’t think, Christopher, I don’t think there’s any greater words that a parent can hear than something like that.

Matt Haviland [00:06:34]:
And she went on to say a lot of like what she just said about me being there and communicating with her mom and just so many other things. So that was a special moment. The fact that of all the times I’ve screwed up as a dad over, at that point, over 18 years, and then just to receive the gift like that that says, no, Dad, you did a lot of screwing up, but you did it right as well. And Really, that meant so much. To this day, there’s no greater gift I’ve ever been given than that paper.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:59]:
And Olivia, what are some things that you wish your dad had done differently when it came to building your relationship?

Olivia Haviland [00:07:05]:
I don’t know. I can’t really think of much because from our situation of like me growing up, it was really hard to make time to see me and everything, but he was doing all that he could. From what I noticed, I would just say maybe less of the dad jokes for sure. On a serious note, I can only flash back to when I was little and I wish he learned to cook more things rather than turkey burger and rice and sometimes mac and cheese.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:34]:
That’s fair.

Matt Haviland [00:07:35]:
I was a bachelor for 29 years. Okay, so but just for your audience though, to just kind of backtrack our story, I was a single dad, Olivia’s mom and I never married. So I was a single father for the first 9 years of her life too. So just trying to navigate what that was like raising a child in 2 different homes.

Olivia Haviland [00:07:52]:
Because rules would would be different at my mom’s and then rules would be different here. I would say like not anything that he could do different, but like something I take back is like when we would get in arguments, I would like not talk to him for the rest of the night. But like, he— I’m thankful that you respected my space, but I kind of wish you would have like pushed me a little bit to like talk more. But other than that, I can’t really think of anything.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:16]:
Now, Matt, all of us are trying to help our daughters to be able to become the people that they’re becoming. Talk to me about how you you balanced guiding Olivia while also giving her the independence to grow into the person that she has become?

Matt Haviland [00:08:31]:
Yeah, speaking from personal experience, so being a single father— and I’ve often defined single dads especially as it could be a man who has full custody, maybe it’s split custody, maybe it’s minimal custody— I would be what was defined as a non-custodial parent, meaning I had less than 50% of the parenting time. Because of that, I was really intentional about the time I had with her. But I think that’s just a good lesson for any parent, is to be intentional intentional. I have the privilege of working with new first-time fathers in some of the work that I do, and I’ll talk to them about making time for their kids. You know, there’s a great quote that says, you’ll never have the time for your kids, you have to make time. There’s no other way. And really putting that into practice, um, you know, you go to parks— and this isn’t to shame anybody listening, but it’s a good reminder— and you’ll see all the parents looking down at their phones while the kids are playing. And it’s about getting engaged in their life.

Matt Haviland [00:09:24]:
And I think for having Olivia, because I didn’t have her all the time. I did not want to take her time— the time with her for granted. But any— even for parents that are raising their kids together in the same household, I mean, the reminder still goes that there’s no greater gift that we can give our kids than our time. And being present isn’t just being in the same room, it’s being, you know, mentally and emotionally present. And I know there’s probably a lot of people that have heard that before, but I think it’s true. I mean, just to be there, to be involved with raising kids— yes, you’re going to have the serious moments, But then also, it’s just kind of spending time together. Maybe it’s going for a walk, and maybe at first it’s a goofy conversation, or, or it’s, uh, it gets more serious. When I had Olivia, the average drive home to her mom was about 15 or 20 minutes each way.

Matt Haviland [00:10:09]:
So every time I picked her up, I mean, that’s 20 minutes of car time that we can kind of talk a little bit. So I think it was not just anything one specific, but it was just that continual over and over and over for 18 years of trying to be as intentional as I can, listening to her, correcting mistakes when I, I can, and then Everybody will say it, she is a carbon copy of me. She is literally— I mean, she’s cuter than me, but just, I mean, personality-wise, she is a carbon copy.

Olivia Haviland [00:10:36]:
We stand the same.

Matt Haviland [00:10:37]:
Yeah, our mannerisms are all the same. But really understanding that too, that I’m looking in a mirror here. So when I am raising her, disciplining her, engaging with her, how would I react to that as well?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:49]:
And speaking to that, Olivia, how has your relationship with your dad influenced the way in which you navigate life, relationships, or challenges? challenges today?

Olivia Haviland [00:10:59]:
Um, I would say, I mean, definitely he— I obviously wasn’t alive, but he did struggle when he was a teenager and in his 20s. And I feel like when I got into that point, when I was getting in some trouble my sophomore year of high school and everything, just like for him to know exactly what it was like to do the same things helped him guide me out of it instead of, like I said earlier, yelling at me, screaming at me. He would actually like hear me out and be like, hey, I was in your position once and this is how I got through it. But he would also always bring faith into it and keep me strong in my faith. Like he would always end a conversation with a Bible verse or bring in a passage or a verse just to help me through something.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:47]:
Now, Matt, we talked about— Olivia’s just talking about some challenging times, and all of us go through those challenging times as we’re raising kids. There’s great times and there’s where you might hit rock bottom as well. And what are some intentional ways that you worked to strengthen your bond with Olivia, especially during those challenging times?

Matt Haviland [00:12:05]:
I’ve always had, since I’ve become a dad, and I am one to really— I’m a huge advocate for everyone to have a mentor. You know, I’ve always had a mentor. I wasn’t raised in a two-parent home. My parents were never married. My dad was minimally engaged in my life. So not having that strong father figure in my life, growing up and understanding what that’s like. But when I did become a dad, I’ve always had strong mentor men in my life in various capacities. Some might be in work, some might be in parenting, or whatever it may be.

Matt Haviland [00:12:38]:
So I think being able to talk it through with a mentor who also was a father, and maybe even perhaps depending on who it was, a grandfather— so a mentor just being somebody that’s a little older and has more experience And hearing that out. And Chris, there was a ton of mistakes along the way. I mean, I’m not going to lie. There was— I’ve had some really bad moments as parents, never in a, like, an abusive way or anything, but where I really dropped the ball. And just understand, I don’t ever want to feel like that again. Apologizing to her, admitting that I screwed up and doing my best not to go through that again. But by the time she was really struggling, especially in the late middle school, early high school years, again, by this point, I’m in my mid-40s. I had been parenting her for a long time.

Matt Haviland [00:13:22]:
So, I knew Olivia. I was able to read her cues. And, I understand that might be a little different in every family dynamic, but I was able to read her cues. And, the girl talks all the time. So, when Olivia’s quiet, there’s obviously there’s something going on. And, like she said, I mean, I was in some— my teen and 20s were some pretty dark years in my life and never wanting her to go through that. I struggled with substance abuse and a lot of other I didn’t go that far. No, but I’m just saying I didn’t want you to go that far.

Matt Haviland [00:13:53]:
So being able to kind of curb that beforehand. But there’s always— I think there also was a special bond. And again, this isn’t to take away from anybody in other family dynamics, but because I was a single father, when I had Olivia, it was me and Olivia. So for 9 years, it was just us. We were like a team, you know? And just to be able to read— and I mean, she’s my heart, and I wanted to in so many ways, give her what I was never given from an upbringing even though it wasn’t perfect because she was still being raised in 2 different homes. But nonetheless, giving her the holidays or the Christmases or the love—

Olivia Haviland [00:14:28]:
Dance recitals and games.

Matt Haviland [00:14:29]:
Yeah, attending. My dad made 2 of my baseball games over 12 years. And, I was at almost every game I could make for her or her dance recitals and understanding how important that is for her to look out in the crowd And to see me there.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:41]:
You know, Olivia, earlier I asked your dad about how he worked to be able to provide you with that independence that you needed. Talk to me on your side of how your dad encouraged you to be confident and independent in your life.

Olivia Haviland [00:14:56]:
I would say he’s always been my biggest cheerleader, even if it’s loud and obnoxious at my games. Or there was one time he was saying how much he loved me in the middle of McDonald’s, just screaming it.

Matt Haviland [00:15:09]:
On purpose.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:10]:
On purpose.

Matt Haviland [00:15:11]:
To embarrass her on purpose.

Olivia Haviland [00:15:12]:
But I would say, like, he’s always been like, he’ll send me a, hey, good morning, I hope you have an amazing day. It’s not every day, but I think that’s what makes it more special is that it’ll be like out of the blue or it’ll be like a Bible verse or like I’ll tell him, I’m like, hey, I had a really bad day today. And then he’ll send me a Bible verse or be like, hey, I have time to call. I would say that’s really encouraging. And then also just like, you know, I’ll be at work and then he’ll show up and bring Dunkin’ or Subway, just like showing that even like if he can see me for 5 minutes, like it still matters. So that means a lot to me too.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:51]:
And Matt, we talked before we started today about what Olivia is doing and she’s working in healthcare right now. And I guess as you have been fathering Olivia, how do you support Olivia in pursuing her passions and her dreams?

Matt Haviland [00:16:04]:
Great question. I, first of all, I’m very impressed because Olivia has a career focus already at 20. And I know that’s not rare, but I, at 20, I mean, I was completely in the opposite direction. So I’m already just so proud of her because, I mean, she is very motivated, she’s very determined, she has an excellent work ethic. I mean, she works hard and she really respects the job that she has, even if she doesn’t like it a lot. So, so to encourage her again— Yeah, she likes her job right now, so that’s good. But to encourage her, I would say again, just listening, kind of maybe as she’s talking, processing, like, okay, what’s this going to look like in your life? Is this going to require more schooling? Sometimes I ask her questions like, how do you see this playing out long-term? If you want to get advanced in your career, what’s that going to look like? How’s that going to affect the other areas of your life? And kind of just helping her think through. You know, she doesn’t have all the weight that, you know, we as adults have right now, you know, carrying a lot of mortgages or payments or, you know, other bigger obligations.

Matt Haviland [00:17:09]:
Not to minimize what she’s doing, but—

Olivia Haviland [00:17:10]:
Right.

Matt Haviland [00:17:11]:
But she has some opportunity and some room right now to really dream, like, hey, what do I want to do for a career? And if I do change my career, that’s okay. But she has tremendous skills. I think that’s one thing, is to let her know what skills she has. She’s definitely a people person. She has a hard work ethic. She’s a great communicator. So just kind of saying, hey, these are the things you’re really good at. So where would that fit for you in your career field?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:35]:
And Olivia, if you could spend an entire day with your dad doing anything, what would it look like?

Olivia Haviland [00:17:39]:
Oh, no. No signs, no dad jokes. That would be—

Matt Haviland [00:17:44]:
You gotta explain the signs.

Olivia Haviland [00:17:46]:
He is obsessed. I will be trying, like, you know, we go to a zoo, I want to see the animals, and he’s like, oh, I want to know where the animals lived, um, where they came from, how old are they, how many, like, claws do they have, how many teeth. Like, it doesn’t matter. Like, I just— I want to see the animals. And it kind of just began as, like, a running joke. Every time he sees a sign, he sends it to me. I reply with, I’m not reading that. But I would say a perfect day, honestly, I love our beach days because he’s very— I mean, we’re like the same person.

Olivia Haviland [00:18:19]:
Like, we don’t want to get out of the water, but we’ve always played stupid games like how many times can we catch the ball in a row throwing trick shots. And then like during COVID we were hitting a ball on our roof with a tennis racket, like, and made that like a whole summer competition. So I would say just like Like little games, like beach day getaway, just the two of us. And then probably Star Wars at the end. Star Wars are an old movie, but something we do like monthly.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:48]:
Sounds like a good day. Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our Dad Connection 6, 6 more questions. And I usually ask them just to dads, but I’m gonna ask both of you some different questions or questions for both of you. Uh, first and foremost, Olivia, what’s one word that describes your relationship with your dad?

Olivia Haviland [00:19:04]:
Comforting.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:05]:
And Matt, what’s your word?

Matt Haviland [00:19:06]:
I’d say solid.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:07]:
And Matt, what’s the best piece of dad advice you’ve ever received?

Matt Haviland [00:19:12]:
I think it’s honestly, it’s been in multiple forms and it’s what I’ve already mentioned. It’s just spending time with them. Other things can wait. And I’ve heard a million different quotes in that way, but it all boils down to spending undivided, just they got my attention or she has my attention. Everything else can wait and it’s just our time. So yeah, time.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:33]:
And Olivia, what’s the best piece of dad advice you’ve ever received?

Olivia Haviland [00:19:37]:
I would honestly say, like, like he said earlier, the, like, talking me through it. Where can you see yourself from this? Let’s, you know, visualize what even is it gonna look like in a month versus 5 years. And I would say that’s gotten me a lot of places because before I make decisions now, I always, like, stop and think, like, hey, like, I may like it right now, but in 3 months, am I gonna like what I’m doing? In a year, am I gonna like what I’m doing? Am I gonna wanna be doing this when I’m older?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:06]:
Yeah.

Olivia Haviland [00:20:06]:
I’m 60 or 70 years old kind of thing. So I would say that’s gotten me far in a lot of places.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:12]:
Matt, what’s one activity that you and Olivia love doing together?

Matt Haviland [00:20:15]:
You’re gonna appreciate this one, Christopher. Going to University of Michigan football games.

Musical Outro Performer [00:20:20]:
Okay.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:21]:
And I’m gonna throw it back to you too, Olivia. And it doesn’t have to be the same thing. It’d be something different.

Olivia Haviland [00:20:25]:
Daddy-daughter dances or like donuts with dad or anything that’s like one-on-one mini golf, golf, and football games, definitely.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:33]:
Matt, if you could give Olivia one life lesson in a single sentence, What would it be?

Matt Haviland [00:20:37]:
Love God, love others.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:38]:
And Matt, what’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Matt Haviland [00:20:42]:
I think—

Olivia Haviland [00:20:43]:
The girl version of you.

Matt Haviland [00:20:45]:
That too. But I would say since becoming a dad, I think you learn how the word selfish feels strong, but I don’t think it’s out of line of when it’s just us. But when it was just me as a single dad or a single man versus becoming a father, it was all about me. I tell my new guys, I think I think being a parent drives you to a level of commitment to your children that would not be attained any other way.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:09]:
And Olivia, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Olivia Haviland [00:21:16]:
I would say put aside anything that can wait, and then also listen before either conversating or just listen to the full story instead of, like, interrupting, getting down to the point.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:32]:
And Matt?

Matt Haviland [00:21:32]:
Yeah, I think it’s so important to live out your values and what’s important to your family. We have a culture that is in many ways just so antagonistic and assaulting our daughters, and to be able to speak against that, letting our daughters know how beautiful they are, how valued they are, their virtue, their beauty, their tenderness. And this is an appropriate conversation for whether you’re raising a 5-year-old or a 20-year-old as well.

Olivia Haviland [00:21:58]:
I would also always say time over items too, because I know A lot of my friends’ parents will be like at work because they work third shift or something. They’ll be like, here’s money to go get something because I didn’t see you all day, or here’s money because I yelled at you kind of thing, instead of just sitting down, actually talking everything out. It helps grow a relationship too.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:20]:
Well, Matt, Olivia, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for spending time with me today, for sharing your journey in your own relationship. Matt is an author as well, and I should mention that he did write a book a number of years back called A Father’s Walk, a Christian-based resource for single fathers. And if people want to find out more about you, Matt, and what you’re doing, where should they go?

Matt Haviland [00:22:43]:
I don’t have a website, but you can email me. I’m completely open to that. My email is afatherswalk@gmail.com. That’s a fathers with an S on the end, walk at Gmail.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:54]:
Well, again, I want to say thank you. Thank you to both of you for your time, for sharing your And I wish you both all the best.

Matt Haviland [00:23:01]:
Thanks, Christopher.

Olivia Haviland [00:23:01]:
Thank you.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:02]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect. It’s about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes at dadanddaughterconnection.com. Until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:23:33]:
We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, we give the lessons. We make the meals, we buy them presents. Bring your A-game, ’cause those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast. Calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters and muscle men, get out and be the world to them. Be the best dad you can be. Be the best dad you can be.

Building Lasting Bonds: Intentional Fatherhood with John Azoni

September 7, 2026 by dadofdivas

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

If you’re a dad on a mission to forge a lasting, meaningful bond with your daughter, “The Dad and Daughter Connection” should be your next podcast download. In a recent episode, host Dr. Christopher Lewis sits down with John Azoni, a father of two daughters (ages 9 and 11), who opens up about the real joys and sometimes messy challenges of raising confident, independent girls.

Intentionality and Presence
From the very start, Dr. Christopher Lewis sets the tone: fatherhood isn’t about achieving perfection, but about truly connecting and learning as you go. Each week, the podcast dives into stories and practical advice to help dads show up with intention. As John Azoni shares, “There’s no one right way to father our daughters,” but we can always add new tools to our toolbox by learning from each other.

Creating Meaningful Memories
A standout theme of this episode is making memories, both big and small. John Azoni recounts an unforgettable trip to Japan with his daughter for her 10th birthday—a tradition inspired by a parenting book. But the heart of the conversation reveals that it’s often the simplest moments, like cooking together or going for wonton soup every Thursday, that mean the most. One-on-one time, even a half hour at bedtime, can become the foundation for lifelong connections.

Honesty, Growth, and Mistakes
Both John Azoni and Dr. Christopher Lewis candidly discuss the challenges—especially during difficult times like COVID or navigating questions around faith. John Azoni is honest about making mistakes, from losing patience to not always having the answers. The key lesson? “I make a lot of mistakes and I’ve learned to be okay with that… I want my kids to grow up and know their dad was crazy about them.”

Encouragement to Other Dads
The episode wraps with powerful advice: Be intentional. Don’t let stress distract you from what really matters. As John Azoni puts it, “The grass is greener where you water it”—the relationships you invest in now will shape the future.

If you’re a dad, or know someone who is, this episode is a must-listen. It’s a heartfelt reminder that showing up, being present, and embracing imperfection are the real keys to building an unbreakable bond with your daughter.

Listen to the full episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection to get inspired and start your journey toward a stronger relationship today!

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to The Dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and The Dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there, it’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the Dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to connect with one another and work on building those that we want with our daughters one day at a time. I love that you come back every week because all of us are on a journey. Whether you have toddlers, whether you have a baby at home, whether you have teenagers at home, whether you have adult kids, we all are on this continuum of being a father to a daughter.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:19]:
And we can always learn more. We can always learn more to help us to be able to be better in the role that we have. We’re gonna stumble, we’re gonna fall, That’s okay. All of us do it. There’s no one right way to father our daughters. But what we can do is we can learn from other dads what’s working for them, what’s not working for them, and build some tools for our own toolbox, add some tools for our own toolbox, and be able to get just that much better every day because that’s what we need to be doing. to be able to be there for our daughters. That’s what we need to be doing to be able to be present.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:59]:
And I am really excited to have another new guest this week. John Azoni is with us today, and John’s a father of 2 daughters who are 9 and 11. And we’re gonna be talking about the journey that he’s been on with his daughters. And I’m really excited to have him here today. John, thanks so much for being here.

John Azoni [00:02:15]:
Thanks for having me. It’s great to be here.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:17]:
You know, it’s really, I’m really excited to be able to have you here today and to be able to talk to you about the journey that you have been on thus far with your daughters. And I guess one of the things that I always think about when it comes to raising our daughters is we’re always running after those moments. We want those moments with our kids. And as you think back to the years that you’ve had with your daughters thus far, what’s one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share with them and what made it so special? And one thing I’ll add is they could be separate moments as well.

John Azoni [00:02:49]:
So I read this book a number of years ago called Love Does. The author is Bob Goff and it’s a faith-based book. And in it, he talks a lot about parenting. parenting. And he told the story of taking his kids when they turned 10 on a trip anywhere in the world they want to go to, really leaning into what is it that they are becoming, what is it that they’re interested in, and, and where can we go in the world to kind of deepen that. And so I always thought that that was a cool idea. And my daughter, when she turned 10 last year, my daughter Ellie, in my mind I was kind of like maybe somewhere in the United States. I don’t remember explicitly saying anywhere in the world.

John Azoni [00:03:25]:
So when my daughter was like, I want to go to Japan, I was like, oh, okay. Well, so after a lot of hemming and hawing, I talked to my wife. She’s like, just do it. It’s like once in a lifetime. We’re like, all right, we’re going to Japan. So, so we went to Tokyo last May and it was so cool just to learn about another culture together, to really press into, you know, the stuff that she likes. She’s really into K-pop. It’s obviously not in Korea, but somewhere over there.

John Azoni [00:03:54]:
She’s into that kind of Asian culture and Hello Kitty. And they have the biggest Hello Kitty store in the world there, uh, video games and arcades where she can and do all the— she loves playing those claw games, which are really popular in Asian countries. So, so it was great. I mean, we just traveled around, we ate good food, we went to Paris Disney, um, and just spent a week together. That— and, and even just like, it was a pretty short trip, but— and people were like, well, you’re just going for like 5 days? Like, aren’t you gonna be— I mean, like, a big part of that is just traveling, you know? By the time you get there, I think we had 3 full days there. And I was just like, you know, it’s, it’s the adventure. It’s like traveling is, is part of it. We’re gonna learn how to do the airport together.

John Azoni [00:04:30]:
So on the way there, I kind of led the charge, but on the way back I was like, All right, where do you think we should turn to get to baggage claim or stuff like that? Or where do you think we should go to get our bags checked? So that was fun. And, you know, I’ve had other special experiences with my youngest daughter, Ryland. Currently though, we’re planning her trip. She wants to go to Paris. So we’re planning on going to Paris next year.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:50]:
Those will be experiences that they will never forget. And definitely you don’t have to do these huge moments. They can be small moments as well. But I had an experience like that last year with my oldest who is in college, but she was out in Colorado and I picked her up from a camp she was working in and we spent a week going to all the national parks all around in that area. So we went to Zion and Bryce and Grand Canyon and Petrified Forest, all kinds of places. And we hiked and we just had an amazing experience. And I think when you have those opportunities, not only are they great opportunities to be able to have to build memories, but you have time one-on-one. And I think that’s even more important.

John Azoni [00:05:32]:
Yeah, one-on-one time is really special. So last weekend, my oldest daughter went to Florida with my wife because she does dance, and her dance group went to go perform at Disney in the parade. And so that was just a life dream of hers. And she got this one-on-one time with my wife. And previously, we were kind of like, all right, we’re Disney’d out. We’ve been to Disney World. We’ve been on a Disney cruise. I took Ellie to Disney in Tokyo.

John Azoni [00:05:58]:
And we’ve been to Disneyland when we went to California last year. And my wife was kind of like, all right, this is the last time I got to go to Disney. And then I get a text from her in the middle of it. She’s like, this is so great. It’s such a different experience being one-on-one with Ellie and we’re just having the best time. And at the same time, I’m home with Ryland and we had our own special weekend. We, you know, wrote on the whiteboard, here’s all the things we wanna do and we wanna schedule all these things out. Anytime you can write a list on a whiteboard for my youngest, she’s all about it.

John Azoni [00:06:27]:
She loves to just like have a checklist, have a plan. So one-on-one time is something completely different that you just cannot replace.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:33]:
Now you talked a little bit about on that trip to Tokyo, giving your daughter some independence to be able to make some decisions and things like that. And, and as our kids are getting older, we definitely have to do that. How are you finding that you’re balancing not only guiding your daughters, but also giving them the independence to grow into the people that they’re becoming?

John Azoni [00:06:52]:
Oh, that’s a tough question. I try to lean into who are they and what is, what is my role in this? Like one of the things that I learned about Ellie on that Japan trip is how scrappy she is. And it’s so different for me. Like she has no problem going up and asking a stranger where to get directions. Or one time we were on the bus going somewhere in Tokyo and some lady was lost. And for some reason my daughter stepped in and starts trying to tell her where to go as if she knows where to go. I’m like, Ellie, where do you think you’re sending her? She just wants to get in there. And I’m just very like, I don’t like to be embarrassed.

John Azoni [00:07:27]:
I don’t like to ask for help. I’m a lot more shy, but she kind of lifts me up in that way. I really try to get on that level with her and also just try to let her be who she is and go out into the world and just talk to new people like her mom does. But I think it’s always a challenge where to step in. I think the biggest area that we are struggling with that right now is, is in faith. And I don’t know if you’re a person of faith, but when I got married, my wife and I were both devout Christians. And over the last 5 years, I’ve kind of deconstructed and my faith has evolved in a way— I wouldn’t say I’m not a believer, but I would say like I just have so many questions that I’m allowing myself to ask. And I’m engaging in these conversations with what I grew up believing versus what can be verified and things like that.

John Azoni [00:08:13]:
So I’m kind of down this more scientific path. My wife isn’t. How do we let our kids discover things on their own? And what do we teach them about the world? That’s been really hard because when you’re defining your parenthood around an entire ideology, like a religion, and that’s the lens that you’re giving your kids, and that’s the lens you’re told to give your kids, you’re instructed to teach them in this way. Well, now when you throw questions into the mix, mom and dad have different answers for what do you do? So I think we’ve kind of landed on. We want our kids to think independently. And when one of my kids has a tough question, I’ll say, well, here’s what I think. Here’s what I’m not sure about. Like, here’s what I have questions about.

John Azoni [00:08:55]:
Here’s what your mom thinks. And you can kind of make up your own decision. And that was also never more true in, you know, this most recent election. You know, my oldest had a lot of questions about who was running for president, who was the good guy, and who was the bad guy. And it’s easy to want to pick a side and train your kid on that side. But we really tried to just step back and be like, well, Well, here’s what this side says. Here’s what that side says. What do you think? And so that’s kind of where we’ve landed, I think, giving them some scaffolding, but letting them kind of figure it out themselves.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:26]:
And as you’ve been starting to do that with your daughters, especially around this faith journey, what has their response been?

John Azoni [00:09:33]:
It’s tough because they knew me when we were all praying every night and putting them to bed and going to church all the time and, you know, all this stuff. And so they’ve seen me kind of drift and ask these questions that they look at me as I’m supposed to have the answers To these, you’re supposed to know if if Adam and Eve are real people or not. And so that’s been tough. You know, their response has been honestly one of confusion. I wish I had a glossy answer for you. It’s not gone great. It’s very tough to navigate. And like I said, you know, we just go back to like here’s what two different people can think, and we can hold two different things in tension.

John Azoni [00:10:11]:
And certainly the Bible, there are a lot of instances where the Bible is represented as God holding two. seemingly opposing things in tension together and somehow making it work. So we kind of go with that. But yeah, I wish I could tell you that it’s gone. It’s just been perfect. And they’re— they have all the answers that I don’t have. But anytime you’re trying to sort through something on your own and your kid’s looking to you for the answer, that’s just a tough position to be in.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:36]:
It is a tough place to be because, I mean, you try to have that solid front on everything in parenting because when you don’t have the solid front, then things tend to go awry. So I think what you’re hearing here, though, is that John and his wife still have a solid front, but they’re attacking it in different ways. And they’re providing their kids the ability to be able to move in the direction that makes more sense for them. That doesn’t mean that they’re not in alignment on other things in their parenting journey, though.

John Azoni [00:11:07]:
Yeah, I would liken it to, like, giving them— I mentioned the term scaffolding, and I really like that term. And I would just say, So we’ve just really widened the scaffolding around faith to where we’re still in this box. But what that looks like on a day-to-day basis or on an individual beliefs basis can look different. And 2 people can arrive at different conclusions and still have the same heart.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:31]:
So as you think about your daughters and you think about what you’ve been doing with your daughters, what are some intentional ways that you have worked to strengthen your bond with your daughters, especially during times that might be more challenging?

John Azoni [00:11:43]:
COVID was a time of obviously being sort of forced into this intentional time. And at first it was very stressful because at the time I had a salaried job and a certain amount of PTO days and I’m a rule follower. So if I say I’m working, but I’m off at the park with the kids, like I don’t, I don’t feel good about that. But like there was all this stuff that you had to do from out of necessity during that time. So it was a stressful time, but it also kind of caused me to be like, let’s really soak this up. And so we did a lot of stuff together as a family, but that actually led me to leave that job. and start my own company, my own video production company. And for a big reason was to be more flexible with them and to be able to be home with them and be there when they need me and not have to worry about PTO.

John Azoni [00:12:28]:
And so that’s opened the doors to a lot of great times where I might be right in the middle of a busy project and I would get a call from the school. And my oldest, Ellie, she was the one that would call home a lot. She would feel a stomachache or something and she’d feel like she needed to go home. And we would have to navigate like a lot of times, like, what is the line that Where Dad will pick you up and where you need to tough it out. But there’s a lot of times where I could have been really stressed about work, but I had to just really be like, you know what, I’m just— I’m gonna go pick her up. I’m gonna be happy about it. I’m gonna have a smile on my face. I’m gonna make her feel like Dad wants to be here.

John Azoni [00:13:01]:
Dad cares about me. He’s not annoyed with me. You know, I think just those small acts have been great. And I remember, you know, other times too, just a lot of our special times revolve around food.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:12]:
Yeah.

John Azoni [00:13:13]:
It seems like every Thursday, a number of years ago when Ellie was in preschool, she would have a half day. And so I’d pick her up and every Thursday we’d go get wonton soup on the way home at this Chinese restaurant. And we learned— Dad stepped out of his comfort zone and learned the owner of the restaurant’s name so that when we called, we can say, hey, Lynn, our usual. She wanted that. Like, that would just be so cool. And so eventually she started calling and being like, hi, Lynn, it’s Ellie, just our usual. And then we’d go pick it up. But we cook a lot together too.

John Azoni [00:13:42]:
My daughters each really enjoy cooking and no matter what we’re making, just spending time together. And that’s where I think one-on-one time is really important because trying to cook with both of them at the same time is just a constant referee of who got to chop what, who got to pour this, who cracked the last egg, you know. So I found just one at a time, we’ll have a great time together, but let’s just, you know. So yeah, I mean, there’s a lot of opportunities, but I think it’s a lot in those small moments where it’s like my natural reaction might be to be stressed or just to be worried about the day-to-day. stuff, but like my daughters are looking to me as like, am I liked? Like, am I loved in this moment? Am I safe in this moment? Does my dad want to be here? And I really try to, to just put on a smile and just be like, you know what, this— because one of the things I say, I started saying since I started my own business was my business is in service of my kids, not in spite of them. And that’s a tough thing to, to stick to because whether or not something gets done has a very real consequences about whether, whether income comes in the door. But, but the reason why I— half the reason I started my own company was to be there for my kids and to not miss this time with them. And so, so yeah, that’s kind of how I think about work and spending time with them.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:01]:
All of us as dads, we’re not perfect. We make mistakes. And while we try our best to be the best we can, we’re going to make mistakes. We’re fallible. We’re humans. What’s a mistake that you made as a father? And what did What did it do, or what did you learn from it about fostering positive communication and connection with your daughters?

John Azoni [00:15:20]:
I think it’s a pattern of mistakes. And when I get overstimulated, when there’s too many people talking to me at once, I get immediate, like 0 to 100 stressed out. And that’s— I’m so likely to just lash out and like snap and say something, tell them to be quiet, but in a rude way that we’re not allowed to say. So that’s where it’s such a tension of like, because they’re both in the back talking like peak back-talking phase. And honestly, my youngest is the most cutting about it. I mean, she will just go right for the jugular. And they talk back usually as a reaction and not as a response, like not as an intentional response. So when I’m feeling stressed or overwhelmed and I lash out, I’m not doing any service to them.

John Azoni [00:16:06]:
It’s very hypocritical to tell them that’s not how we talk to people. And then just in a, in a different way or a different use of words, I do the same thing. So I think that’s— I think we’re all learning together. How to regulate ourselves. My wife is a therapist, and so we’ve learned a lot about the concept of regulation, and we’ve read a lot of parenting books about when your kids make you mad or something, or they say something completely disrespectful, they’re dysregulated. They’re not really choosing that response. And so your job as a parent is to be the one that regulates, not escalates. And so that’s— that is the toughest thing for me, like— I have to really think I’m feeling myself escalating this situation and I need to be the, I need to be the regulator.

John Azoni [00:16:50]:
So I don’t know if that answers your question, but that’s just a slurry of thoughts of, of communication between me and my kids.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:58]:
No, I appreciate you sharing that because I think it is important to understand that that happens. I mean, and we’re going to, things are going to adjust and, you know, and all of us get overwhelmed at times. And especially these days, there’s so many things being thrown at every one of us. And whether it’s technology, whether it’s, you know, whatever, there are so many things that are being thrown at each one of us, not only us, but our kids, etc. So it is important to know that. And then finding ways to be able to quiet the noise, not only for ourselves, but quiet the noise for our kids, I think is also important as we think about our— the way in which we’re fathering. Because if we know— if you know that you’re triggered when that happens, you have to figure out for yourself, and you’ve probably already done that, is What can you do to quiet the noise so that you can continue being present and continue, continue being who you want to be with your daughters?

John Azoni [00:17:51]:
Yeah, absolutely.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:52]:
So there’s been a lot of things that you’ve talked about where you’re showing that you’re doing some intentional things to really connect with your daughters. What do you do intentionally to make your daughters feel valued and heard?

John Azoni [00:18:04]:
I think it’s just trying to get on their level and care about the things that they care about. My youngest, it’s always was so funny, and we, my wife and I laugh about this. We would pick her up from daycare when she was younger, you know, 3, 4 years old. And that could be a very stressful moment because we’re also picking up my oldest from daycare and she’s wanting to do something. Can we go out for ice cream? Or when’s mom going to be home? Blah, blah, blah. And again, too many people talking to me at once. And my youngest, all she wants to do in that moment is show me the drawings that she made and show me the little worksheets that she did. And it’s so important to her.

John Azoni [00:18:38]:
And she feels, you can just see the receiving of love when you look at her and you care about what she wrote, that she wrote her name or that she did something, that she wrote, she counted to 10 or whatever it is. And so, I mean, we have stacks and stacks of paper because that behavior has never stopped. She’s almost 9 and she still to this day wants to show us everything. She went to this art camp a couple weeks ago, made all kinds of art. And the first thing she wants to do when we get in the car is like, Dad, let me show you what I made. And it’s so important that I give her my full attention. And I can get on board with that because I’m— my background’s in fine arts. I’m a painter.

John Azoni [00:19:14]:
So I went to art school and all that stuff. So that’s a perfect thing for me to like get on board with. I think just, yeah, finding in those moments, what are they really trying to say right now? What they’re really trying to say is, Dad, I want to connect with you. Not like, not necessarily about the papers or the drawings or whatever. And I find that with my oldest too. She’s starting to outgrow like bedtime, but she still wants me to put her to bed. And, you know, and I’m kind of just like clinging to that for as long as possible. And we just have the best talks.

John Azoni [00:19:43]:
Like, there’s just no greater conversation than when we’re just— I’m just laying in her bed with her next to her and we’re just, just talking about whatever, just laughing about things. I mean, so much laughter happens in those moments. And I listen when I’m putting my other daughter to bed, my wife’s putting Ellie to bed, I hear them cracking up too because they just get into the funniest, you know, they just become a new person. They feel so safe. And so I think just being intentional about those moments, because sometimes I’m like, I’m tired, it’s 9:30, I got to get up at 5 in the morning. I don’t want to spend a half an hour, you know, laying, laying with you and waiting for you to brush your teeth and waiting for you to put your pajamas on. And it’s getting towards 10 o’clock now. And so I try, but I try to really push that aside and say, hey, she’s, she’s not going to ask me to do this for much longer.

John Azoni [00:20:29]:
And in 5 years, I’m going to miss any, any attention she gave me, like her wanting to actually hang out with me, because it’s going to be the other way around. So, so I think it’s just, I think it’s just recognizing in those moments what’s really most important and then just leaning into that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:45]:
Now, we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our Dad Connection 6. 6 more questions to delve a little bit deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:52]:
Sure.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:53]:
What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughters?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:56]:
Humor.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:57]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice that you ever received?

John Azoni [00:21:02]:
It’s probably from when you’re walking around a grocery store and you get like a whole stream of like elderly men that will say, I remember when my daughter was that age and then she started driving the next day. Like, don’t miss it. I really actually took advice to heart, like what I just said. I’m like, there’s gonna be a time when they’re not gonna want to hang out with me, so don’t miss it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:20]:
What’s one activity you and your daughters love doing together?

John Azoni [00:21:24]:
Cooking.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:25]:
If you could give your daughters one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

John Azoni [00:21:30]:
I think just don’t change for other people. Don’t be the person that you’re with. I think like maybe girls especially start dating and things like that, they want to change to be liked and to impress and things like that. And so I think my advice would just be to just be yourself and be What’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad? I have learned, I have learned that I make a lot of mistakes and I’ve learned to be okay with that. I just want my kids to grow up and know that their dad was crazy about them. And for all my flaws, I want them to— I watched this video one time. It was my boss’s. We did a story on my boss at the time at my old job, his family.

John Azoni [00:22:11]:
And we interviewed his wife and they were talking about her parents and they asked her, what’s your favorite thing about your dad? And she said, said how much he loves me. And she started crying. And I edited that video. So of course, I’m like, I’m like tearing up and like, you know, you got the music going and stuff like that in the edit, in the video edit. So, but I’ve always kept that with me as like, that’s like my mantra as a dad. Like, I’m gonna mess up, but like, I want my kids to, to really feel and be imprinted with how like crazy I am about them.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:39]:
And finally, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

John Azoni [00:22:48]:
I think it’s just being really intentional with them. I think for me, I just think about, it’s like we have 18 years if we’re lucky, and I want to build as many memories with them as possible. And I don’t want to waste this being stressed about stuff that’s just not going to matter in 50 years. And so, and I think about it the same way of like marriage advice. People contrast the saying of the grass is greener on the other side. side with, with saying the grass is greener where you water it. And I like that about marriage. And that’s something that I keep in my mind.

John Azoni [00:23:20]:
But I also think that that applies to kids too. I mean, the type of relationship that you’re going to have with your kids now and when they’re older is determined by how intentional you are in these early years and just watering that grass.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:34]:
Well, John, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for being here today, for sharing what you shared with the journey that you’ve gone through. If people want to find out more about you, I know you got a podcast. Is there a place that people can go to find out more?

John Azoni [00:23:46]:
Yeah, I’m very active on LinkedIn. My name’s spelled J-O-H-N-A-Z-O-N-I if you’re searching for me. That’s probably where I hang out the most, on LinkedIn. I don’t post a whole lot of family stuff, but once in a while you might get some sort of business advice through the lens of being a dad to 2 girls.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:00]:
Well, again, John, thank you so much for being here, and I wish you all the best.

John Azoni [00:24:03]:
Thank you.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:03]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect; it’s about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes at dadanddaughterconnection.com. Until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:24:34]:
We’re all in the same boat. And it’s full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, we give the lessons, we make the meals, we buy them presents. So bring your A-game, ’cause those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast. Calling astronauts and firemen, Carpenters and muscle men, get out and be in the world too now. Be the best dad you can be. Be the best dad you can be.

Building Unbreakable Bonds: Chris Singleton on Fatherhood and Love

July 20, 2026 by dadofdivas

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

In the latest episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection, host Dr. Christopher Lewis welcomes an extraordinary guest: former professional athlete, best-selling author, and inspirational speaker Chris Singleton. This heartfelt conversation dives deep into fatherhood, resilience, and the profound ways dads can nurture strong, confident daughters, even amidst life’s toughest challenges.

Chris Singleton opens up about the joy and responsibility of raising his young daughter, sharing intimate stories—like their first daddy-daughter dance—that remind us how essential it is to be present and cherish each moment. He emphasizes intentional fathering, recognizing that quality time matters more than quantity and that even simple routines, like reading together or affirming your child’s beauty, play a vital role in building self-esteem and resilience. As Chris Singleton says, “Your presence, it matters. Even when you think they don’t see you there… your presence, it matters” 28:18.

A powerful part of the conversation addresses difficult topics: teaching compassion, navigating conversations about differences, and helping children process a sometimes divided world. Inspired by his personal journey through tragedy and the loss of his mother, Chris Singleton shares how he uses children’s books and open dialogue to foster empathy and curiosity in his children. He encourages dads to model respect for all, even when encountering different beliefs or backgrounds, and to proactively address hard questions rather than shying away from them.

Other highlights include practical advice for approaching conversations about race, mistakes Chris Singleton made early in fatherhood, and strategies for raising compassionate, curious kids in the age of social media. Vulnerability plays a central role; letting children see emotion and grief, he explains, not only builds trust but also reassures them that it’s okay to feel and share openly.

Ultimately, the episode offers a hopeful message: embracing love, forgiveness, and open-mindedness at home can prepare the next generation to lead with unity and understanding.

To every dad looking to grow deeper connections with his daughter—and to anyone seeking inspiration in today’s world—this episode is a must-listen. Hear the full story and practical tools by tuning in to The Dad and Daughter Connection—it may just change the way you parent, and the way you see the world.

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:53]:
Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to talk together, to work together to help you to be able to make those meaningful connections with your daughters one step at a time. It’s not always going to be easy. It takes time, it takes effort, and you do have to work at it. But it is so important to put in that work and to know that putting in that work is you are going to be able to build those connections and build those true bonds with your daughters that you want to have every week. I love being able to bring you different people with different experiences that are offering you an opportunity, an opportunity to be able to learn, to grow and to put some, I’m going to say, tools in your toolbox that you can take with you. And you may not take everything, but my hope is that you have an opportunity to be able to take something, whether it’s one thing, five things, 10 things that you’re like, ah, that’s something that I’m connecting to. And, and today we got another great guest. Chris Singleton is with us.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:55]:
And Chris is a former professional athlete who played for the Chicago Cubs. And following the loss of his mother in a racially motivated mass shooting, Chris has now become a nationally renowned inspirational speaker and best selling author. And he travels all over the United States and beyond to be able to spread a message of love, of compassion, and of really helping others to be able to think, think differently about the world around us and how we talk to one another, work with one another. But even beyond that, he’s a father of three and he’s got one daughter. So we’re going to be talking about his own experience in being a father to a daughter. And we’ll also talk about some of the journey that he’s been on and some of the things that he has been doing with his own kids to be able to help them to live in the world that we’re in today. So I’m really excited to have him here. Chris Singh, thank you so much for being here today.

Chris SIngleton [00:02:53]:
Absolutely, man. I’m grateful to be on talking about my baby girl. Girl, love it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:57]:
Well, I’m really excited to be able to be here today and to talk to you. I know we just saw each other at a recent conference that you were speaking at, and this is a topic that you don’t always get to talk a lot about. You mentioned your daughter in your speech, but I love it when we get to delve into fatherhood. And I guess first and foremost, I wanted to ask you about that relationship with your daughter. And I know she’s still young, but in her life so far and in your life with her so far, what’s one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share with your daughter thus far and what made it so special?

Chris SIngleton [00:03:28]:
Yeah, I think one of the most meaningful moments thus far is the first daddy daughter dance we did. You know, she’s almost three. And so at two years old, that daddy daughter dance and she was actually dancing. I was like, oh, it’s just going to be just her standing around and no, she was getting after dancing and wiggling and we had a great time. And there was a point where, you know, one of the older girls at their school started dancing with her and I just saw her. I was getting like a little emotional. Like, man, this is what a blessing it is that I get to be her dad and not only protect and provide for, but just be her friend. As she grows older and I’m looking at her, I just started getting emotional.

Chris SIngleton [00:04:06]:
So that was probably a moment where I actually stopped and just felt the moment. Because so frequently you have these experiences with your kids and you’re just like, oh, it’s an experience. You don’t really stop and just take it all in. And that’s one that I know in 20 years I’m going to remember that first daddy daughter dance that we did and how I was getting emotional. Like, man, how cool is that? I get to be her dad. So that was one so far.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:27]:
And like you said, your daughter is still young, but I’m sure that there are some ways in which some intentional things that you’re trying to do to be able to strengthen your bond with your daughter. So talk to me about some of those things that you tried to do intentionally with your daughter to be able to build that Unique bond with her versus what you’re doing with your sons.

Chris SIngleton [00:04:46]:
Yeah. And I think it’s super important because my boys, I coach them in baseball, I coach them in sports. And so she sees me doing this. We know. Even when we do bedtime, sometimes we’ll take the boys to bed first, and they’ll be talking about me coaching them. They’ll be talking about something baseball. And then my dad said. Then my daughter says something about, hey, Daddy, what about me with ballerina? Or what about me with this? And I’m like, you know, daddy loves that too, sweetie.

Chris SIngleton [00:05:09]:
And, you know, I can’t wait for you to go to your ballerina class on Friday. And so we have those same moments where it’s like, yes, I have my time with my boys, and I kind of combine the time with the boys sometimes, but I need to do a little better about splitting them up. Hey, older son get some time. Younger son gets some time. And most of the time, it’s like, hey, Daddy, with the boys. And then it’s like, daddy with baby girl. And whether it’s just reading with her the other night, I noticed it because I didn’t notice this with my boys. How.

Chris SIngleton [00:05:33]:
And I don’t know if you know, the stereotype is girls learn so much quicker. They’re so much smarter than boys when they’re young. But my daughter was literally sitting down in her. In the rocking chair that we usually sit in before bedtime, and she was flipping through this book as if she knew exactly what she was doing at 2 years old, and she’s pretending like she’s reading, and I’m sitting there smiling at her, and it was a beautiful moment. I’ve got this nickname for my daughter, and of course, I told you guys at the conference that I call her Chocolate Chip. And so every time I’ll say, hey, who’s my Chocolate Chip? And she’s like, I am. And I said, do you love dad? She’s like, yes, I love Daddy. And so we have these little small moments.

Chris SIngleton [00:06:07]:
But I know one day when she’s a little older, I might be dropping her off at school. And I’m like, who’s Daddy Chocolate Chip? She’s like, dad, come on. So I got to cherish these moments right now. And I surely, and I truly am

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:17]:
now, no dad is infallible. We all make mistakes. We’re humans. And I guess even this could be with your sons, too. But with your daughter, what’s a mistake that you’ve made? And what did you learn about fostering positive connections? With your daughter?

Chris SIngleton [00:06:33]:
Yeah. I think the biggest mistake so far is just thinking when I’m spending time with all three of my kids, that I’m spending time with every single one of them. And I didn’t do that with my daughter. I’m picking my boys up from school, we’re taking them to the batting cage real quick, Then we’re going back to get baby girl. Or it’s like, hey, my middle child likes to play golf, and so I’ll go play golf with him. I’ll let the oldest stay at home. And I’m spending quality time one on one with my older boys. And I wasn’t doing that with my baby girl.

Chris SIngleton [00:06:57]:
And my excuse, because we have to give ourselves excuses. I used to say, man, she’s so young. Can I do with her? And I realized you can do literally everything with her, too. And so I started to try to be more intentional about saying, hey, maybe this Friday I’m picking baby girl up early, and I’m taking her with me. Whether I’m riding around to the bank or whatever it is, just having her with me, spending that quality time, not just all three kids, but just with her. And I think that was probably a mistake I made early, is just having the excuse. Well, she’s so young, I don’t know if I can do anything with her. And I realized once I started bringing her with me, it doesn’t matter.

Chris SIngleton [00:07:28]:
You can take her just about anywhere. Even if we’re on the golf course, she’d like to just sit in the golf cart drinking juice box by herself and watch Ms. Rachel. So, like, sometimes it’s just bringing her with me and not using the excuse, oh, well, she’s too young. I think that’s a mistake that I made early on.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:43]:
Every one of us, as fathers of daughters, are doing what we can to be able to try to help our girls to feel both valued and heard. What have you done thus far to help your daughter feel that in your relationship to date?

Chris SIngleton [00:07:59]:
Yeah. I think every kid, but especially daughters, they find their confidence, they find their beauty, and they’ll ask daddy or mommy, hey, do I look beautiful? And my daughter is obsessed with those words. And so every morning when we get baby girl dressed and we’ll put clothes on her, she doesn’t like it, she’ll let us know immediately if she doesn’t like the clothes. So we already know at a young age she’s going to be some type of fashionista. And so she will put on her clothes. If it’s not a dress, she doesn’t want it. So we have to change her clothes and put on a dress and we finish and we do her hair, whatever it is, she’ll always give a little twirl and say, daddy, do I look beautiful? And I think she’s asking for that recognition. And I tell her every time I say, baby girl, you’re beautiful before, and yes, you’re beautiful right now.

Chris SIngleton [00:08:41]:
And so just hearing those words, I think is so important. Building that self esteem, knowing, hey, in my faith, I’m fearfully and wonderfully made, like God made me the way that I am, and I’m beautiful on the inside and out. And just hearing that from dad, I think it hits deep. Because yes, she asked mom, but she always runs to me and asks me to, hey, daddy, do I look beautiful? And she does a little twirl and I say, baby girl, you look so beautiful. And you see that smile, you see that confidence. And I never want that confidence to waver. And so as kids grow, there’s middle school where kids use mean words for no reason, but it’s just part of the gig. And there will be a time where I’m sure somebody’s going to say something about my daughter that, you know, isn’t the nicest thing.

Chris SIngleton [00:09:19]:
And my hope is that she’s heard from her mom, from her dad, from her family, like, I am beautiful, I am amazing, I am smart, I am courageous, I am all these different things. And so if she hears otherwise, it should be in one ear and out the other, because she knows she is. And that’s what I’m trying to instill at this young age. And hopefully she gets older. I’m sure there’s going to be still be those parts of her where she’s, you know, crying because X, Y and Z happened. But I want her to know deep down inside, hey, I’ve always heard who I am as a person. And so if somebody has something else to say about me, that’s a problem with them and not with me.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:52]:
I mentioned at the beginning that you speak all over the world. You have been bringing a message of love, your neighbor, to the world in many different ways. And your message of love, your neighbor really came out of an incredibly personal tragedy. How has becoming a father changed the way you think about that message today?

Chris SIngleton [00:10:14]:
Yeah, well, I think initially the only reason why I started writing children’s books is because I’m thinking, how do I even tell my own kids about my story? It’s very traumatic. It’s very glass half empty type of story. Not message but story, I mean, just losing my mom the way that I did and having to tell your kids that, you know, unfortunately there are some people that hate others because of the chemical in their skin that makes them the color that they are or telling your kids, hey, unfortunately, there’s people that judge others based on their first language and all these different things that they’re hard conversations to have with your kids, especially when there’s tragedy involved. And so writing children’s books is the way that I said I can talk about tough things in a non traumatic way. And so yes, there’s going to be conflict in my children’s book, but it’s not conflict of losing a life. It’s a conflict of maybe a kid gets picked on because the clothes that they wear or maybe their hair is a little different or maybe they wear glasses or whatever it may be and so they feel a little different. But in the end of my stories, they’re always celebrated, no matter where they’re from, what they look like or what makes them different. And sharing this with my kids, sharing it with kids all across the country in the world, kids start to look at each other a little different, like, oh man, okay, so we all have something that makes us different.

Chris SIngleton [00:11:17]:
Maybe my grandma does raise me, that makes me a little different. I don’t have my mom and dad raising me. But you know what, that’s okay. This person’s a little different because maybe they’re on the spectrum or maybe they wear glasses or I’ve even had kids would say, hey, Chris, I’ve got six fingers and I thought I was the weirdest kid in the world until you showed that everybody has something that makes them different. Now, you know what? I’m not ashamed of my difference. It’s what makes me who I am. And so sharing this with my kids, sharing it in children’s books is the easiest way for me to talk about tough things in a non traumatic way. And it’s been a blessing to be able to do that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:47]:
As I thought about that, as parents, many of us want to raise our kids who are compassionate and empathetic, but we also know that the world can be divided. What would you say are some practical ways that dads can intentionally model love and respect at home?

Chris SIngleton [00:12:01]:
Yeah, I think first and foremost, I think there needs to be. You have to teach your kids there’s a certain level of respect we have for everyone. In doing so, you say, hey, this is maybe not the way that we do it in our family, but some families out there do it that Way. Now, you don’t compromise on the things that you believe in and things that you hold near and dear to your heart and your morals, but you acknowledge that, hey, to your daughter, like, hey, this is the way that some people do it. Now, we don’t think that way, we don’t believe that way, but we still going to respect them because that’s how they think, and that’s how they believe. I think having that conversation early on and letting them know you don’t have to compromise on who you are to just acknowledge that somebody else does something different is powerful. So doing that, I think it’s been really cool to see that in the progression. And then it also, when your kids ask you questions, you got to be able to answer them, because even at a young age, it’s like, hey, well, dad, what are they saying? It’s like, oh, well, that’s Mandarin, right? That’s not what we speak, but that’s a language out there.

Chris SIngleton [00:12:55]:
Or you see families that look totally different than yours. You’re like, well, dad, what is that? And you’re like, well, hey, that’s not the way that we do it, but that is out there. And so I just want to teach you and let you know that things may be different out there, and maybe that’s not what you believe or what I believe as a family, but that’s out there. And I think sharing that early on helps people, especially our daughters, understand. Okay, just because it’s different doesn’t mean we have to hate or doesn’t mean we have to do that, because that’s not what we do. But we can still acknowledge that that could save some kids and our daughters from. From learning things elsewhere and not talking to us about it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:30]:
I mentioned that you speak to organizations and schools and other groups across the country about and connection. What conversations do you think that parents are avoiding right now that they actually need to be having with their kids?

Chris SIngleton [00:13:46]:
Yeah, just the one I just shared, right? Talking to kids about how some families may look different or how, like, I’ll give you a prime example. When my oldest was five years old, he went to school and he told me how one of the. One of his classmates had two moms, and he’s like, well, dad, you know, where’s. Where’s your dad? And I was like, hey, well, this is how they do things, their family, dad. It’s a little different than what mommy and daddy have, but that is out there. And so sometimes as parents, we’re like, man, I don’t want to talk about that, like, they’re shying away from it instead of leaning in and letting their child know, hey, this is out there. But that’s just not what we do in our family, in our household. And as awkward as it is, as nervous as it makes you to talk about certain things, believe it or not, the kids are seeing it, and they’re putting two and two together in their own minds.

Chris SIngleton [00:14:29]:
And so they need Daddy to be there. They need parents to be there to kind of navigate that for them so that they’re not questioning everything else. That’s what I’d say is important. And don’t shy away from it. You gotta lean into it. In one of my books, I say loving everybody, whether their skin is darker or lighter, whether their skin is looser or tighter, their hair is looser or tighter, whether their skin is wrinkled or rough. Why should it matter? Love is enough. And so we’re talking about different people and different things.

Chris SIngleton [00:14:54]:
You know, some people are on the back end of life, and we just share all these different intricacies about being a human being, and we’re talking with kids about that, and I think that’s beautiful.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:03]:
So the reality is that difficult events happen. Things do happen. People see it in the news, and some of these do involve race, hate, or violence. How do you think that fathers can approach those conversations with their kids in age appropriate but meaningful ways?

Chris SIngleton [00:15:18]:
I will say one mistake I made as a. As a dad is sometimes I talk to my oldest. Because, you know, you’re your first. Your oldest is like your guinea pig. You’re just. You’re doing everything you can trying to figure it out, right? And I wouldn’t let my son have Nerf guns. I wouldn’t let him play, like, shooting video games. And one day he finally like, why can’t we do this, dad? And I said, because, you know, Daddy lost his mom to a person with a gun, and it was a very hateful guy.

Chris SIngleton [00:15:41]:
And so then my son became very scared of just anything with guns. And I said, man, I probably told him that a little too young. And so what I should have probably said, going back is like, hey, we’re not gonna do that, because Daddy doesn’t like those. And when you get a little older, they’ll tell you why. And so when things happen in our world, maybe explain it in a way that, you know, maybe that’s not teaching love. Maybe that’s not loving people like we should and how Daddy’s gonna teach you. But that is out there, and that’s why I’m. It’s so important that I’m teaching you this because I never want you to feel that same way too.

Chris SIngleton [00:16:10]:
And so explaining it in that way early on is important. And then as kids get older, especially middle school, oh, my goodness. We think because middle school is the age where you want to shelter them, but life is being thrown at them because some kids are growing up a lot earlier than others and so they’re hearing stuff. And so we have to be proactive in saying, hey, this is what we think, this is what we believe. And yes, this is happening in the world and it’s terrible and you know, we hate to see it, but that’s why I’m teaching you the lessons that I’m teaching you, because I want you to know I want us to lead with unity and love the way that I think that we should.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:40]:
You know, your story is rooted so much in forgiveness. How do you teach either your kids or other kids the difference between forgiveness and ignoring wrongdoing?

Chris SIngleton [00:16:51]:
That’s beautiful. I think even when we give consequences to our own kids, it’s like, hey, I was in a small group with parents and one of our themes was I learned it from a dad who was phenomenal. So I use it all the time. And when we discipline our kids, we say, hey, I’m doing this to either keep you safe or make you better. Single time. I’m either doing this to keep you safe or make you better. Well, dad, why can’t I do X, Y and Z? Because I want to keep you safe. Doing that is going to hurt you or hurt somebody else.

Chris SIngleton [00:17:17]:
But dad, why can’t I do X, Y and Z? Well, I want to make you better. You’re not getting better as a person by doing that. So that’s why we have this consequence, right? And so in every scenario, sharing that has been really neat. And so I use it for everything. I mean, literally everything. Daddy, why can’t I have, you know, candy right now? It’s 9:30. You know, eating candy right now. You know, you probably don’t want to brush your teeth like you’re supposed to.

Chris SIngleton [00:17:40]:
That’s not going to keep you safe, right? You’re going to have cavities. You’re going to do X, Y and Z. It’s been a huge tool for me even as my kids get older. Well, dad, why can’t you buy me the nicest car? Well, I don’t think that’s going to make you any better. You got to have some sweat equity in this deal. And so if I give you everything, I’M not making you better. And so I’m going to use that with everything. And I think that’s the tool that all dads should have when they.

Chris SIngleton [00:18:01]:
They had to discipline their kid or have to say no.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:04]:
You know, a lot of dads worry about saying the wrong thing when talking about race or bias with their kids. What kind of encouragement would you give to parents who want to start these conversations but are feeling uncomfortable?

Chris SIngleton [00:18:16]:
Yeah, well, we have to do the work on ourselves first and figure out, make sure we’re in a good space to teach. Because the worst thing you could be is a hypocrite and you’re telling your kid to do something and you’re doing the exact opposite. And so I think that’s the number one thing. You lead by example. I don’t want to touch back on the whole forgiveness piece just really quick, because I don’t want to rush past that. When I think about forgiveness, forgiving doesn’t mean that there’s no consequence. There’s no accountability. Right.

Chris SIngleton [00:18:41]:
So if I forgive my daughter for doing something, I’m still going to say, hey, you still got time out. I still love. You know, I love you, but you still have to sit in time out for a minute because that was not kind to do. That was not smart. You didn’t listen. So it doesn’t mean that I forgive and just pretend like it didn’t happen. No, you’ve got to learn from your mistakes. But I also say my faith, belief, forgiven.

Chris SIngleton [00:19:00]:
And we all are forgiven if we receive that. And so it’s a line where it’s like, hey, there’s accountability, but there’s also grace. And I think you got to have both. And so I want to just touch on that really quickly because I don’t want people to think that forgiveness is letting the person off the on the hook. No, there’s going to be consequences, But I forgive to move forward. And I think that’s big.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:18]:
Some of the things that you’re talking about really are. I’m hearing you, that you’re encouraging your kids to be curious. They really try to see the world in a broader view. What are some simple habits that, that dads can build into their lives that help their kids to grow up with a mindset of curiosity instead of fear toward others?

Chris SIngleton [00:19:38]:
I think a big one is watching sports. You know, I said, we’re gonna talk too much sports. But, you know, you got the World cup coming up. You had the Olympics. You know, when the Olympics are here, learning about different countries. Well, dad, what’s Botswana. I don’t know. Let’s look it up real quick.

Chris SIngleton [00:19:51]:
Let’s look up what they do in Botswana. Let’s look up their culture. So having these. These conversations is really cool. In our household, soccer is big because my wife is from Brazil. And so because my wife’s from Brazil, I’m sure my daughter’s gonna grow up playing soccer because mommy’s gonna want her to play soccer like my wife did. And so, you know, you’re gonna learn about different cultures. You know, the more that you play sports, and if you’re a dad that likes sports, you know this.

Chris SIngleton [00:20:13]:
The longer you play sports, the more that you’ll play with people that are from different places, different cultures, different whatever. And that’s a beautiful thing to teach your daughter. One of my friends, his daughter was actually really, really good in soccer. And then she started playing in college, and she started playing with girls from around the world, and she’s like, whoa, you know, there’s different levels to this. And you realize that once you start playing at a higher level. And so watching sports, learning about different countries, the World cup, the Olympics, and then you dive deep when you watch with your daughter, like, hey, let’s look up Morocco. I always love looking up language, food, and where it is on the map. And so those are three things I love looking up.

Chris SIngleton [00:20:49]:
And so if we’re watching France, because we think France is going to win the World cup, and we’re like, let’s look up France. Let’s see what they got going on over there. And having those conversations, it’s fun, and it’s in a proactive way. And then when something may happen in the world, you’re not, like, circling back, man. I don’t. You’ve never talked about this place before. It’s like, no, we want to be upfront about different places in the world.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:09]:
I’ll ask you one other question about sports, and that really comes down to the fact that I’m sure that there are things that have happened in your life through sports that have provided you some lessons and things that have helped you to be the father that you are. So what lessons from sports or teamwork have influenced the way in which you father your kids? Kids?

Chris SIngleton [00:21:27]:
Yeah. Well, I. I’ve read some statistic, and I’m going to butcher it, but I. I saw, like, most women in leadership played sports at a young age, and I don’t know what the percentage was, but it was a high percentage. A high, high percentage. And so, dad, you guys can look that. That percentage up So I think sports are good just to put your daughters in sports. I think it teaches accountability, it teaches leadership.

Chris SIngleton [00:21:46]:
It teaches leading by example, because your teammates won’t buy into anything you’re saying unless you’re doing it too, so you got to do that. It also teaches failure. Failure and realizing, hey, we’re not going to succeed in everything all the time. But how you respond to that failure is everything in life. And so if we turn the ball over in basketball, or we strike out with the bases loaded in softball, or if we miss a free throw when we really needed to in basketball, like, whatever it is, how we respond to that is how we will make up majority of our lives. So those are some things that sports has taught me as an athlete.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:16]:
You know, I think about the world today and how social media has really created a lot of division. How do we help kids hold on to hope and kindness when they’re constantly exposed to negativity online and in the media?

Chris SIngleton [00:22:31]:
Yeah, I actually did some work with our legislators about this because I saw that social media has just become so divisive. And I love the stories where it’s like the kid with a lemonade stand out at the first tee, raising money for his buddy in school that has cancer. I love those stories. We need more of those stories. But it seems like we get pushed and we get fed the beast of the algorithm is anything divisive just gets. Gets pushed to us even more. And so censoring or monitoring what our kids are watching are engaging in is important. And then making sure, because we have to make sure that our kids aren’t the ones that are bullying or on the other side of that.

Chris SIngleton [00:23:07]:
And we all think, especially our daughters, like, oh, our daughter is just. She’s so amazing. She’s the nicest person ever. She would never. Until we started reading some of the stuff that they’re posting, we’re like, hey, we might have to have some conversations. So being proactive and not being blind to that is important as well, because we never think it’d be our kid to be the bully until we find. Find out that it’s our kid that’s the bully. And so just monitoring what they’re watching, what they’re saying.

Chris SIngleton [00:23:28]:
And then I always say there is. It is a blessing and a compliment to have high expectations for your kids. And so with our daughters, I have high expectations that you won’t do this online, you won’t say this online, you won’t be that person online. And so if that’s my expectation for you, it May be high because I’m monitoring your stuff. I’m making sure you don’t say X, Y and Z. I’m doing that at a place of love because I have these expectations for you. You. And making sure that the algorithm that they have isn’t one that’s going to fuel hatred and division.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:57]:
You know, you’ve inspired a lot of audiences through vulnerability and honesty in what you share in front of the groups. How important is it for dads to let their kids see emotion, grief, and healing?

Chris SIngleton [00:24:11]:
Oh, my goodness. It’s so big. Because if our daughters, our kids especially, just grow up thinking that dad doesn’t show any emotion, sometimes they’re gonna think they shouldn’t show emotion or they’re not going to come to us because he won’t understand. Because I’ve never seen him get sad, right? So if they’re sad, you know, I probably can’t tell dad because he won’t understand. I’ve never seen dad sad before. Now, if we’re open and vulnerable, it’s like, you know, I can come to dad with anything because I’ve seen him have the same emotions that I felt and he’s going to feel with me when I share this with him. I think that’s big. And for so long as husbands and fathers, we think, man, we have to be that rock that nothing shakes us.

Chris SIngleton [00:24:46]:
Us, right? We’re the foundation of the family, and nothing should shake us or hurt us. But in doing so, sometimes things won’t get to us because, hey, he’s not going to understand. He won’t get it. Because I’ve never seen him say that he messed up, or I’ve never seen him say that he’s grieving right now. And so I think it’s so important that we’re open and honest with our feelings and our emotions. Even other day, I’m watching a video in the car, and I saw this video. It’s like this kid had his dad at one of his games, and before the game, he got his son a new baseball bat. He hit a home run for his dad on Father’s Day, the dad catches it outside of the fence, and he’s like, I got it.

Chris SIngleton [00:25:23]:
I got your home run ball. And you see the son kind of point to the dad, the outfield. And I’m crying real tears, man. And my daughter, my son, they’re like, dad, are you okay? I said, daddy’s fine. But this made me feel emotional because this is a beautiful moment. And so I have happy tears right now, guys. And so like having those conversations, them, they see that dad has feelings too. And yes, we’re strong, yes, we’re going to protect our baby girls, our daughters.

Chris SIngleton [00:25:48]:
But they need to know, hey, we have feelings too. So anything that they feel they can share with us as well.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:53]:
What legacy do you hope to leave not only through your speaking, but through your role as a father?

Chris SIngleton [00:25:58]:
Yeah, one non negotiable that I have as far as my legacy is. I don’t want my kids to ever think daddy made a huge impact on the world, but he didn’t make a huge impact on us. I think that’s a, a huge failure as a man that I could have is if I do that, I want them to say Daddy was an amaz person. Not only to people around the world, but to us. He was dead. He was at our daddy daughter dances, he was at our games where we had our first hit or our first home, whatever it may be, he was there. It’s just being active and knowing that they have somewhere to run to or to talk to is huge. And then all the life lessons that I share with them, you know, I just hope that they keep 10% of them.

Chris SIngleton [00:26:32]:
That’d be my legacy. Right. I’m sharing stuff all the time and make sure you’re saving. We’re gonna do a Roth IRA for you young so you can do X, Y and Z. All these things. I just hope that they remember something of this stuff that I’m instilling in them and in doing so, maybe they run into a problem when they get older and they’ll say, you know, my dad always told me, and then they’ll share something else and that’d be huge legacy for me.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:52]:
So if every family embraced the idea of loving their neighbor, how do you think the next generation would look different from the one we have today?

Chris SIngleton [00:27:00]:
Man, what a beautiful question. I think that kids will grow up knowing that there’s going to be differences in the world. There’s going to be different faiths, there’s going to be different languages, there’s going to be different. Different Everything doesn’t mean different means bad. My wife is from Brazil and in Brazil the culture is all family. You don’t really move away too much in their culture, right? You don’t go away for college. I know you’ve got daughters that are going to college and all this stuff and they’re kind of moving away. And that’s not really the culture in Brazil.

Chris SIngleton [00:27:26]:
It’s all about family and having dinner together on Sundays. And so sometimes we could say you know what? Maybe I want that culture for me, even though I’m American. When you learn about something different, when you learn that, you know, sometimes times in some cultures they don’t use technology, they just sit around the table and talk and have meals together on certain days. I like that. And so maybe we can put that into our family values as well. And that’s beauty. When you see that when kids growing up, that different doesn’t mean bad. Different just means different.

Chris SIngleton [00:27:54]:
I think our world would be a lot better place now.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:56]:
I always finish our interviews with what I like to call our dad connection. 66 more questions to delve a little bit deeper into you as a dad. You ready?

Chris SIngleton [00:28:03]:
Let’s do it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:03]:
What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughter?

Chris SIngleton [00:28:08]:
I’d say right now it’s just very gentle. Right now, gentle is my word.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:12]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice you’ve ever received?

Chris SIngleton [00:28:17]:
Your presence matters. Is the best advice I’ve received. Your presence, it matters. Even when you think they don’t see you there and you’re just there for six hours, or are they really going to care? They’re so young. Your presence, it matters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:30]:
What’s one activity that you and your daughter love doing together?

Chris SIngleton [00:28:34]:
Right now I’d say he’s reading books together. She loves that. So reading is our activity right now.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:38]:
If you could give your daughter one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Chris SIngleton [00:28:44]:
Hard work is important. Would probably be. My biggest thing is like, hey, working hard is important. In a world where AI makes stuff easy and there’s shortcuts to everything, hard work is still super important.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:55]:
And what’s one thing that you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Chris SIngleton [00:28:59]:
I’ve learned that sometimes I need to stop and take in the moment more because I’m young guy and I had to grow up really quick and so I’m always ripping and running and doing that, you know, all these different things. But sometimes stopping and just being present in the moment is the greatest blessing we could ever receive. And so that’s something I’ve learned about myself.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:19]:
And what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Chris SIngleton [00:29:26]:
I’d say having high expectations for our baby girls is important. And never get so caught up in that you have to provide that you forget that being there matters just as much.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:37]:
Now, if people want to find out more about you, what you’re doing, your books, etc, where should they go?

Chris SIngleton [00:29:43]:
My website’s chrissingleton.com and I got all the social medias. If you just search up C. Singleton underscore two or just search up Chris Singleton, you’ll see all my content and stuff there.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:54]:
Well, Chris, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for not only sharing about your own journey as a father today, but sharing your message of love thy neighbor and help us think a little bit differently about the way in which we not only talk about this, but treat others. I truly appreciate the message. I truly appreciate the time and I wish you all the best.

Chris SIngleton [00:30:15]:
Thank you so much.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:17]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being correct perfect. It’s about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes@dadanddaughterconnection.com until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:30:47]:
We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers we spend the time we give the lessons we make the meals, we buy them presents and bring your A game cause those kids are growing fast the time goes by just like a dynamite blast Calling astronauts and firemen carpenters and muscle men get out and be the world you down Be the best dad you can be Be the best dad you can.

Embracing Change: Strengthening the Father-Daughter Bond as She Grows

July 13, 2026 by dadofdivas

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

In the most recent episode of the Dad and Daughter Connection podcast, host Dr. Christopher Lewis welcomes special guest Colin Gray—podcaster, international speaker, founder of The Podcast Host, and a proud father—to discuss the evolving journey of fatherhood and the unique relationship fathers share with their daughters.

This insightful conversation revolves around the central theme of connection: what it truly means to connect with your daughter as she grows, how that connection changes, and the intentional steps dads can take to foster it. Colin Gray reflects on his experience raising his now eleven-year-old daughter, candidly sharing that as children mature, simple activities like park visits or ice cream trips no longer hold the same power to bond as they once did. Instead, it’s the “little weird normal moments”—joining in on a silly dance or matching her energy in the kitchen—that create genuine connections. He urges dads to let go of preconceived expectations and instead meet their daughters where they are, embracing who they’re becoming.

Another major theme is the balance between guiding and granting independence. Colin Gray shares that encouraging his children to try things for themselves, even if it means letting them fail, has been key to building their confidence and autonomy. It’s about being there with support and constructive feedback, but resisting the urge to always be in control or solve every problem.

Intentionality shines through as a guiding principle: intentionally seeking out your daughter’s interests—even if they’re outside your comfort zone—fosters meaningful conversations and establishes trust. Whether it’s learning about makeup and hair to connect with his daughter, or simply being curious about her favorite YouTube trends, Colin Gray models engagement and the willingness to step into her world.

The conversation is honest about parental imperfection—both Dr. Christopher Lewis and Colin Gray admit to making mistakes, but emphasize the importance of being open to feedback from their kids and growing together. They highlight the value of mutual respect, adaptability, and leading by example.

This episode serves as a warm reminder that strong relationships aren’t built on grand gestures, but on consistent presence, adaptability, and listening. If you’re a dad looking for real advice, encouragement, and stories from the trenches of parenthood, don’t miss this episode. Tune in to the Dad and Daughter Connection and keep building the bond your daughter needs—one moment at a time.

Listen now and join the journey!

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to learn, to grow, to reach, work together on those relationships that we want to have with our daughters. And I say that it’s learning and growing because every day we have to learn and grow.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:06]:
We have to be willing to put ourselves out there. We have to be willing to set aside things that we think we know and go with the flow a lot of times with our daughters. And it’s important to be able to talk to other fathers, learn from other fathers, hear what they’re doing, and to gain some perspective, because we don’t have all the answers. Let’s be honest. None of us are infallible. There’s going to be times where we make mistakes, and many of us may not have a lot of examples of what fatherhood is before we become fathers. So that’s why every week, I love being able to have different people with different experiences that can offer you some different perspectives to help you in your own fatherhood journey. And today we got another great guest.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:51]:
Colin Gray is with us, and Colin is known as the podcast host. Colin and I have known each other for a while, and I’ve loved listening to him and what he’s been doing, but he’s a podcaster, he’s an international speaker, a he’s founder of the podcast host and Alitu the podcast maker. But he started out in astrophysics before realizing how much math you had to do. So that being said, he turned to podcasting, and he has made a amazing, amazing life for himself and his family. And we’ll talk a little bit about the journey that he’s gone on, but also we’re going to be talking about his own journey in his journey as a father to two kids and especially his oldest, his daughter. And I’m really excited to have him Here. Colin, thanks so much for being here today.

Colin Gray [00:02:43]:
No worries. Thanks for having me on.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:45]:
It is my pleasure. I really appreciate you joining me. I know it’s the evening for you, the morning for me, and but I appreciate you taking some time to chat about this relationship with your daughter. And I love being able to start by really thinking about this journey that you’ve been on because every one of us as fathers wants to have those moments, those moments that we connect and we work hard to try to create those moments with our daughters. What would you say is one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share with your daughter and what made it so special?

Colin Gray [00:03:16]:
I’ll maybe avoid the question slightly, but give you a different type of answer perhaps in that. One of the things that I’ve found or I’ve learned, I suppose, over the last five years as my daughter’s become much more grown up. She’s 11 now and it used to be quite easy to make a connection with her when she was like three, four or five. You just go and you do kind of anything and they just become absorbed in what you want to do with them and just love spending the time with you and you know, they’ll often just do whatever you kind of lead them into playing, you know, a game or Lego or go outdoors to the park, whatever that might be. As my daughter’s got older, I found those things harder because obviously she has much more of her own mind, her own preferences, her own things, things that she wants to do. And I found myself even a couple of years ago when she wasn’t getting into 9 or 10, as she was getting much more of those preferences, I would choose to say, let’s go for a wee walk into town, we’ll go and have a wee walk around, we’ll grab like a nice cake or something in the shop and then we’ll walk home again. And because she’s much more her set, her own person now, she’d have preferences and maybe be a bit grumpy or, you know, it wouldn’t be perfect and I would end up getting grumpy because it wasn’t as perfect as I, you know, wanted this kind of connection to be. And I would kind of sabotage it for myself.

Colin Gray [00:04:30]:
These days I’m much more accepting of the fact that actually those connections just come in those little weird normal moments actually and it’s less about planning, like to go in for a three hour walk with her into town and a cake or an ice cream or whatever and it’s more just Actually, I walk into the kitchen and she’s sitting there, whether it’s reading a book or doing a dance or whatever it is she’s doing. And I’ll just walk up behind her and do the same thing. It’s like something about matching her energy much more. And because she’s kind of just learning who she is, I guess as a developing human, I find that’s what actually creates the connection these days. It’s actually just those little silly, messing around things where she’s doing a dance and I just walk in and join in in a super stupid, silly way, and that’s it. And it’s those little bits and it just takes like 30 seconds. But actually, those are the times when we just laugh and smile at each other much more. And there’s much less chance that the kind of budding teenager in her creates some kind of friction that ends up with both of us being angry at each other.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:31]:
One of the things that I guess that I would ask in response to that is you said that there was a little bit of a journey for yourself in the sense of, you know, getting from where you were to where you are today. What were some intentional steps that you had to take to be able to, I guess, in some sense, let go and just be present and be a part of the energy that she’s giving versus having those. Those, I’m going to say, preconceived feelings of what you wanted to happen and then being let down because you have to be able to grow from where that was to where you are today.

Colin Gray [00:06:04]:
I mean, you know what it’s like when they’re small. You are like the definitive boss, aren’t you? Because they’re liable to do something that could hurt themselves. Or you need to teach them how to be humans, you know, how to be. How to be decent and nice and kind and share and all that kind of stuff. But there’s a point they get where they’re. Suddenly they know those things. If you’ve done your job well enough, then they mostly know those things. And you can kind of let go of that a little bit.

Colin Gray [00:06:29]:
And then actually it comes to the point where you’re trying to do nice things with them and make those connections that you’re talking about. But you can’t be the definitive boss in those. You can’t decide what their fun is. You can’t decide what their preferences are. You can’t say, oh, well, I like, I used to love going for an ice cream with you, and you used to love it as well. So now, because you say you don’t want to do that anymore, I’m going to get annoyed and grumpy. And I went through a point of that. So, yeah, you said the words there, letting go.

Colin Gray [00:06:55]:
And it was definitely a letting go of that. Partly you’re the one that’s always in charge and making the decisions, and there’s still a bit of that, you know, as a parent, no matter what age they are, of course. But you have to let go of a lot of that, I think. And let go as well of the fact that you feel like you know what they enjoy. Because I don’t know what they enjoy these days. Like, both of my kids, especially my daughter, she’ll teach her mind every other week, and that’s fine. She’s just figuring stuff out. But I can be surprised one day when I go and ask her to do something and she’s like, no, don’t like that anymore.

Colin Gray [00:07:27]:
And she doesn’t say it like that, of course, but something’s changed. So there’s something around letting go of predictability as well and kind of thinking that, you know, what will make that connection or please her.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:38]:
A lot of the things that you’re talking about really talks to the fact that our kids, as they’re getting into the age that your daughter’s in, is really pushing and stretching that rubber band of independence. We’ll say they want more independence than they’ve had in the past. How, as a father, have you been able to balance guiding your daughter while also giving her the independence that she needs to be able to become the person that she’s becoming?

Colin Gray [00:08:06]:
I think if there’s many things I’ve got wrong as a dad over the years, one of the things I think I have done reasonably well is the independence side of things. And I think I was. Myself and my brother were really independent kids when we were younger. My mom and dad worked. Both of them, they had to work. And also they were just quite independent themselves. They were both like farm kids, so they grew up on farms, and therefore they were given a lot of responsibility when they were kids as well. And that passed on to us.

Colin Gray [00:08:31]:
And so I come from a family that is kind of from that point of view, from an early age, you get on and you just kind of look after yourself. And I’ve always encouraged my kids reasonably gently, but sometimes forcefully, to do things for themselves. You know, they ask for little simple things done for them, and I’m like, no, you know how to do that. I’ll show you how. I’ll help you do it, but you’ll do it. And so I’ve often done that all the way through. And it’s one of the things where my wife and I differ a fair bit. But she enjoys doing things.

Colin Gray [00:09:00]:
Like she really enjoys looking after the kids and like making sandwiches for them and stuff like that. But then when she’s away for the week, the kids make their own sandwiches for their lunch. And I don’t think it’s. It’s not only because I’m lazy, it’s partly because I want them to know how to do that as well. So I’ve definitely encouraged that from the very start. Like they need to know how to do things and I’ll leave them to do those things and fail at them as well. My daughter was cleaning the car the other day and she volunteered to do the inside and I offered to pay her a bit more for the inside. And I was like, I could go out and I showed her a few things, but I just left her to it for a few hours and she came back and I went back and I told her, oh, no, that’s not right, that’s not right.

Colin Gray [00:09:37]:
And it was just. I think it’s that kind of constructive feedback is something that I do. I tend to treat them a lot more like grownups right from the start and. But then, yeah, alongside that, just play silly games as well. So there’s a bit of a balance there, isn’t there?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:51]:
There definitely is a balance there. And it sounds like there’s some intentional things that you’re trying to do to be able to build that bond, those connections that we have with our daughters, you talked about when she was younger and the things that you like to do and some of the things that you’re doing now, as you think about intention in intentional ways in which you’re trying to build that bond, what are some of the things that you’re doing today that you try to be intentional about as you’re building relationship and building that bond?

Colin Gray [00:10:18]:
I’m constantly trying to find the things that she likes that I can talk to her about. There’s a period she’s going through right now where she’s definitely connecting a lot with her mum because she’s getting into quite girly things like makeup and hair and things like that. And that’s cool, that’s wonderful to see them doing that. And they kind of. They go for little shopping trips in and buy like a little, you know, two pound lip balm that she gets really excited about and all these kind of things and it’s, it’s lovely to see. I can try. I can kind of like learn a bit, a bit about these things, but I’m just like, I’m a guy with no hair, so I can’t get into the hair stuff. I’m a 40 year old man, so I can’t quite get into the makeup stuff.

Colin Gray [00:10:52]:
I’ll try on the lip balm for sure, but can’t get too excited about an extra good lip balm. So I think I’m just constantly trying to ask her things like what she’s into. I think, you know, it might be the same with yourself, Chris, like around the kind of being in this world of podcasting and media and YouTube and all that kind of stuff. That’s one thing that I do find I can connect with her quite well with actually, because I’m really interested in like, you know, trends on YouTube trends and podcasting, trends in media in general. So talking to them about who they’re following and who they like and who they’re becoming fans of and even in music as well, but more so the visual media side of things, I find that a really good conversation. That’s something that I bring up often, actually, because I find that that’s a good way to connect because I probably know more about that stuff than your average mid-40s dad, just through the jobs that we do. So that’s one thing that I do a lot is try and have those conversations. So, yeah, I don’t know.

Colin Gray [00:11:40]:
Do you find that with your set, with your own daughters, you know, a little bit.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:43]:
I find I still don’t completely understand TikTok. I still don’t understand it, but. But my youngest loves showing me tiktoks. And I’ll watch them and I’ll be in my mind saying, I don’t get this, but I’ll be here and I’ll be present and I try to figure out what the intrigue is. So. And I think that as podcasters and someone. For me, it’s all about storytelling, right? And it’s about how do we tell these stories or allow other people to tell their stories. And I think you do that as well.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:18]:
And I’ve tried to impart that on my own daughters to try to explain to them the power of story and the power of allowing them to not only tell their story, but allowing for others to tell their story. And I’ve tried to show them that as well. And I’m sure you have too, right?

Colin Gray [00:12:35]:
Yeah, definitely. And you know, it’s interesting, you bring that up because it’s not something that I’d put a label on before, but something that my daughter and I particularly connect around a lot is stories around characters in our house. So something we’ve always played around with, even when she was really small. But it’s grown into. I kind of thought this would fall away, but it hasn’t. Is around, like, soft toys and dolls and that kind of stuff. And she’s not into playing with, you know, dolls and teddies and stuff like that anymore. But we have these stories around them that ends up the two of us play around with them together.

Colin Gray [00:13:07]:
So when I go in to say night to my daughter at night, she’s got a few different soft toys lying around in her bed. And they all have their names, but they also. Big backstories that we’ve made over the last, like, five years. There’s a great one, this big, massive yellow teddy that we have, which we acquired in Japan, actually, when we’re on a holiday there. And there’s a whole backstory around how we acquired it, but equally, it went for the trip around with us, and me and her were just sitting around, like, making this teddy do things all the way around this trip. And ever since then, as well, it’s had that story where it’s from Japan, and it’s. We do things around the house, and it’s got a personality. And I think.

Colin Gray [00:13:40]:
I’m not sure maybe everyone does this, to be fair, but I feel like we go a little overboard in giving all these toys personalities and backstory and making them do things over the years. And that’s definitely something that we connect around a lot. But you’re right, it’s. As you said there. It’s the story. It’s all around the backstory. It’s all around the plot, what their likes and their dislikes are and all those things. Is that kind of like.

Colin Gray [00:14:02]:
Does that make sense?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:03]:
It does. My daughters are at an age that we don’t really have those kind of stories anymore, but I do try to get them involved in what I’m doing. They’re not always interested in it, but I try to show them, explain them. I actually. I just was talking to my oldest the other day about. I said. I said, you’re a storyteller. You like to talk to people you like.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:23]:
I said, you should have a podcast. And she’s, oh, yeah, yeah, whatever, dad. And. But you never know. I mean, they watch, they. They learn, and you never know, they might decide to pick something up along the way.

Colin Gray [00:14:36]:
That’s it isn’t it. It’s all example. I think there’s so much. I fall into this trap as much as anyone. But it’s so much so easy to find yourself telling them something while doing another thing, isn’t it? Whereas if you just do the thing, you don’t need to tell them anymore because they just see that as normal. So yeah, exercise is one of those. Daphne’s a dancer so she does a fair bit of dancing and different formats and stuff. So she does a fair bit of exercise.

Colin Gray [00:15:02]:
But I think some of that has come from the fact that she sees me and my wife like we, we make a big point of, you know, working out four times a week and doing a fair bit of exercise and being active and getting out in the hills and all that kind of stuff. So I think example is so powerful.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:16]:
It definitely is. Now every one of us as fathers want our daughters to feel valued, heard and to know that we are there for them. What do you intentionally do to help your daughter to feel valued and heard?

Colin Gray [00:15:31]:
I think the main thing I try and do, rightly or wrongly, is I’ve always tried to be as honest and constructive as possible. And I think I’ve certainly. My wife thinks I go too far with this sometimes to actually criticize a painting. They’ve done a painting or made something and you’re like, don’t criticize that. That’s not the right word. But critical feedback. Oh. So good effort on doing this.

Colin Gray [00:15:57]:
I wonder what do you like about it? Do you like this part and this part? I love this part about it. I wonder that year is not quite right. I wonder if we draw that dog. How would you normally draw a dog ear? So it looks a bit more accurate and I certainly think you don’t. This is probably something that many people would disagree on, but I’ve always done that ever since they were quite small. So I think that has built more trust over the years. So that when I do give my daughter a compliment or I tell her she’s done well at something, I think she trusts it rather than, you know, as a kid you always appreciate the praise from your parents but. But you begin to realize that your mom’s going to tell you you’re great at whatever you do, no matter how good you are at it.

Colin Gray [00:16:35]:
So I think that’s what I’ve always tried to do is to be quite honest and be a little bit critical friend when I can so that trust builds. So is that something to do yourself? Do you find that with more grown up daughters have you had any feedback on that?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:52]:
I do. I try and sometimes I fail. And I think that they’re much more willing to tell me when I’m failing. And I think that that’s okay. I think that all of us, as I said before, none of us are infallible. We all make mistakes. And I think that we have to be willing to learn and grow and not be so set in our ways that we’re not willing to take that feedback ourselves. I try to give feedback to my daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:22]:
But you also come to learn when you can push, when you can pull, and when you just need to be still.

Colin Gray [00:17:28]:
Yes.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:29]:
And I think as they get older, that’s definitely something. You have to learn that along the way.

Colin Gray [00:17:33]:
Yeah, absolutely. And you’re absolutely right there around making it mutual. It doesn’t work unless it’s mutual. And we do that quite a lot, actually, me and my wife. We say, like I often say to both of our kids, listen, I know I’m getting you in trouble for something here. I know I’m giving you, like, telling you what to do and all that kind of stuff, but if there’s ever any. I’m always willing to take feedback. If there’s anything you think I’m wrong about, I will always listen to you.

Colin Gray [00:17:56]:
If you say it to me in a reasonable, fair manner, if we can talk in normal tone of voice, and we’re not going to shout at each other. If you ever give me feedback, if you ever want to tell me something if you think I’m wrong, please just tell me and I’ll always listen to you. I might disagree, but I’ll always listen as long as we can talk about it in a civil manner. And I think that’s often built a decent bit of trust as well.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:15]:
And I think a lot of fathers and parents in general get in trouble when they don’t approach parenting in that way. Because I think when you get into arguments and you’re butting heads, especially during the teenage years, because that tends to happen, that’s when things go sideways. And that’s when you say things you regret in the end or you injure or hurt the relationship in a way that becomes harder to come back from. And I like the word that you said when you said you come at this with a mutual, you know, and it’s. I think there’s a mutual respect. Right. You need to be able to provide respect for your child. You want them to have respect for you, too.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:57]:
But ultimately, as they get older, you need to show that mutual respect for the decisions that they’re making as they become adults, while at the same time knowing that you may not be agreeing with the decisions that they’re making.

Colin Gray [00:19:09]:
Yeah, yeah.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:11]:
Because I’ve had that happen.

Colin Gray [00:19:12]:
Yeah. I’m sure that’s one of the areas where I have a big weakness. Like my. Probably my biggest weakness as a parent is I can end up stuck on a road. Stubbornly. My wife will back this up. That I have a stubborn streak whereby if I have started down some kind of path, I say it relates to what we were talking about earlier. Like I’ve decided we’re going to have a good day by walking into town and having an ice cream and then we’re going to have a nice chat and then we’re going to come home.

Colin Gray [00:19:37]:
And that’s in my head. And stubbornly I’ll stick to that. Even though I realize my daughter’s not really into this anymore or she’s actually just had a bit of a bad day because her and her friend just had a little fight or something has happened which means that we should be changing plans. And it’s kind of ironic because I think run my own business. I do a bunch of other stuff that means I need to be flexible. I need to be flexible and adapt to plans. But with my children, sometimes I’m very bad at that. I’m not good at adapting.

Colin Gray [00:20:02]:
So when something starts and I end up on a track and I stubbornly stick to it, that’s when I end up seeing things I’ll regret all the time because I’ll somehow just refuse to be able to change my mind or to be able to go back on something. Even though I realize that I’ve ended up. It’s at least half my fault, if not more, that we’re now shouting at each other.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:21]:
And I think that showing them that adaptability is important because so often in life we have to be resilient and you have to bounce back. I just had an example of that with my oldest daughter up till Monday of this week. She was supposed to be flying out yesterday to go on a month long mission trip to Kenya. It got canceled Monday afternoon.

Colin Gray [00:20:45]:
Okay.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:45]:
Because of the diseases that were happening in and around Kenya.

Colin Gray [00:20:51]:
Yeah.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:51]:
And of course she’s devastated and you have to understand and you have to try to help her to be resilient. But there’s also that understanding of where your daughter is at the time to be able to be in the mindset of hearing that message while knowing that she may not be able to take that message in at the Right.

Colin Gray [00:21:13]:
Time. Yeah, yeah, totally. That’s a pretty general human thing, isn’t it? There’s certain times when we’ve had bad news or we’re in a bad mood, the last thing you want to hear is, oh, don’t worry, it’s going to be okay. Like, I don’t get. It’s not going to be okay. Yeah, it’s hard to find that empathy, though. That’s. Yeah, it’s difficult, especially with a teenager, I think it is.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:33]:
So, you know, I think, though, that showing them that adaptability, though, leads them to be resilient and to be able to see that it’s okay to change plans and it’s okay to move in a different direction. Now, I will say that if you have neurodivergent children, changing plans and being adaptable may be harder. And I’m just going to recognize that because I know that that can be more of an issue. I don’t want to say that all kids are going to be the same in doing that, but I think that it is still important to help them to be able to understand how can we be adaptable based on the life of what’s happening in our life, what’s happening today, what’s happening tomorrow and beyond.

Colin Gray [00:22:14]:
Yeah, definitely. I think. I don’t know. I’d be interested to hear your thoughts on this as well, Chris. But like, when we were in Japan last year, I found that a really interesting trip in the. We planned a lot less than we usually would. So we were there for a few weeks and there were so many little problems came up on that trip. Like something went wrong, something didn’t turn up on time, and it was all because we didn’t actually plan it that well ahead because we wanted to be quite flexible.

Colin Gray [00:22:37]:
But there was so many, like, great experience moments in there, around that hopefully the kids again, from example, isn’t it like seeing my wife and I say, all right, okay, so we can’t get that train after all. So can’t get to our hotel tonight. Which means pretty unfortunate, but we’ll find something else. So we just start looking for other things and kind of about. And talking to folk. And I think that’s sometimes actually a great way or I found a great way to show them that and to teach them that is actually to take a chance on something that’s a bit less. A bit more unpredictable. Maybe plan a bit less than you would normally or try a type of trip that you wouldn’t normally take or things like that.

Colin Gray [00:23:13]:
And then obviously attempt not to entirely Panic when it goes, goes wrong yourself, which is not always the easiest thing, but give it a go at least. Have you ever tried something like that?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:23]:
I have. You know, and I think I find that I tend to like to be busy when I’m on vacation, like you’re saying. And I tend to like to know what’s around and, and I try to plan things but sometimes the, the best trips that we’ve been on have been ones where we have a general sense of what we’re going to do but then we leave it open to a bit more chance of okay as we’re driving around. You know, it’s not that we have to be there right at 10 o’, clock, but hey, that sign says something’.

Colin Gray [00:23:55]:
Here.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:55]:
Maybe we, let’s, let’s take that little side trip and we don’t have to be there right at 10. We could be there at 10:30. Let’s go check that out. Or you know, you’re, you’re walking and you’re headed toward a direction but then you see a, a side shop that looks really interesting. Is it going to matter that you’re 10 minutes late? Maybe it will. And if that’s the case, then you can come back. But if there, if you don’t have the specific things that you have to do at the right time, at the right, you know, in the right order, sometimes it’s fun and it makes it even more memorable.

Colin Gray [00:24:27]:
Yeah, definitely more memorable. I mean some of the most memorable things we’ve done all together as a family were completely unplanned, completely unpredictable or even it’s just a complete mess ups. Like when the car breaks down and you have to walk a mile to the garage and you get stuck somewhere in a bog because you try to take a shortcut. You know, silly things like that, that’s the stories that stick around. It’s never the ones that you, you plan for like the beautifully crafted Christmas dinner or the, or the, you know, the trip that was planned within an inch of its life that was meant to be most memorable. It’ll be, it’ll be the silly, the silly one thing that went wrong on those things every single time that comes up, isn’t it? It’s always the family stories.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:03]:
Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our dad connection. 66 more questions to delve into you as a dad. Are you ready?

Colin Gray [00:25:10]:
Go for it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:10]:
What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughter?

Colin Gray [00:25:14]:
Feisty.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:15]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice that you’ve ever received I that it’s

Colin Gray [00:25:20]:
always just a phase. So if it’s something good that’s happening right now, if they’re in a great mood, if they’re all like, if the relationship’s going well, then appreciate it, because it will probably change. But if it’s all going terribly, if they’re behaving terribly, if there’s something bad happening, you can’t get them toilet trained, whatever it might be, it’s just a phase. It’ll pass. So either way, if it’s good, appreciate it. If it’s bad, it’ll pass.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:42]:
What’s one activity that you and your daughter love doing together?

Colin Gray [00:25:45]:
Piggybacks still. Even though she’s getting way too heavy and it keeps me strong.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:51]:
If you could give your daughter one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Colin Gray [00:25:55]:
I think it is something around what we were talking about there, around resilience and change. It’s like things will change, but you have the strength and the intelligence and the resilience to adapt it. No matter what goes wrong, you’ll figure out a way that our family is a family of problem solvers. That’s what we all do. So we love to solve problems. So just see it all as an interesting challenge.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:17]:
What’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Colin Gray [00:26:20]:
That I am a much better person to be around when I can abandon my preconceived expectations and actually just go with the flow more.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:29]:
And what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Colin Gray [00:26:36]:
There’s something around probably the hardest thing which is holding them more loosely than you feel like you should, whether that’s how much you need to protect them, whether it’s how much you need to guide them or whether it’s how much you need to tell them the way to do things. We should probably. I certainly I should. I have learned certainly to do that more loosely than I naturally would otherwise.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:59]:
Well, Colin, I just want to say thank you. If people want to find out more about you and what you’re doing with podcast host or anything else that you’re doing right now. Where should they go?

Colin Gray [00:27:08]:
Yeah, probably the best place actually is just go over to Colin Gray. So my name, Colin Gray link. That’s kind of links to all the stuff I’m doing. So yeah, just Colin Gray link.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:16]:
And I’ll put a link in the notes today to for you to be able to connect with Colin. Colin, thanks so much for being here. Appreciate the time today. Appreciate you sharing your story. I know it’s continuously evolving and it will continue to evolve as your daughter gets older, but I really appreciate your time today and for you sharing with us and I wish you all the best.

Colin Gray [00:27:39]:
No, thank you very much for having me on. It’s always a pleasure to chat. It was good to catch up. So, yeah, cheers.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:44]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect, it’s about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes@dadanddaughterconnection.com until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:28:14]:
We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers we spend the time, we give the lessons, we make the meals we buy them presents and bring your A game Cause those kids are growing fast the time goes by just like a dynamite blast Calling astronauts and firemen Carpenters and muscle men get out and be the world to them Be the best dad you can be Be the best dad you can.

Laughter, Listening, and Lessons: Keys to Raising Confident Daughters

July 6, 2026 by dadofdivas

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

If you’re a dad eager to strengthen your relationship with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’ll want to tune into the latest episode of the Dad and Daughter Connection podcast. This episode dives deep into real stories, practical advice, and genuine reflections on the journey of fatherhood.

Hosted by Dr. Christopher Lewis, this episode welcomes guest Daryle Brown, a retired director of Social Justice and IT at Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago, and a father of two adult daughters. What emerges is a warm, honest conversation filled with the kind of wisdom every dad could benefit from.

Consistency and Open Communication:
Dr. Christopher Lewis and Daryle Brown emphasize the importance of being consistently present and level-headed in your daughter’s life (03:03), regardless of the circumstances. Daryle Brown shares how maintaining open channels of communication allowed his daughters to feel comfortable coming to him with anything, even the difficult topics.

Balancing Guidance with Independence:
A recurring theme is the challenge of balancing parental guidance with granting daughters the freedom to make their own choices (06:27). Daryle Brown explains how crucial it is to support, not control, and to accept their individualism—even when their paths or decisions differ from our expectations.

Intentional Engagement:
Being an involved dad is about more than just showing up; it’s about active participation (09:35). Whether attending soccer games or offering life advice, Daryle Brown highlights the impact of being genuinely engaged and available during both the ups and downs.

Listening and Patience:
Another heartfelt takeaway is the power of listening—really listening—before offering advice (15:16). Patience is key, both in conversations and in the natural progression of a child’s growth. Daryle Brown also credits humor and shared laughter as essential elements in building enduring connections.

Lasting Wisdom for Dads:
In his closing advice, Daryle Brown urges dads to be patient, listen deeply, and infuse their relationships with laughter. As he reminds us, “Humor is so critical… it just melts the challenges and the difficulties.”

This episode is packed with down-to-earth insights and encouragement. Subscribe to the “Dad and Daughter Connection” and discover practical ways to show up as the dad your daughter needs. Listen now and keep building those strong, lasting bonds!

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week I love having you come back to learn, to grow, to be able to find new ways to be able to build those strong relationships that you want to build with your daughters. And that’s why this show exists every week.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:07]:
I love being able to have you here to gain some hints, some tips, some tricks, some things that you can use right away, to be able to demystify some things and to be able to figure out some ways in which you might be able to adjust what you’re doing, to be able to create those connections. And I do that every week by bringing you different people, people with different experiences that have done fatherhood in different ways. And I love being able to do that because I think all of us can learn even that no matter where we are in this journey of fatherhood. You know, I’ve got two daughters. I know you’ve got daughters, and that’s why this is important. I learned from our guests. I know you do, too. And today we’ve got another great guest.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:51]:
Darrell Brown is with us. And Darrel is someone I’ve known for a number of years. He actually was a guest of a past podcast that I did in the past, and I talked to him about fatherhood then, but we’re going to be talking it more. Darrell just retired as the director of Social justice and IT for Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago and now is living on a farm. So a little bit different and different experiences, but I’m really excited to be able to talk to him, catch up and talk a little bit more about his own journey with his daughters. Darrell, thanks so much for being here today.

Daryle Brown [00:02:24]:
Thank you. It’s a pleasure.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:25]:
Well, I’m really excited to be able to have you here today. And I guess I know you’ve got two daughters. They’re adults now and doing Their things. And I know that they’ve some really amazing things happening in their lives. I’d love to have you think back to your relationship with your daughters and what’s one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share with your daughters and what made it so special?

Daryle Brown [00:02:47]:
Well, I think that it’s hard to gauge a moment that was just life changing, so to speak. I think what’s been more important in the relationship I have with my daughters is consistency. Them understanding that they could pretty much talk to me about anything, being level headed. When you hear things that may not exactly be along the path that you may want them to go or have them thinking along the lines that you want them to be thinking and to be able to accept their individualism. I think that’s kind of the tone that I’ve taken with them over the years. And it’s worked to the extent that we still communicate very openly, very freely when alcohol or marijuana, those types of things. When my children decided to experiment, so to speak, it was not something that they did secretively. I took my girls out for their first drinks.

Daryle Brown [00:03:38]:
Well, not really, but it was supposed to be that way. I remember now this is my baby daughter, Kamara, my youngest daughter, so she’s 31 now, I think. And I remember her coming to town because she was in college, out of town, she came to town and I remember finding her id, her drinking eligible ID that wasn’t real and being just terribly concerned because what if you get caught with two driver’s licenses and you get pulled over? What kind of damage is that going to do to your whole life? And of course she minimizes, she was like, oh dad, you know, it’s no big deal, everybody does it, blah blah, blah, blah, blah. But for me it was, it was very concerning. It was a prayer moment because I know how the system can react to these types of situations and you never know how deep that rabbit hole is going to run. So needless to say, she grew out of that. She’s always been brilliant and that has come to play through these later years. And I think I may have mentioned to you she just defended her dissertation at Harvard and we’ll be going to the graduation in a few weeks.

Daryle Brown [00:04:43]:
So she turned out all right, even though that was a pretty scary moment. But you have those occasions when they will surprise you and not necessarily understand all the ramifications of decisions that they’re making. So my older daughter’s actually been married. She was married for five years and she’s been probably divorced for five years now, maybe longer. We had a interesting. I wouldn’t call it traumatic situation. Again, these things affect me more than they affect them sometimes. So when she was going through her divorce, she didn’t tell anybody? Well, she didn’t tell me there were people that knew her sister, knew my wife’s best friend, Cynthia, knew she had support in that portion of her life, and it just wasn’t me.

Daryle Brown [00:05:29]:
And I don’t think my wife either. And when she finally told us the dirty deed was done, paperwork was signed, it was, like, over. And I think part of it was that she thought that we might try to talk her out of it. And again, that’s my trying to understand why she didn’t tell us about what she was going through at the time. But at any rate, you know, it happened. There were no children involved, so it was pretty much a clean split. I was pretty sad because I liked him, but of course I liked him based on the relationship that he and I had. I wouldn’t have liked him if I had known the relationship that he and my daughter were having.

Daryle Brown [00:06:03]:
So that was. I don’t know if these were monumental or as you had described it earlier. Hopefully they kind of fit in the.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:10]:
Sure. And one of the things that I know, I mean, is that you’ve been busy in your career, and you’ve had lots of different things that you’ve done in your career. You’ve been a busy person, and there’s been lots of things that you’ve balanced as a professional, as a, you know, personally, in your own life, et cetera, and as a father, you have to balance. So talk to me about balance. And how did you balance not only what you were doing, but really how did you balance guiding your daughters while also giving them the independence to grow into the people that they became?

Daryle Brown [00:06:38]:
Well, Christopher, it starts with having a good partner. And even though my wife was a career person also, I think early in our marriage, she probably did a lot more with and for the kids than I did. I think I probably got better once we moved to Chicago. Part of the stress was a lot of travel. I did a lot of travel on my job, but we made it through. And I certainly tried to give my kids the attention that I could when we were together. When I was around, I may have been busy with work, but I wasn’t super busy with other stuff. So it was like, yeah, I was busy with work, but I was pretty family focused.

Daryle Brown [00:07:17]:
So, I mean, that helped, I think. I think church helped. The fact that we regularly attended church. As a family, our church happened to have a good child children’s church. So we had that going for us. It was a bit of a challenge moving to Chicago away from family, because, as I may have mentioned before, we moved to Chicago when my youngest daughter was like 2 and my older daughter was maybe 9. So that moving away from the whole support structure that we had in Detroit, lots of family, lots of friends, to a new city, that created a bit of stress, but it also, I think, created a bond. We were very, very lucky to have great neighbors, both on one side of us and behind us, with kids the same age as my younger daughter.

Daryle Brown [00:08:21]:
So that that helped very well. We discovered a wonderful Montessori school for my younger daughter that was a great contributor to kind of a steadiness in. In her life. So a lot of different pieces have to come together. And Christopher, I’ll tell you, the reality is we were very fortunate that we were financially pretty well off. Not rich, but, you know, pay a lot for the bricks in Oak park, so we could afford to live in Oak Park. They have very good schools there. They have an incredible.

Daryle Brown [00:08:56]:
I guess I’ll call it a recreation department for the township. We have two beautiful facilities with pools, and they’ve added things since. I’ve kind of aged out of that group. But, I mean, it was a great town to raise a family. So that’s another thing that went very well. Very fortunate. Between church and picking a good town to live in. Very fortunate.

Daryle Brown [00:09:14]:
I don’t take for granted the fact that we could afford to do it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:17]:
Every father has to really think about the things that they’re doing to be able to build those bonds. And this show’s all about creating those strong bonds. What are some intentional ways that you worked, either in the past or even currently, to strengthen your bond with your daughters, especially during those challenging times?

Daryle Brown [00:09:35]:
First of all, you got to be participatory. If the girls play soccer, you got to go to soccer games, you got to be there. You got to be yelling on the sideline. And more importantly, don’t get me in trouble on this. You have to be able to give them that additional coaching that the coach may not give them. So there was this one team, and this is a soccer league. They were just incredible. They had great players at every position.

Daryle Brown [00:09:59]:
They had speed, they had attitude. And the attitude was the part where I had to coach my daughter. Now, I don’t know if you’re familiar with the concept of playing the dozens. Have you ever heard about playing the dozens? That’s kind of an African American community thing. And it’s when you talk about people’s parents. So my daughter was complaining about how these girls are always talking about us, but I can’t hardly get my head wrapped around it. And I said, next time she does that, you just look her in the eye and say, your mama, and keep it moving. So, you know, sometimes your teachings are a little unorthodox.

Daryle Brown [00:10:32]:
And mom was not happy. Mom was not happy about it. But the reality is, it’s something that me and. Me and Kamara still laugh about today because it worked. You know, it’s just kind of shocking. Just like, what did she just say? So, yeah, I taught my daughter how to play the dozens. I’m not proud, but it happened. So just to say, though, the point of it is, you got to be engaged to the point where, you know, they tell you what’s going on, they tell you their ups and their downs, and they seek your counsel.

Daryle Brown [00:11:01]:
And sometimes the coaches can get them through it, but sometimes the parents have to kind of boost them. Now, I. I will say one of my disappointments was when Kamara was about to move from green belt to brown belt in karate and instead said, dad, I’m done with karate. And that was it. She never went back to another class. And I. I had lots of conversation about it, and nope, didn’t work a comparable thing for my older daughter, Nia. So I don’t know if this is great communications, but when she was going to college, decisions.

Daryle Brown [00:11:37]:
So she had decided that she wanted to go to Boston College. And the reason why was that Boston College, as it had a great international relations program, and she was talking about international relations, they had lots of opportunities to travel abroad, and my wife and I relented, and it was outside of our range, but we said, okay, this is going to be great for you. This is what you want to do. And so she’s up there at orientation, and she’s calling home, just kind of check in, blah, blah, blah. And she says, oh, and I changed my major to psychology. And I’m like, psychology, psychology. Every school in the country has a psychology program. So she ended the conversation with, dad, you ruining my best day ever.

Daryle Brown [00:12:20]:
So I like to tell you I work my way out of that, but I didn’t. She was mad at me for some time, but. So all the communications we do are not necessarily going to bear fruit.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:32]:
No, they’re not. They’re not. They’re definitely not all going to bear fruit, as you mentioned. And none of us are infallible. We are human. And we make mistakes. I guess, as you think about fatherhood for yourself and raising your daughters and even, or even today with adult daughters, what’s a mistake that you’ve made as a father? And what did you learn about it from. No.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:55]:
And what did you learn from it about fostering a positive connection with your daughters?

Daryle Brown [00:13:02]:
I don’t know if I list this as a mistake, but this past Christmas, we vacationed in Jamaica with my older daughter’s partner and his family, and things were going great. We had a great time. But the roads on this particular island were loaded with potholes. And so we’re driving. I don’t know, we may have been driving to the airport with the rental car, and my daughter was in the front seat, my Navigator, but she kept trying to tell me where to drive on the road. You’re too close to the center. You’re too close to the edge. You’re too close to this.

Daryle Brown [00:13:32]:
And we got into basically a screaming match to the point where when we finally got to the airport, I was like, just get out. And we ended up as. I don’t know what exactly went wrong, but we ended up missing our flight and having to reschedule. And as far as I was concerned, it was her fault. And I was like, don’t, don’t. I won’t talk to you. And I would say that the lesson learned is give it time. Because we were a heated argument, we’re fussing at each other.

Daryle Brown [00:13:59]:
We don’t want to speak to each other anymore, and we didn’t for, I don’t know, two, three weeks maybe. Eventually, we talked again. We didn’t go back into this conversation, however. We just picked it back up, you know, So I don’t know how great that advice is. It would just be, hey, sometimes you just got to let it go. There’s not going to be a person that’s right or a person that’s wrong, and you just have to, you know, just have to move on. And that’s okay, too. It’s okay not to define who was

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:24]:
right as you think about your daughters, too. Every one of us, as fathers, have to find ways to be able to show our daughters that they are valued and heard. What did you do intentionally to help your daughters to feel that they truly were valued and heard?

Daryle Brown [00:14:41]:
Well, I have a background in restorative justice practices, but that came later. I think I’ve just been fortunate to have been in situations and places where listening was important. In rj, certainly listening is important. My wife and I participated in a Program, I don’t know, 40 years ago, maybe 35 years ago, where we went into schools and we taught. I say taught, but it was kind of an enrichment type program in struggling schools. And as part of that, one of the important components was learning to listen and hearing people. And there are lots of other things to it, and a lot of those we implemented in how we raised our own children. But I think the important thing is being able to hear them out.

Daryle Brown [00:15:26]:
Before you offer up your life wisdom, you’ll be surprised at what you’ll learn. I think being available to listen. I think my daughters have always felt like they could talk to dad, that there was no subject that they couldn’t broach with me. I mean, I. I’ve been in lots of conversations about boyfriends. I certainly would tell them if a boyfriend rubbed me the wrong way, but for the most part, I let them have their own age appropriate experiences, I would say. And I think that’s worked pretty well. They’re going to make their mistakes with their relationships.

Daryle Brown [00:15:57]:
I made a few myself. So I think I lucked out and found a good gal. And we celebrated 40 years of marriage last year. So as she reminded me recently, when I came down here, before we were married, we came down to the farm, this is the farm that we’re living at now, to meet Uncle Fred and Ahmaud and help them celebrate their 75th wedding anniversary. And my wife was like, this is how we do it in my family. So that’s been a mantra of ours that we’re shooting for 75 years.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:26]:
That would be an amazing milestone for you.

Daryle Brown [00:16:30]:
40 is good for me too. Now it’s a matter of living right, eating right. Let me tell you, this farm life, I’ve only been doing it for maybe four weeks, really being here all the time. And it’s a great exercise program.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:45]:
I can only imagine. Now, I know both of your daughters are very different people. They went off and are doing very unique things, different than each other, and had different dreams, passions. Talk to me about how you supported your daughters in pursuing those dreams and passions.

Daryle Brown [00:17:05]:
I think you just have to be there on the. During the down times, when things are going great for them, all you have to do is ride along. But when things aren’t going great, when they’re stressing out about tests or milestones and things that need to come up, being able to talk them back from the edge with confidence, understanding that no matter what happens, it’s not the end of the world. But at the end of the day, you got this. You’ve got a whole history of success behind you. There’s no reason in the world that you should be stressing yourself out about whatever comes next. I mean, it’s just another step. I’ve had those phone calls when they were both of them on their own paths where they were just not feeling it.

Daryle Brown [00:17:47]:
I think that Camara, when she was working her way through her PhD, she took a year off. And some of my friends that had been through programs like that said that sometimes that’s good. Of course, as a parent, your concern is that they’re never going back. This is the end of the road. Not the kind of stuff I would ever share with her. I may have negative thoughts creeping in my head, but I would not share that. My conversations with her were always supportive and uplifting. And you can do this and just stick to it, take some time off, get your head together and then get back to it and you’ll be fine.

Daryle Brown [00:18:18]:
Similarly, Nia had her struggles when she was in law school. Law school is a burden. And a lot of it they do on purpose. You know, it’s a weeding out process and we managed our way through it. But I think for us parents, we need to be able to bear some of that internally and not necessarily be in that same rhythm. When they’re down. We can’t be down with them. We have to be that positive, that positive notion that kind of brings them up a little.

Daryle Brown [00:18:45]:
You’re not going to necessarily bring them from a depression of getting a C minus on one of your law school papers. You’re not gonna bring them up immediately, but you need to stay positive. I think that’s the moral of the story. As parents, we need to stay positive. They don’t need the pressure of us leaning too hard on them. We need to be able to help them get back on an even keel and not be down there waddling in the mud with them.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:09]:
One of the other questions that I wanted to ask goes down to, and this could be from the past or currently, is what’s one way that you show your daughters that they can always count on you?

Daryle Brown [00:19:20]:
I think that unfort I’m not as good at this with my wife as I am with my daughters, is not overreacting, not getting out of phase, not getting angry, not showing anger, being able to maintain that equanimity. I think that’s important. They have to be able to know when they come to you with something that they know is going to piss you off, that you’re not going to go over the edge about it and that you’re going to be able to deal with them and deal with the conversation or whatever the struggle or helping them with a solution that you’re going to be able to do that without overreacting. I think that’s a very important thing and not easy, not easy to always master. And as I said, you know, it’s okay to walk away sometimes if you feel yourself going over the edge, because I don’t know how many chances a child gives you if you continually go over the edge, yelling, screaming, cussing, fussing, whatever. I don’t know how many chances you get if that’s going to be your reaction, because pretty soon they’re going to seek other people to. To get that kind of counsel. So that would be a caution for parents, especially young parents.

Daryle Brown [00:20:23]:
You can’t be jumping edge every time they do something that makes you mad. They’re kids now.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:27]:
We always finish our interviews with what I like to call our dad connection. 66 more questions to delve a little bit further into you as a dad. Are you ready?

Daryle Brown [00:20:35]:
I’m ready.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:35]:
What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughters?

Daryle Brown [00:20:39]:
I’m struggling between warm and humorous.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:41]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice that you ever received?

Daryle Brown [00:20:46]:
You know, I think that for me, I grew up in a relatively complicated dad orientation. I had a genetic father, I had an adopted father, and then I had a stepfather. So I had three men that could be framed as dads. And I would say that the lessons, the lessons I learned from my stepfather and the kindness that he displayed to my mother and me, his own children, to some degree, that is a model that I’ve used. So I don’t know how that fits your question, but I have more of a model that guides me than anything else. Else.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:23]:
What’s one activity that you and your daughters love to do together? And it could be different for each daughter.

Daryle Brown [00:21:30]:
Cook.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:31]:
If you could give your daughters one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Daryle Brown [00:21:35]:
Take time to have fun. And we do.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:38]:
What’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Daryle Brown [00:21:42]:
I think I’ve learned how to be patient. I’ve learned how things don’t happen right away. And by the way, daughters helped me learn that. Gardening helped me learn that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:51]:
And finally, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Daryle Brown [00:21:59]:
First of all, be patient with them. Listen, have fun. Laugh. Oh, my God. Laugh. That’s. That’s critical. My daughters and I, we laugh.

Daryle Brown [00:22:08]:
We have fun together and we laugh a lot. Everybody can’t be a comedian and my wife will tell you that I crack myself up. But definitely humor is so critical in any relationship. It just melts the challenges and the difficulties and the differences. So have fun with each other.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:24]:
Well, Daryl, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for being here today. Thank you for sharing all that you have shared. If people want to find out more about you, where should they go?

Daryle Brown [00:22:32]:
Oh boy. You know, I’m. I’m retired and I’m just kind of building my socials in a new direction. So I would say just send me an email for now. Darrell D A R Y L e q@gmail.com my link tree is justice work.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:49]:
Well, I truly appreciate you sharing that. We’ll make sure to put links in the notes today. And as I mention mentioned, I really appreciate your time. I wish you the best in your farming journey and I look forward to hearing more about what this journey brings.

Daryle Brown [00:23:04]:
I’ll be tapping into you when I get some stuff going. I got a few things. I got eight trees planted. By the way, it’s a hell of a lot harder to plant a tree than you think. I got some big pots, I got some wildflowers, little things because I got whole fields I got to worry about. But we’ll get to that. Next Thursday we’re going to start the cultivating and the tilling and. And it’s a farmer’s life for me.

Daryle Brown [00:23:23]:
Oh, that’s a pirate’s life. Oh, I missed it. Wrong one. Christopher, wonderful. Thank you so much for inviting me on. It’s been a pleasure.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:33]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect. It’s about being, being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes@dadanddaughterconnection.com until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:24:03]:
We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, we give the lessons, we make the meals, we buy them presents and bring your A game. Cause those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast Calling astronauts and firemen carpenters and muscle men get out and be the world you down Be the best dad you can be Be the best dad you can.

The Power of Presence: Building Strong Bonds Between Dads and Daughters

June 22, 2026 by dadofdivas

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

What does it mean to truly connect with your daughter? That’s the central question explored in the latest episode of the “Dad and Daughter Connection” podcast, where Dr. Christopher Lewis welcomes guest Brandon Smith for an honest, insightful and at times emotional conversation about fatherhood, mistakes, and building resilient, confident daughters.

From the start, Brandon Smith distinguishes between “intended” and “unintended” moments in parenting, emphasizing that the unscripted, everyday experiences often make the deepest impact. Whether it’s a trip for just the two of them or sitting quietly in support during a crisis, simply showing up consistently is the anchor of a strong bond. As Brandon Smith shares, “the small moments mattered the most” — a lesson he learned not only in his journey as a dad but also through the advice of other fathers.

The episode dives deep into the challenges dads face: resisting the urge to “fix” everything, sitting with difficult emotions, and learning to ask open-ended questions that give daughters the space to vent, reflect, and find their own solutions. Dr. Christopher Lewis and Brandon Smith steer the conversation toward agency, urging fathers to build their daughters’ confidence and resilience by empowering them to make decisions — even allowing for failure as an important part of growth.

It’s not about being perfect. It’s about being truly present — listening, apologizing when you get it wrong, and making your child a priority. Brandon Smith reminds listeners that kids are far more forgiving than we think, as long as we’re willing to acknowledge our mistakes and keep trying. Traditions, whether as simple as a regular dinner or a unique holiday ritual, also play a role in creating a safe foundation daughters can count on, even as they gain independence.

Fathers of daughters — whether your relationship is close or still growing, this episode of “Dad and Daughter Connection” is packed with real advice, vulnerable stories, and practical tips to help you show up as the dad your daughter needs.

Ready to deepen your connection? Tune in to the full episode and join Dr. Christopher Lewis and Brandon Smith on the journey to raising strong, independent women.

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week I love that you come back. You come back to learn, to grow and to find new ways to be able to build those intentional connections with your daughter.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:06]:
And it’s so important because we have to show up. We’ve got to show up every day. We’ve got to learn from the things we do well. We got to learn from the things that we mess up on as well, because there’s going to be times that are going to go perfectly and then other times where we’ll. They may be an epic fail. And that’s okay. That the fact that you do show up, the fact that you do come back and you’re willing to, to learn and to hear others stories about their journeys says a lot about you and it says a lot about where you want to be as a father. This podcast is here to give you some help, some perspective, some thoughts on fatherhood.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:42]:
Every week I love being able to bring you different people with different experiences that have gone through their own fatherhood journey and they’re still going through their fatherhood journey. And today we got another great guest. Brandon Smith is with us today and Brandon is a return guest, I’m going to say, in some aspects, not he wasn’t a return guest from this podcast, but for those of you that have been listening to me for a while, you know that I had another podcast called Dads with Daughters, and Brandon’s a past guest from that show. So if you want to find that episode, go over to fathering together, you can check that out. It’s still out there. And he’ll add some hot sauce to your fatherhood as well. And I’ll leave it at that because and tease that out. But I’m really excited to be able to have Brandon on.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:26]:
We’re going to be talking about his own journey with his daughter. And I look forward for you to get to know him as well. Brandon, thanks so much for being here today.

Brandon Smith [00:02:33]:
Chris. I’m thrilled to be on and I love, I love what we’re going to be talking about here today. I’m very, very passionate about it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:38]:
You know, one of the things that I love starting off with when I think about fatherhood is all of us as dads want to create those meaningful moments where we, we truly are able to, to connect with our daughters. What’s one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share with your daughter thus far and what made it so special?

Brandon Smith [00:02:58]:
So I’m going to answer that in two ways. So there was the intended moments where you get to plan them, but then there’s the unintended moments that you, that you don’t get to plan them. I would argue the unintended moments are probably more impactful. But let’s talk about the intended moments. So I’ve got three kids. My daughter Abby is my oldest. She’s 24. She’s graduated, working a full time job.

Brandon Smith [00:03:18]:
She’s doing great. We’ll talk more about that then. I have a son who’s Noah, who’s 21, and then a son Aaron, who’s 18. Well, whenever my kids were 12, I would always take them, just me and that kiddo, to Disney World, just me and that one kid. So we could just do whatever they want to do. They didn’t have to negotiate rides and restaurants with their siblings. And we just get that time together. And I kind of kept that tradition going with Abby.

Brandon Smith [00:03:38]:
So when she went off to University of Georgia, she was in a sorority. The nice thing about sororities is they have a lot of planned events. So they’ve got like parent weekends, but then they have mommy daughter weekend and then they have a daddy daughter weekend. So I did that with her every year. So there was always times I was going there, just me and her for weekends and time together. And then even during her summers when she was doing internships and things, you know, she would, we would find time for just she and I to meet up in the city some where and just kind of explore together. So there was those schedule times which I think were really, really important. I would argue that the most important times were the times when she was in crisis.

Brandon Smith [00:04:11]:
And I just sat with her. I was just with her, just being present, not trying to solve it, not trying to offer advice, just sit and listen. And that’s really hard now to be fair. We haven’t Talked much about my background. I have a slightly unfair advantage. I was trained as a clinical therapist, so I do bring that to bear. So I know how to ask questions and listen and do kind of reflective, which does help. But I think those moments were probably the most important, and there were several.

Brandon Smith [00:04:38]:
There was one where when she was graduating from college and there had been a death in her sorority, it really rattled my daughter. And on top of that, she had broken her leg, and she was a big runner, so she couldn’t run. That was her stress relief. Let me tell you, Chris, I’m not sure if I’d want to go relive that weekend with her, but it was an impactful one because I just got to sit there with her while she just kind of raged and vented and just had all those emotions just kind of flood. I once heard somewhere that part of the role of the difference between kind of dads and daughters, or men and women, husbands and wives, and in those dynamics, women are often like the waves of the ocean. They kind of come and go. And sometimes when two. When a wife and a daughter kind of come together, sometimes those waves can create some storms.

Brandon Smith [00:05:18]:
Men are kind of like the rock wall on the side of the coast, and the water’s supposed to kind of hit it, but not move it. So we’re kind of almost supposed to be there kind of that steady, steady, consistent force. I don’t know why that image has always stood out for me, but I know that there’s been moments when I’ve been that kind of that. That rock wall and just allowed her to just kind of vent and rage and not be overwhelmed by that. The most impactful. So a long answer to your question, my friend.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:41]:
Not a problem at all. You know, I have heard what you said earlier about being willing to just sit and listen from many people and not to solve. And that’s not an easy thing for dads to always do. It tends to take a little bit of reprogramming in our brains to be able to get to that point. Talk to me about that for yourself. And I know you said you have a unfair advantage, so maybe you can give some advice for dads that are struggling with that in regards to what either you had to do or what you might recommend that dads do, to be able to reprogram their brains, to be able to be more of those quiet listeners versus the solvers.

Brandon Smith [00:06:20]:
I think the first thing is to recognize that those emotions don’t mean that something’s broken or something’s wrong. So the Things that we want to not do is either jump in and say, no, you must not feel this way. You must feel this way. Trying to change what they’re feeling. Not a good idea. That’s really bad. Dads and daughters, moms and daughters, not good. You don’t want to do that.

Brandon Smith [00:06:38]:
Second, it’s okay to sit in that discomfort. I know it was my own case of. With my father, he was very different. He could not handle any kind of uncomfortable emotion at all. There was if I. If you just got excited and passionate about a topic at dinner, he’d get up and leave the dinner table. He’s gonna handle it. And my entire life, if I talked to my dad, he’d stick his hand out in my face, wave it back and forth, and he’d say, stop talking.

Brandon Smith [00:06:57]:
None of my business. He really just couldn’t handle that. So I would encourage dads first to just be okay with sitting there. You don’t have to fix it. And. And that negative energy isn’t going to hurt you or hurt them. We need to give them a safe space to let it out. So that’s first.

Brandon Smith [00:07:14]:
Second step. How do you help them let it out? It’s by asking a lot of questions and just reflecting back. Just. Just by saying things like that sounds really hard. How are you doing with that? And just letting them go or say, wow, that is just. That’s a lot. Or one of the great therapist lines, which you can always use in your playbook, works really well in life. Say more about that.

Brandon Smith [00:07:32]:
You can never go wrong with. Just say more about that. And you can start off by saying that. That guys, that sounds really hard. Say more about that. What’s the hardest part? So really sit in it now. Where dads are going to go wrong. Another part where they’re going to go wrong is they’re going to go, so how do you think we need to fix it? You don’t need to do that.

Brandon Smith [00:07:46]:
You don’t need to jump to fixing it. Just let them go. Let them go until that energy really starts to wane. Now, to be fair, my daughter’s grown up with me, and she has very good skills like this. So there’s times I was doing that with her on that moment, I told you, and she said to me, I know what you’re doing. Stop it. So I had to pivot. And one of the ways for my daughter that works really well is when I then get vulnerable, talk about something I’m struggling with in my life, or I get really kind of authentic.

Brandon Smith [00:08:12]:
She connects really well to that my daughter has never done, she came out this way. She’s never done well with people being not performative but, but, but not being real, not really saying what’s really going on. She cannot handle that. So she actually does really well with me just kind of being open and honest and just calling things the way they are. That actually settles her down. So just having some more of that honest dialog and just being present and not trying to change it. I think those are, those are the moments. And she’ll say today, she’ll say, you know, one of the things I’m most proud of, she’ll say if Brandon Smith me says he’s going to be there, he’s going to be there.

Brandon Smith [00:08:42]:
And as a dad that’s really meaningful. I’m feel myself even getting tearing up a little bit just saying that because what dad doesn’t want to hear their kiddo say that? So I would say those are probably two good tips. Just learning to be comfortable in that and then learning how to just ask questions to help it release. By helping it release, you’re fixing it. So I think that’s probably the last thing I’d say. For dads, you don’t have to have a plan of action with three steps or five steps or a phone call you’re going to make today. It doesn’t have to be that clear cut. Just by helping that emotion go, it’ll make a difference.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:08]:
As our daughters are born, for many years they, they rely so much on us and as they get old they become more and more independent. How did you balance guiding your daughter while also giving her the independence that she needed to be able to grow into the person that she has become?

Brandon Smith [00:09:28]:
It’s a really good question. And this is where we often. So in my professional world, I take a lot of my coaching background and my counseling background and bring it into the workplace and helping leaders get better and those sorts of things. Do a lot of executive coaching kind of work and, and what I think makes this so challenging, it’s kind of like leadership is an art and a science. Parenting is an art and a science. I mean every, every K is a little different. Every situation’s a little different. There’s no one size fits all.

Brandon Smith [00:09:51]:
Sometimes you got to pivot with your recipe. And so where it’s tricky is I’m always trying as a parent, I’m always trying to instill agency. It’s my favorite word. If you ask me, my favorite word on this planet is it’s agency. And for those of you that don’t kind of know the word agency. What we’re talking about when we’re talking about agency for a person, when you have a sense of agency, it’s almost like you tell yourself, I’m enough in the world. I’m not perfect. No one’s perfect.

Brandon Smith [00:10:13]:
But I’m enough. I can get through it. And we have high levels of agency. We have competence and confidence, and we have resilient, and we handle change well. Change doesn’t overwhelm us. What we don’t have when we have high levels of agency is heightened anxiety. Anxiety is the absence of agency. So if you got a really anxious kiddo, just really fearful, kind of struggling with dealing with life, agency is a great antidote.

Brandon Smith [00:10:35]:
I’m always trying to instill that. So the way you instill that is you ask a lot of questions. So, wow, that sounds really hard. Well, what do you think you can do about that? What do you. What do you think you need to do? How do you think you can solve that? How can I help you with that? But you’re. But you’re putting the answers, you’re putting the solutioning, you’re putting the authorship on that, kiddo. So book I published in 2022 is called the author versus editor dilemma. That’s a lot to do with workplaces and leadership and management.

Brandon Smith [00:10:57]:
But I always do a chapter in every one of my books on parenting, and there’s even a chapter in Author editor about that. Like, when should I sit in the author seat and tell them what to do? When should I sit in the editor seat and they tell me what they’re going to do and then I can respond to that. So you want them to have that agency, all solutions to problems. That sometimes means they’re going to fail, and that is okay. Where we need to kind of watch closely is we don’t want the failure to be catastrophic. Failures are good. That’s when you learn. We learn the most in times of failure.

Brandon Smith [00:11:22]:
My midd kiddo, he just went through the college internship process this year. It’s been really tough on college students and interns to find internships this year. It’s a tougher cycle. He had a couple lined up. He waited too long. The offers exploded on him and he had to scramble. And my wife and I were thinking how we could help him. Well, he ended up coming up with an internship on his own.

Brandon Smith [00:11:40]:
He found one, and he’s loving it. And I think the fact he recovered on his own, I mean, that’s really what you want. You Want that level of agency. So all that to say, you know, you’re trying to equip them to solve problems on their own. You’re going to support them. And even when my kids were little, they come home and say, oh, the teacher’s being me. The teacher’s bullying me. It triggers that inner parenting instinct.

Brandon Smith [00:11:58]:
You want to jump in and say, talk to that teacher. I always stopped myself and said, I’m not going to do that. And I would say, what conversation do you think you need to have? I know you can do it. I believe in you. And I said, I’ve got your back. I’ve got air cover for you. It doesn’t go well, you can call dad. Dad will jump in.

Brandon Smith [00:12:12]:
Dad will fix it, but why don’t you take the first crack? I did it with all my kids. I never had to have a conversation with the teacher. They would go back and they had it on their own because I was trying to again equip them to the agency. And also, those are great skills. You’re gonna have to have a conversation with your boss one day. Why don’t you learn that now? So then when you have to neg negotiate your salary or say you can’t work on the weekend, you learn how to do that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:30]:
Those are great examples. And I think, you know, I’ve. I feel like I’m going through a lot of those myself with my daughter that’s in college right now and figuring out, okay, where do I push, where do I pull, where do I just sit back? And that as you kind of talked about the author role or not. And so that’s always a challenge. And I think it always continues to be a challenge as you sit back and you’re like, I’ve been there. I’ve done that. You can learn from me, but you may need to make these mistakes yourself. And I get that too now, talking about intentional things and thinking in my head of what you just said.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:04]:
Some of the things that we do are very intentional. What are some intentional ways that you’ve worked throughout your daughter’s life to be able to strengthen that bond that you had with her, especially during those challenging times.

Brandon Smith [00:13:16]:
So my daughter’s a lot like a cat. You have to let her come to you. If you try and go to her too quickly, it’s not going to go very well. So being intentional, I think, is really important. I will say this. I think going back to the word agency, I often joke with my wife. My daughter kind of came out of the womb just frustrated because she didn’t have any agency because she’s 4 and she wants to do stuff. She’s 8 and she wants to do stuff.

Brandon Smith [00:13:36]:
She’s 12 and she wants to do stuff, and she can’t. And it got frustrated. Well, now she’s 24 and she works for a consulting firm, and she can do all the stuff. So I think that’s helped a lot. But I will say the hardest time for us was probably those high school years where it was the most pressure. And every year she went off to college, her feelings towards us improved, her connection towards us improved on her own, she made those things happen because I think she was just seeing her friends and some of their dynamics with their parents, and she realized we’re not so bad. And every time she called, we always made that time for her. So she calls my wife every day.

Brandon Smith [00:14:10]:
She talks to my wife every day. But she knows she can call me and I will drop whatever I’m doing if she calls me. So I think part of it is just being present with her, not being too pushy, but, you know, letting her come to me. The other thing was I always schedule time with her, and I always tell her, you are one of the most important people and most important relationships in my life. I really want to make sure we get to spend time together. And I find things that my kids like. My daughter likes to go to nice restaurants. She likes to try new food.

Brandon Smith [00:14:32]:
So we’ll go try the local Portuguese restaurant, or we’ll try the Persian restaurant or whatever happens to be. And so now that she’s on her own and she’s figuring out career stuff and life stuff, we try to do quarterly dinners. So we’ll do quarterly dinner. She’s still in Atlanta. I live in Atlanta. So we’ll meet up for dinner somewhere and just have a nice dinner and just talk about life, Talk about her career, her boyfriend, all the other things. I think it’s a little bit of both. It’s always kind of being there when they want to come to you.

Brandon Smith [00:14:57]:
That’s an intention and making them a priority. So that’s kind of more of a firefighter on call kind of intention. When the phone rings, I answer it. But there’s also keeping that connected. And I think when you plan something with someone, you’re signaling to them that they’re a priority. So when I tell my daughter, you mean a lot to me, and our relationship is very meaningful. I want to spend time with you. I’d love to take you out to dinner.

Brandon Smith [00:15:15]:
She never turns me down. So those are Some examples.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:18]:
I love those examples. And I try to have similar things with my own daughters. And I know that it makes a difference. Sometimes they say it, sometimes they don’t. And you have to know that. That you just have to realize that even if they don’t say it, it still matters. Now, none of us are perfect. We all make m mistakes.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:37]:
What’s a mistake that you’ve made as a father and what did you learn from it about fostering a positive connection with your daughter?

Brandon Smith [00:15:44]:
Oh, goodness. I’m going through my very large inventory of mistakes, Chris. So if I’m pausing, it’s because, wow, kind of a lot. Well, I would say I’ve done the opposite of a lot of things I’ve said. Like, I pushed on her too hard, pushed on solutions, pushed, pushed on answers, pushed for answers. That doesn’t go well with her. So that’s not good. But on the flip side, sometimes I don’t come to her when she’s upset.

Brandon Smith [00:16:06]:
That gets her really mad. So if she’s upset, upset, and she’s sending all the signals that she’s upset, and I’m not going to her saying, hey, you seem upset. And maybe I just don’t want to deal with it. I’m going to be honest. Maybe it’s just one of those times where I’m really tired. I don’t have much in the tank. Like, I can’t deal with her just, you know, her upsetness today, that makes her more angry because I’m not coming to her and acknowledging how she’s feeling. So I think there’s a lot around those things.

Brandon Smith [00:16:27]:
Yeah, it’s tricky. Parenting is such a startup experience. Fail fast or fail forward. You’re always trying to adjust. So, you know, I can tell you another great example, like when she was in high school and applying to colleges and she wasn’t getting the SAT score she wanted and she had one last shot, I mean, take the sat and like, I think it was October of your junior year last time. She could really take it and have it count. And she was procrastinating on studying for that, studying for that, studying for that. And whether this was good or bad to me, I’m not sure.

Brandon Smith [00:16:52]:
But I finally told her, I said, look, you don’t have to study for it. You can keep your same SAT scores, and then you’re going to go to this slate of colleges and they’re all perfectly fine. But if you want to go to this slate of colleges, you’re going to need to get that SAT score up. So you’re going to make a choice. And I said, if you want to go here, you’re going to have to do some studying, which means you can’t go off doing brunches on the weekend with your friends. You can’t do that. You got studying to do. You’re running out of time.

Brandon Smith [00:17:12]:
Time. Well, she went off. She said she wanted to do that. She wanted the other schools. She wanted a better score, but she kept doing the brunches. So finally, I had to go in one day and say, I’m sorry, Abby. I hate to do this. I’m your dad.

Brandon Smith [00:17:22]:
I want to honor your request of what you want. I’m grounding you for the next two weeks. You’re going nowhere. You can study. That’s what you can do. Now, I don’t know if that was the right decision or not. She did end up getting the score that she needed at the end of the day, so just barely by the skin of her teeth, but she got that score. But that was an example where I had to step in and ground her on something that she said she wanted, but she wasn’t living up to her own expectations of herself.

Brandon Smith [00:17:45]:
So. I don’t know. Plenty of times I’ve lost my temper with my kids. But I will say this. One of the big things I did learn in life is your kids really want to have a relationship with you. They are actually way more forgiving than we give them credit for. But they will not be forgiving if you don’t apologize. You have to be the first one to go say, I’m sorry.

Brandon Smith [00:18:02]:
Dad screwed up. I shouldn’t have handled it the way I did. I promise I’m not going to do that again going forward. And she. And she had a moment with me a few years ago. It was Christmas, and my wife and I were kind of in a little bit of a spat. And it was happening on Christmas Day, and my daughter was not happy about that. And so she came over to me and she pulled me aside, and she’s like, what’s going on? She was really upset, and I committed to her.

Brandon Smith [00:18:20]:
I said, I’m sorry. You’re right. This shouldn’t be happening on Christmas Day. I’m going to fix it. It’s not going to happen again. And that’s what I did. But you got to be willing to say you’re sorry, and you’re got to be willing to adjust. And if you do that, our kids aren’t expecting perfect from us.

Brandon Smith [00:18:31]:
They’re expecting, like, that effort that we’re trying so when you say you’re going to make a change, you make the change. But they don’t expect perfect.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:37]:
And what do you do intentionally to make your daughter feel valued and heard?

Brandon Smith [00:18:43]:
I saw an interview with Reese Wither Witherspoon at some point and she, she made a comment and dad, the words that a dad says to their daughter, it’s like permanent marker on their brain. And so I always want to feed her in that way. My daughter, you know, she doesn’t have a lot of money, but she likes to kind of get good fashion. So there’s like you could all these services, you rent clothes and she’ll run clothes, she’ll come downstairs and she’ll be wearing a new dress. And I’ll say, oh Abby, that dress is beautiful on you. You look absolutely just beautiful. And she’s like, oh, thanks dad. But I know that’s, I know that’s feeding into her self conscious and her level of confidence about herself or self talk.

Brandon Smith [00:19:15]:
I always tell her, you’ve got great skills, you’ve got great intuition on people. So I really look, lift up and reinforce her strengths. So not only does she feel kind of seen, but I’m also trying to tell her, you’ve got some great things, don’t lose those. So those are things I really try to be intentional about in my talk with her and also trying to give her support and guidance. Now sometimes it also means not answering her questions. So the recent one she was doing was she’s got a boyfriend who she really likes and we really like. And she’s asking me, she’s saying, dad, I mean, what do you think? I mean really, what do you think? I mean, do you think he’s a good fit for me? I mean, and we like him. And she had a particular thing she was asking about.

Brandon Smith [00:19:49]:
I said, you know, Abby, that’s not my answer. That’s not for me to answer. It’s a question for you to answer. And I laid out some scenarios and things for her. I said, but it’s not for me. She kept pushing on me, pushing on, trying to get me. I wouldn’t answer. I wouldn’t, wouldn’t answer.

Brandon Smith [00:20:00]:
A few days later she came to my wife and she said, tell dad I’m sorry for pushing him so hard. I was having a, it’s one of the phrases that you probably heard your daughter say recently. She’s like, I was having a crash out and I was pushing dad a little too hard and I, I shouldn’t have been telling actually everything’s okay. I’m fine with my boyfriend. So I think knowing sometimes when not to insert your opinions is also important.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:21]:
You don’t want to have those insert foot in mouth moments as you’re talking to your daughters and, or having to backpedal. So sometimes being silent or as you said, kind of pushing back and allowing for them to work it through probably makes a lot of sense.

Brandon Smith [00:20:36]:
It reminds me there was a Seinfeld episode where, you know, I think, I can’t remember, maybe Kramer had a girlfriend that no one liked. And so they all told him he broke up and we’re like, oh, we don’t like your girlfriend. And then they got back together. Then now it was awkward because they told Kramer we don’t like your girlfriend. But now he’s back with her girlfriend. So I think there’s times when you just have to some things or for them to figure out. And frankly, if she’s happy, that’s, I mean, that’s one of the things we’re going for.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:00]:
And how did you support your daughter in pursuing her passion and dreams?

Brandon Smith [00:21:04]:
It’s a challenging one. So in high school, she would come at my wife and me and she’d say, you guys put high expectations on me. You hold me an unfair standard. And it’s funny, Chris, we never did. We never did. We never did. My wife and I are little, a little Gen X in how we raise our kids. We’re a little, wouldn’t say feral, but a little more.

Brandon Smith [00:21:23]:
More like that in this way. We Never had life, 360 on any of our kids. We didn’t track them where they go. We never, once they got into high school, we never looked at the report cards again. Now I’ve never seen a report card for my kids in high school or college because what I told them was I said, your grades are your grades. And my expectation is you work hard and own and be proud of whatever grade you get. If you got a C and you didn’t work hard, then decide to make an adjustment. But if you got a C and you gave it everything you got, that’s great.

Brandon Smith [00:21:47]:
So I think part of it is setting that, pushing kind of that ownership and agency properly on them. It’s your life. Your grades are the beginning of that, but it’s just going to evolve into more decisions that are yours. I think the second thing is I’m always trying to remind her and reinforce to her what her natural gifts are, what her natural gifts and talents. I think so hard she’s trying to fit herself into a box. Like when she was in high school, she took a lot of computer science classes because she thought, oh, I’m a girl, I should take computer science classes because it’ll round me out. It was not her love language. It’s not her love language and she would tell you that.

Brandon Smith [00:22:17]:
But she has a lot of great love languages that she’s really passionate about. And I’m always trying to remind her of that because she’s in this early part of her career where she’s trying to figure out what does she want her career to look like. And so I’m trying to encourage her to pursue those areas where she says more natural strengths and passions because it will. It’ll play out in a much, much more fulfilling way for her. So I think it’s just lifting those things up. That doesn’t always mean that she hears it in the moment. I think that’s another important thing too. Like, if dads are looking for kind of, I do this and I get an immediate kind of response.

Brandon Smith [00:22:47]:
It’s not, it’s not like that. I often, I’ll chat in my author editor book and you want to talk to my clients when they’re like, doing too much for their teams. I’ll say to them, are you trying to win an mvp? Are you trying to win a world championship? Because are two very different muscles. And I think sometimes as dads, we’re trying to win MVPs, like, we want the immediate hug and the gratification in the moment, like we just scored a touchdown. And really we should probably be thinking about more like winning a world championship because, like, those are lag indicators. You don’t really know how well you’re doing until you start to get further into the season. Then you got to get in the playoffs. So touchdowns don’t.

Brandon Smith [00:23:18]:
The touchdown itself doesn’t really matter. So I’m getting more of the payoff way after the fact from her. Not in the moment. And sometimes she’ll dismiss my comments in the moment. But I know I’m planting seeds.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:27]:
What’s one way you show your daughter that she can always count on you?

Brandon Smith [00:23:31]:
I would say the simple answer is if she knows. And she’s very respectful of this. She knows if she calls me during the day, I’m going to answer as quickly as I can. If I have to call her back, I will. And I will then clear my calendar to whenever she wants to talk. I will cancel other business calls that I have to make that time for her. Now she does, she does not abuse that. She’s very, very respectful of that and sometimes I’ll tell her I’m tied up, I can’t have a public, let’s talk tonight.

Brandon Smith [00:23:55]:
But I always try and make her a priority when she needs to talk. And so I think that’s the number one way.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:00]:
And when you think back to relationship with your daughter in the past now, what’s a tradition or routine that you’ve created together that really strengthens your bond?

Brandon Smith [00:24:12]:
I think there’s a couple, one for sure is are just going out to dinner together. We love to do that and traveling together. When my daughter and I did our 12 year old trip to Disney, we stayed at a different kind of Disney hotel. And we just walked around all the hotels one night and she picked out what she’s like, oh, I love this one. We should stay here from now on as a family. And sure enough, that’s what we started doing. So I think finding things that your daughter likes that you can share with her is really good. And that can be a variety of things.

Brandon Smith [00:24:36]:
My daughter, she likes sporting events because she likes to sit with people that she cares about and have conversations, but she doesn’t actually care about the event itself. But she’ll go because she likes to have that time together. I think finding those things that we can do, I think are definitely one. And then we have other traditions that we’ve always done as a family, which she actually appreciates. We always try to have dinner together as a family as much as we could. We thought this was normal. Apparently it’s weird. We live in Atlanta, so we live in the Southeast, but every Christmas Eve after church we go to Waffle House.

Brandon Smith [00:25:02]:
Waffle Houses are Christmas Eve tradition. And just things like that that she really likes, I think it provides a lot of that stability. I’ll also say, like as I mentioned to you before, my daughter was never very touchy feely. Like she was never like daddy’s little girl in the sense that she just worshiped me and always wanted to spend time with me. But that has gotten more and more as she’s gotten older. Last time she was over to her house, she gave me probably three hugs before she left the house. And so I do think that, you know, it’s definitely a marathon and a long race, more like trying to win a world championship than it is winning an mvp.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:31]:
Now we always finish our interview with what I like to call our dad connection. Six, six more questions that delve into you as a dad. Are you ready? What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughter?

Brandon Smith [00:25:42]:
And this isn’t Meant to be creepy, but I really like this word. It’s intimate. We cover the can. I’m open and honest and things I’m kind of working through. She’s open and honest with things she’s working through. So there’s just a commitment, openness with sharing. Kind of our. We’re very authentic.

Brandon Smith [00:25:54]:
We’re vulnerable. We share needs and wants. We just, we’re just have a very open relationship. So I would say that what’s the

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:59]:
best piece of dad advice that you’ve ever received?

Brandon Smith [00:26:04]:
I would say the best piece of d. Bad advice I ever received actually came from a client of mine. And it was because he had worked a very long career with a big company. It’s a privately held company. He wasn’t going to get the CEO job. He was right below it. So he decided to retire and he traveled all the time. And one day his kids told him and he made it a point.

Brandon Smith [00:26:22]:
He was like, I was always going to be there for the big events. I’m always going to be there for the soccer matches and the award ceremonies. And he would fly back in town, he’d go to those events and he thought like, ah, being a great dad. And then his son one day said to him, he said, dad, you were always there for the big moments, but you were never there for the small ones. And the small ones mattered the most. O so I do think the soccer matches really don’t matter. They really don’t. The dining room table, that matters more.

Brandon Smith [00:26:45]:
The being able to like go in your kids room when they’re sad and crying and just sit with them. That matters way more than seeing their baseball tournament or their dance recital. I’m not saying those things are bad. I’m not saying you should dismiss them. But it’s not the same thing because frankly we over index on that stuff. We’re like, ah, I was with them. Dance recital. You were sitting in an Auditorium.

Brandon Smith [00:27:03]:
Auditorium 20ft away from your kid. You weren’t talking to them, they weren’t talking to you. They were doing something and you were watching. It’s not much different than watching your kid play video games. It’s really not any different. It’s not connected. But we tend to think it’s some kind of connection. So I think those small moments are the key.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:17]:
What’s one activity that you and your daughter love doing together?

Brandon Smith [00:27:21]:
Definitely restaurants. That’s an easy one to plug in. Travel. She’s always game for travel. So if I said let’s go to a city and then I’ll and I let her plan it, and we go around and do things. Things, that’s great. So I think those are things that she loves to do that I like to do, too. So those are the two big ones.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:34]:
If you could give your daughter one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Brandon Smith [00:27:39]:
Be true to yourself. It’s probably cliche, but what that really means is understand how you’re hardwired and find a swim lane that honors that. Life’s much easier and more fulfilling. If you go in the direction of the current, you’re already wired to go down. If you try and force it and fake it and go down another path, you’re not going to be happy. If you try and chase other things, you’re also not going to be happy. So I think just finding, really get a good understanding of who you are, figure out, plug that into the world, you’re going to feel a lot, a lot better. And I think that’s hard for daughters today because there’s a lot of pressure.

Brandon Smith [00:28:06]:
You should be a career woman, and you should put off having kids. And that is a choice for some women. They can do that. But some women might decide, I want to have a family. And there’s not as, maybe as much discussion and balanced conversation on different options for women. So I think today, ironically, it’s kind of like almost gone the other way. It’s like, you got to have a career, you got to make as much money as possible. And I know she’s felt pressured to do that, and she’s adjusting what she wants, so being able to help in that process.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:30]:
And what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Brandon Smith [00:28:38]:
Two quick ones. So first I would say tell them that. Tell them that I want to build a relationship with you. You are one of the most important people in my life. I would love to explore what that might look like or how we could do that. So I think that’s one second that I mentioned earlier. The secret sauce to all this is being able to apologize. That’s the equivalent of fail fast in the entrepreneurial world or fail forward.

Brandon Smith [00:28:56]:
Apologize dies quickly. When you make a mistake, go in quickly and be like, I screwed up. Dad screwed up. I’m sorry. Here’s why it happened. But it’s not going to happen again. They will quickly forgive you. But if you don’t do that, that emotion will see them fester.

Brandon Smith [00:29:08]:
And then that’s when you get World War iii. And daughters are good at waging World War iii. If necessary so you can avoid that with a quick apology.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:16]:
Now, if people want to find out more about you, where should they go?

Brandon Smith [00:29:20]:
Yeah, the simplest place is just Google the workplace therapist. That’s my handle. So you can Google the workplace therapist. I’m the only one. Well, there’s one other person in Australia now, but I’m the only other one. So you’ll look for the guy not in Australia and you’ll find me.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:34]:
Well, Brandon, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for being here and thank you for sharing this journey that you’ve been on with your daughter. I know it’s not over, it’s definitely going to just continue. But I truly want to say thank you for sharing this and I wish you all the best.

Brandon Smith [00:29:49]:
Thank you. Thank you for all the great work you do for dads out there trying to be better. So thank you for having me. That’s a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:06]:
It’s about being present.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:09]:
If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes@dadanddaughterconnection.com until next time. Keep showing up, keep connecting and and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Performer

We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers? We spend the time, we give the lessons, we make the meals, we buy them presents? Bring your A game? Cause those kids are growing fast? The time goes by just like a dynamite blast? Calling astronauts and firemen Carpenters and muscle men? Get out and be the world to them Be the best, best dad you can be? Be the best dad you can be.

Building Lasting Bonds: Intentional Fatherhood with Adam Angel

June 15, 2026 by dadofdivas

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

In this powerful episode of the “Dad and Daughter Connection” podcast, host Dr. Christopher Lewis welcomes Adam Angel, father, therapist, and founder of the Dads with Wisdom community. Together, they explore what it really means to show up for your daughter—not just as a parent but as a vulnerable, intentional human being.

A recurring theme in their conversation is intentionality. Adam Angel shares touching stories about helping his daughter face challenges, like her anxiety before a swim test and building confidence in new activities like basketball and jiu jitsu. Instead of forcing outcomes, he strives to give her the safety and encouragement to try, fail, and choose for herself. As Adam Angel reveals, “I want you to see what it could look like…I’ll show you, and you can tell me if you want to do it after you try.”

The episode delves deeply into supporting your child through difficult moments, embracing open conversations about emotions, and being honest with your kids about your own struggles. Adam Angel reflects on the need for dads to be “open-hearted and willing to not just be wrong, but to be able to learn from her, and also grieve or struggle through something with her.” These moments of honesty, he suggests, build trust and teach kids about resilience and empathy.

Another core lesson: connection isn’t always about grand gestures; it’s often found in the consistent, day-to-day presence—whether it’s attending basketball games, settling in for bedtime, or making one-on-one smoothie dates. Adam Angel emphasizes that just “showing up and being there” in both small and big ways tells your daughter she can count on you.

This episode doesn’t shy away from tough realities, either—like how admitting mistakes and apologizing as a parent strengthens bonds, or the challenges of allowing your child independence in a world that sometimes feels unsafe.

Lastly, the conversation highlights the importance of community and vulnerability for dads. Through his Dads with Wisdom groups, Adam Angel sees firsthand the transformative impact of men supporting each other, breaking cycles of isolation, and learning together.

If you’re a dad—or anyone invested in raising confident, emotionally healthy daughters—this episode offers a wealth of practical wisdom and heartfelt encouragement. Listen now and be inspired to connect more deeply, both with your child and yourself.

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have an opportunity to be able to work on those relationships that we want to have with our daughters one day at a time.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:03]:
I love being able to have you here every week because it is an opportunity. It’s an opportunity for you and I to be able to learn and grow together. You know, I’ve got two daughters, you have daughters, and you’re here. And I applaud you for that. Because by showing up, that’s saying something. Because that means that you do want to create a stronger, more lasting relationship with your daughter. And that’s why this podcast is here. This podcast is here to help you, to give you some tips, some tricks, some tools for your toolbox to help you to be that dad that you want to be.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:37]:
I love being able to introduce you to different people, different people with different experiences that can give you some help along the way, give you some perspective about things that might have worked, maybe they didn’t work, but it will help you to be able to frame how do you want to show up for your daughter. So I am really excited because we are having a brand new guest here today. Adam angel is with us. And Adam is a father of two. He’s got a. He’s got a son and a daughter, and we’re going to be talking about his daughter, of course, but we’re also going to be talking about a community that he has been building over a number of years called Dads With Wisdom. And it’s an. It’s a community that you might want to check out yourself, so we’ll learn a little bit more about that as well.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:22]:
Adam, thanks so much for being here today.

Adam Angel [00:02:24]:
Thanks for having me.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:25]:
I’m really excited to be able to have you. And for full transparency to everyone. Adam has been on a previous podcast with me. So my old in my past podcast, the Dads with Daughters podcast, Adam was on four years ago, so we’re moving forward in time. And now his daughter is nine years old. And I’m really excited to be able to delve a little bit deeper into what’s happened over those years and what’s happened up till now. And I guess to start off today, one question that I, Adam, is, as you think about the relationship with your daughter, what’s one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve shared with your daughter and what made it so special?

Adam Angel [00:03:02]:
One of the most meaningful moments was when she was trying to pass the swim test right before the swim team. This was after we last talked. And I think in terms of being more active and trying to find a thing that she could do physically, that wasn’t something that came automatically to her. There was a lot of anxiety around sort of that or idea that it wasn’t good for her, meaning, like, didn’t fit her. And so really what I was navigating on my end was trying to figure out how much to push and how much to support and sort of leave it to her. And this was like a moment I’ll never forget, because as we had been doing swimming classes, I could see that she was, you know, getting some confidence, and she had. We ended up with this wonderful teacher who I started the training, and then I could see that she needed something from someone else and that had been really good and progressed. And then there was this moment where she wanted to pass a swim test and was really afraid.

Adam Angel [00:03:56]:
And we had set up the swim tester. You know, there was like, some date to do it, and if you passed that, then you had a chance at the swim team, which she could. I could definitely tell she was interested in, she expressed interest in. So anyway, so we’re driving there, and she started to get nervous, and she said, I don’t want to do this anymore. I don’t want to do a swim test. And I said, you don’t have to do it. We’re already in the car. We’re already halfway there.

Adam Angel [00:04:21]:
You’re in your swimsuit. Let’s go there. We’ll be there. We’ll stand there. And if. If you don’t want to do it when you get there, we don’t have to do it, but I want to just go. And she said she agreed. She didn’t really say much, but she didn’t protest.

Adam Angel [00:04:32]:
And she can protest. She doesn’t have a problem with that. So we get there, and at the pool, we’re Standing there and she. They call for kids her age and she looks over and she’s about to say something to me. I see her shed one or two tears and I said, I just looked at her, I’m like, you good? And she just kind of nodded and she would just jump right in. And then she passed the test, which was just awesome. And honestly, right after she passed the test, she just jumped in, like with her friends, and then she started playing the rest of the afternoon in the pool. It was just like a lot of relief on both sides, I think, for both of us.

Adam Angel [00:05:09]:
And I was just appreciating what I took from that. And by the way, she. So she joined the swim team, and then the next summer she was on the swim team as well. And then she did during the year. So just seeing how this progressed. And I’m happy to share more about that, but that moment for me was a lesson for myself on how much to push, to not want it for anything, but for her, but also to not let her sort of go in the house, you know what I mean? And just not see what she might be missing. So, like, you know, here’s what it could be. I don’t need to push you any further than this.

Adam Angel [00:05:39]:
And it was a, it was a great moment.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:41]:
Now you just talked about the fact about pushing and trying to help your daughter to be able to achieve kind of those, those passions, those dreams that she has for herself, the things that she wants to accomplish. Talk to me about how you go about that support and what do you do to be able to support your daughter in pursuing those passions and dreams.

Adam Angel [00:06:02]:
What I’ve come to understand is like, I can help her through some low level skill building, meaning, like, you know, she wants to join something more serious. We’re going to give her that opportunity, structure. But first I need to support her in understanding that everyone has fear, everyone has these barriers. And then I show her how this has happened to me and I support her in getting her in front of these situations. Like, like an example was the pool. But later she. She ended up trying basketball and she ended up loving it. But the reason she loved it is she ended up doing a summer camp for a week, which was really high intensity, which I was a little worried that could send her the other way.

Adam Angel [00:06:44]:
But I always give her the opportunity to say, like, hey, like, you can try this and you could step away from it, but I want to just show you what it looks like, you know, what it could look like. My dad used to say to me, better to Be the tail of the lion than the head of the wolves. And I’ve shared that with my kids and they both like it. They enjoy that. They notice that. And last week was the first week that she. And I’ll tell you how that came about, but she decided she wanted to try jiu jitsu and so she did it and she enjoyed it. Whether she stayed with it or not, I’m not sure.

Adam Angel [00:07:12]:
But she stayed with basketball and she loves her neighborhood basketball team now too. So just to think of her last time we talked when she was 5, doing these different activities and just building this kind of confidence in ourself is just quite a progression. And I think ultimately it was, this is what it looks like. I’m here to support you through it. This is what it could look like at the very basic level. I’ll show you and you could tell me if you want to do it after you try it or even in the middle. If you want to give up, that’s okay. But I want you to see.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:41]:
I love the intention that you’re giving to that. And I guess one of the things that comes to mind are thinking about the intentional ways in which you’re working with your daughter and helping her to be able to not only see you as a real person and understand your background and what made you who you are, but also helping her through those, those fears, those anxieties and more. Talk to me more about some of those intentional ways that you have worked to strengthen your bond with your daughter, especially during challenging times. Because we all know that it’s not always easy, but there are challenging times too.

Adam Angel [00:08:17]:
So right around Covid hit, this was a really hard obviously for so many people. And we. She was four and she was three and a half and. Or three and a few months. And my son was just being born, which was crazy, 10 days in. And that was really hard moment. And I think of it as maybe the hardest moment for her and having to not let her go back to her pre K which was such a great place and so like everything from there and before that. But I’ve just like understood that, you know, there is just when you can’t do something, you have to grieve with your kids sometimes.

Adam Angel [00:08:51]:
And at that time I think I was just not equipped with the level of connection to myself and open heartedness for my own grief of what was happening. And I remember she held for a little bit a lot of shame at that time because I was like, you can’t go to school. And she was like basically telling Me, oh, I’m going to school. I mean, she fought me like it was the. I was the worst thing in the world and I was breaking my heart. I remember she, I think she bit me like that. She had never bitten me before, but she felt like that was very bad about that. But I told her, like, that’s what, first of all, that’s what, you know, she.

Adam Angel [00:09:23]:
Even years later, that’s what kids do and we work through it. And I wasn’t shaming her for that. And at some point, you know, sort of as she got older, she and many kids, you know, can hold shame around what they do or how they feel and so on, and just making it more and more open by having these conversations, especially while driving at night in these moments of like, intimacy and just being honest about how it was hard for me and what was hard for me and how I’m open to whatever is going on for her. And so it’s been wonderful to sort of be able to be that person for her. And I’ve grown and learned so much from her about my necessity of being open hearted and willing to not just be wrong, but just like be able to learn from her, but also to grieve, as I said, with her or struggle through something with her. And I think that honesty, you know, doesn’t mean that I’m giving up my authority and my, you know, being able to tell her, hey, this is what we need to do. Sometimes it just means that there’s a softness that’s available to her.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:24]:
And your daughter’s getting older, not yet a preteen. We’re getting close into those tween years. How have you found that you are balancing guiding your daughter while still giving her that independence to grow into the person that she’s becoming?

Adam Angel [00:10:39]:
I had a moment where my wife and I keep having this conversation over and over. Like, there’s some friends that have phones and then I’ve told her she’s not having a phone and I’m not giving her any data when she will. Like, it’s just not on the table and I’ve told her why. And then at one point she was really, you know, pushing and I said, okay, I’m gonna explain again. And I gave her like in depth about how this either essentially she’s could be connected to many things that actually might scare her that people that I don’t know, there’s no checks and so on. And you know, that’s a bit high, high level for a nine year old. But she understood to some degree and Then that same day I said, you know, I wanted me and my wife and I talking about it, but I just decided to go for it because I wasn’t necessarily comfortable with it. But I was thinking this is the opposite way, to provide some opportunity for her to have freedom.

Adam Angel [00:11:32]:
And I sent her out with her brother without us on bikes. So he’s six, she’s nine. And I feel that she’s much more, even much more responsible, more than she already is, especially when he’s around and she’s in charge. I think that’s useful. Then it’s just like, guys go. And she like looked at me like, are you serious? And I’m like, I was like, this is the way that you can go and explore as opposed to on the phone. And I’m not going to come with you. I’ll be, I’ll be out there in 30 minutes or something.

Adam Angel [00:11:58]:
And I told her the perimeter, which was about a mile, we have like a park not too far from us, like a, both a school park and a community park. It’s a good amount of green, plus sidewalks. You know, she doesn’t have to cross many streets at all. And I said, told her she knows the route. Go, that’s where you can go. And I went out there 30 minutes later when my wife was like, can you go right? And I’m like, okay. And when I went out there and they were fine, they were fine. But I just like trying to juxtapose those two for her and for me, because it was hard, you know, it’s, it’s, it’s worrisome, but it was fine.

Adam Angel [00:12:31]:
It was totally fine. And I hope that it will continue to be fine when I send her out every day. So to kind of trust the people that we put her in hands, including

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:39]:
her own, you know, that brings up so much. I mean, and I think back to my own childhood and the way in which I was really a free range child in the sense that in my generation, I think our parents were like, yeah, go outside, go and come back. You need to be back by this time and we’ll see you later. We didn’t have phones, we didn’t have any of that. But, but I think that there definitely is a difference in the way in which we are. There’s a fear in a lot of parents to do that in the safety of our kids and, and whether we should be doing that. And there’s some reality to that as well. And I guess one thing that comes to mind as I hear you say that is that you’re providing your daughter with the ability for her to see that you trust her and that you are listening to her and that you want her to feel valued, heard, and also that you trust her to make good decisions.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:32]:
And I guess as you think about that, what are some of the things that you’re doing intentionally to make your daughter feel valued and heard?

Adam Angel [00:13:40]:
These are day to day things as opposed to like the big story. It’s like I thinking about having conversations about her friendships, little things, these conflicts that seemingly we would might say like what’s really this about this is not important or whatever but. But they’re very important. These are conversations about being enough, knowing that you’re, you’re okay to be different, to set it something as simple as she likes fashion set a trend as opposed to having to follow other people rebutting people or the boys in her class are like characterizing all girls in one way or mistreating her another classmate is so just hearing the story and being like, you know, that’s asking her how she feels about it, what maybe her frustration with it or and so on and then, and then pushing her to know that she’s okay regardless of others view of her, that it’s most important, it’s her own view. And that can seem trite, but it really is so central to her experience because that’s a lot of our hours of her day are with peers. And we make a point, my wife and I make a point of when we’re together, we’re together and like being connected, connected to them and like we do a lot of camping. So now she wears that and I bring that into the situation because I think that gives us space to be connected in a different way and have like her voice heard around different topics and just being with it and not so peer oriented because so much of her life can be because of school. And so like you know, it doesn’t mean they don’t do play dates.

Adam Angel [00:15:06]:
There’d be plenty of that and so on, but just kind of coming back to it and helping her understand herself and how she really feels and so she can rebut other people’s ideas around her with her own.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:18]:
I love that now none of us as dads are infallible. We’re humans, we make mistakes. What’s a mistake that you’ve made as a father and what did you learn from it about fostering positive communication?

Adam Angel [00:15:31]:
Maybe it’s good to use the day to day so that it feels more normal for people that are hearing it. Because I think when there’s moments where I move to anger, you know, with either one of the kids and sometimes or misunderstand because I made a judgment and about what they were doing and so on, or how they were speaking or so and so forth, it’s like, essentially what I’m doing is the opposite of what I just talked about, which is that I’m not waiting to listen. I’m not seeing my daughter as. There’s an idea in, like, the psychotherapy world that we. That I, like, trained in, this is my. As my profession, that we can see others at times and different moments as objects in our life as opposed to subjects in our shared life. And I think essentially objectify her. I see her as like, okay, she’s just someone in my life, and I can just say or do what I please.

Adam Angel [00:16:19]:
And like, it doesn’t. Again, doesn’t mean that I can’t have my authority of being okay, like, I’m the adult here. But it does mean that in those moments when I made mistakes and I think that they’re frequent enough and I can say, like, these moments, I just sort of like, this is how I. What I want to happen, and it’s not happening the way I want it to happen. And so how I characterize this, essentially, many times we have a parallel process between our kids and us. And like, in these moments, I’m like, I don’t want this. I want this to work this way. And she’s like, well, I want us to have this.

Adam Angel [00:16:49]:
And essentially we’re both having an experience of wanting something and then not be able to get what we want and then having a tantrum of, like, loss around it. Right? Like, I want this. And really what we both need to do on some level, and us first being the adult, is to accept that this is. May not going to work the way we wanted it to. And that sucks maybe for us, depending on situation. And then we can be with their grief if it’s not working out for them either. Or maybe we’re able to accommodate a certain situation. But the point is, is that there are a number of these mistakes.

Adam Angel [00:17:21]:
I don’t think it’s useful just say one big one. I think those happen frequent enough where I just like, oh, yeah, right. I just may not get what I want here. So. And then I maybe act out on my. My daughter by saying, you need to do this or you this. And maybe it comes out in anger. So.

Adam Angel [00:17:35]:
And I have to come back and apologize and then say, like, I didn’t see you in that moment. Or that was hard for me too.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:40]:
And what’s one way that you show your daughter that she can always count on you?

Adam Angel [00:17:44]:
This is a do not say type of thing. Just showing up and being there. Basketball games, those are the more regular big moments. And then the other ones are like putting her to bed, getting her up in the morning, taking her to school. I think just like the regularity, the frequency, the explanations when you can’t, showing that you’ve been thinking about them, willingness to listen to them first, I think knowing when I’m going to be there for you, and so on. I think also, like, maybe moments with others where other people are objectifying your kids and you’re like, no, I’m on your side. And it doesn’t mean that. Again, like, I’m like, you need to be respectful of your teachers, for example.

Adam Angel [00:18:19]:
But if the teacher is acting out on your kid in the sense that they’re not seeing them as a whole person and they’re just kind of treating them, again, like just whoever there will step in and have a conversation with them. But again, I’m also talking like a student conversation today. She may struggle with a particular class. And I ask her, like, is this. Is there anything in this that you could do for yourself to improve the situation? Because, like, it seems like maybe you could have done something here, but it doesn’t mean that you’re not wrong if you’re in your protest. And I got you, I’m on your side here, but, like, look at your side a little bit too. So I’m holding both lenses and. But I think she knows that I’m coming from a place ultimately that I have her back.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:01]:
And what’s the tradition or routine that you’ve created together that strengthens your bond?

Adam Angel [00:19:07]:
There was a period of time that was quite hard when she was younger, where it was she. She went to a different school first. And I like, my funny story was that she’s like, went to a school and then she went into like, the public school. And it was really. She really struggled with it. And I said, I told her, like, if you want to go somewhere else, she said, what she said is, they don’t know how to teach. She’s like five telling me this, like, six weeks into her school. I’m like, oh, my God, this is crazy.

Adam Angel [00:19:39]:
So then I’m like, but I think there’s. What she’s saying was, I don’t want to sit and do worksheets. That’s what she’s saying. I don’t blame her. So Anyway, we ended up trying a different school. But I told her, if you really want to do that, you have to go and do these like tours and stuff. And she did it. So we ended up going somewhere else.

Adam Angel [00:19:55]:
But during that period of time, you know, at the other school, I started this tradition. I took off work on a particular day early. And so when I picked her up on Mondays, we would go just one on one and pick a place and have a smoothie or something. And then we don’t do that every week now like we did, but we do do something else now. For example, right now we’re Wednesdays, we go to Jiu Jitsu. Right? That’s what we’re going to do now. But before was did a practice a day that we did practice basketball one on one. And I do that with my son too.

Adam Angel [00:20:24]:
Like just making that one on one time. And like, this is just for you, me and you connect. But especially when you realize it’s like a season for challenge. Like, more like this month has been really struggling. The intervention is almost always best. Intervention is one on one time and making sure they know that you’re putting them first.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:40]:
So I mentioned the fact that you have a site called Dads with Wisdom. And one of the things that I wanted to kind of first start with is that not everybody knows what that is. They may never have heard of it. So bring me back to the beginning and talk to me about the inception of Dads with Wisdom and why did you decide that you needed something like Dads with Wisdom and that other dads needed something like Dads with Wisdom?

Adam Angel [00:21:07]:
Yeah. So my son was born 10 days after Covid. We went home. The doctor said nobody can come and visit for like 60 days. We happen to live near our family on both sides. We were like, why did we do this? Now it’s like, this sucks. So we’re just all alone and just really struggling. I was in the nonprofit world before I went to private practice.

Adam Angel [00:21:25]:
And that was a lot to. And it was there I kind of like decided that just like I’m gonna go and go leave my job and took some time to do it. But then I had more time with my son and that process. I was thinking, oh man, this has got to be a really hard time for fathers. And what came next is I reached out to a few people in my area, Washington, D.C. area, just like practitioners that are also private practice. Like anyone running a group for dads. And nobody was.

Adam Angel [00:21:51]:
There was one person who was a woman who’s who ran at one time and, and I had a nice conversation with her about how she did that. Then I put out emails around it and I got like a ton of responses, but all of them from women, mostly practitioners and many wives asking for this to work. And I was like, okay, I’m not messaging this well or to the right audiences. So I spent some time, created this website and I got in touch with a local called the Breastfeeding center of Greater Washington. And it’s basically like they do classes for mostly moms and couples, but nothing for dads. And so I, you know, we had a good conversation about it. I essentially became like a partner affiliation and we started running them and then it filled up very quickly and I don’t charge that much for these group. And it’s 10 sessions.

Adam Angel [00:22:40]:
I just read all I could read in terms of books and et cetera. And then I just created like this semi structured group where I like, I didn’t know what I was doing. I was like, I think this is like a little bit after this. I was talking to you about this not too much longer after. And what I was doing when I knew enough, what I didn’t know was like, what do men really want? Because I think they were telling me one thing and maybe they wanted something slightly different. But I was like, maybe more emphasizing the topics and such and like kind of like the educational sort of aspect. And then I, I think what really they wanted was a space to discuss this stuff. And it was good to have those topics and structure, but also really important to stay attuned to what they really were wanting that day.

Adam Angel [00:23:20]:
And so what I’ve come to do is like those 10 sessions still exist. I still have those about three times a year. So that’s 30 weeks of the year. And these guys are basically getting more space before at the beginning and the end of these sessions to kind of just say what’s going on for them, but also getting some topic based discussion and also like if they want resources, different topics of new parenthood. These are all for fathers that are first time fathers and new kids. And maybe we meet one time in person now as well. The rest are virtual because I have guys coming from Baltimore all the way to like Virginia Beach. So those are the three areas of my licensing.

Adam Angel [00:23:58]:
But you know, I even have guys sometimes come from outside of the area because this is not really therapy. This is not therapy. It’s like peer based support. So that’s what propelled me to do it and how it started. And now it’s like what surprised me with all These groups that are now actually what would be called psychotherapy groups. And I have multiple of these running and there’s six or so guys in each one and they love it. And I’m better at it than I was five years by a lot. I think a lot of it is my own internal growth.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:27]:
And then sometimes there’s a stigma to being in a group of individuals talking about things that make you vulnerable in that way. So for a dad who’s hesitant to join something that’s like this, what would you say to help him take that first step?

Adam Angel [00:24:41]:
Well, first of all, I usually send them a podcast. Sometimes it’s the best way to get and just to receive it as opposed to having to read. I think normalization obviously is the biggest one. Right. It’s like we all go through this. It’s. And I think when having somebody else that’s going through the exact same thing or very similar at the exact same time is just worth so much. And that’s even before I add anything.

Adam Angel [00:25:04]:
Right. It’s just that. And so just I always tell people like, hey, the kind of person that would be in this group is someone like you, who also is thinking, I don’t know if this works out for me. But I think this person’s committed to being a better father and a better partner maybe and a better. And so on. So that’s who’s going to be there. And when you go there, it’s got its own process. So you don’t have to jump right in.

Adam Angel [00:25:25]:
You may. And many times these people do. And so it really depends on the kind of group. But I think that’s why I like talk to people for like 15 minutes before trying to maybe longer, 20 minutes, 30 minutes just to see like, what do you really want here? And people have come and gone in the groups and actually gone to different groups. So like I do like an hour for right before birth for free for people if they want to just like think about how they’re feeling and like prepare for what will happen at the birth and then like the first days of postpartum experience. So like that’s like a free hour. Then people then tend to sign up for the 10 week new dads and then many times a little later, these, they’re men that just like, hey, I just want a more depth oriented conversation with other guys. And that’s the sort of dads 2.0 groups that we’re doing.

Adam Angel [00:26:07]:
I’ve been creating some other groups as well, dads that have lost in like, you know, early infancy or in late pregnancy. I have group for them and also for them if they’re parenting after that loss and like, you know, so they can have a space for being which, which has its own unique thing things to it. So I would say to them like, they’re like you. And there’s, there’s this huge value in having that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:29]:
There truly is value in that. And I think it is important to be able to put yourself out there and be able to. And I’ve said this before, to be vulnerable not only with other men, but with your kids in many different ways. I guess as you look at the groups that you’ve created, the ability for people to come together, what’s one story, and I’m not asking you to break confidentiality, that really captures the impact that you’ve seen for dads that have taken part in these groups.

Adam Angel [00:26:58]:
This happened yesterday, I’m not kidding in this sweet group. This like conversation was just very. This is a dad’s 2.0 group and the dad was talking about one dad was basically struggling as newer to the group. I am not the preferred parent. It’s really hard for me. I’m not sure, you know, sort of essentially the level of I’m not at the level of connection I would like with my kids. And other guys were like, first of all, this is a normal pattern that goes up and down. Sometimes times you preferred, sometimes you’re not.

Adam Angel [00:27:25]:
And this guy basically said like. I don’t think he was trying to speak about his, the impact, but I think it was obvious to me. He was like, basically in the last six months that he’s been in the group for about a year and some. And he said I’m the preferred person parent. And I used to get, you know, essentially like overwhelmed and dealing with my kids. And I would essentially, I don’t know his reactions to that, but ultimately now they come to me. They’re all over me all the time. And that’s hard, but it’s a lot better, it’s a lot different than it was where they didn’t know that I was kind of like that connection and depth of relationship just wasn’t where it is now.

Adam Angel [00:28:02]:
So that’s one that just came to me off the top of my head. But I was just like, just appreciating how much he cares, how much he’s worked to be that for his kids. And that took a lot of reflection and self determination.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:17]:
So one of the other things that comes to mind when I was thinking about this was when we’re talking about Vulnerability and men being willing to connect with other men. Why do you think it’s so hard for men to build authentic community and, and how does that impact their parenting or their ability to be the father that they want to be.

Adam Angel [00:28:39]:
Yeah, actually that. To bring this up when in previous answer. So I appreciate you asking it because I think that’s also how I sometimes. So the group I said like, I mean, people tell me and you can tell me if it’s true. For years I’ll say to someone that they have close friends, but they still don’t have these kind of conversations they need to have where they can actually say what they’re really feeling around life, parenting and their experience as a husband after kids and so on and so forth. And usually the guys will not be like, yeah, I have close friends, or I don’t really have this kind of relationship with friends, but I still can’t have this conversation. And the guys will say like, especially when they’re leaving. And like, I have them like, kind of like just people like say really kind things to them as if someone’s leading a group or something and the dad’s 2.0.

Adam Angel [00:29:20]:
And they’ll say something like that, like, like this has been a different place where I can actually say like, hey, you know, today I didn’t feel like wanting to be a parent. I just, I was mad about being a dad and I didn’t like it. I don’t want to be like. And that’s a really hard thing to say. If I say that somewhere else, someone’s going to judge me. And all the other guys in the group, like, not usually we know what you’re talking about. Because they also know that they’re committed. Just because they’re having a protest has nothing to do with their love.

Adam Angel [00:29:42]:
Those two are not incongruent. And so just naming the frustration and difficulty has nothing to do with the level of care and knowing that the people around you are not going to judge you and know that that is what vulnerability is. I had this wonderful quote from my. One of my mentors in my training institute that I do on a regular basis. And he says there’s a difference between transparency and vulnerability, but only you will know it because it’s an internal experience. I can be transparent with you, Chris, and I can also, I can tell you about my life, but if I don’t feel the vulnerability, then it’s not vulnerable. And usually the vulnerability requires a little bit of worry that this could be harmful to me if you use this against. And that Fear that around that is like, that’s actually.

Adam Angel [00:30:29]:
Well, we of course can explore it. But the bottom line is that’s a risk and you’re taking it. And you’re taking it. Your willingness to take it is its own bond between the guys. And everyone knows it when you’re doing it. You know it first and they know it usually second. And so that’s been something that I’ve actually said as a part of our conversations and times with the guys. And there’s a good response to that.

Adam Angel [00:30:51]:
And they’re able to engage in another level of vulnerability. So I don’t know if I answered all the question if it was like why it’s hard. I think is like. I think the answer is that it’s scary and that we’ve been hurt in a lot of ways to taught not to do that. That’s the real world. Like. And you shouldn’t be vulnerable to every single person because it can be. There are people that have unfortunately not the best intentions but.

Adam Angel [00:31:12]:
But there are plenty that you can. And you can navigate that by just by figuring it out as you go through the relationship.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:18]:
When I think some of that goes back to trauma in regards to what individuals have experienced in their own life. And there’s many men that have generational trauma or patterns that they experienced growing up. And I’m sure you’ve seen that in groups in different ways. How would you say that dads can begin to break those cycles for themselves?

Adam Angel [00:31:40]:
Yeah, I mean this is my work. So like when I’m not doing groups, I’m doing individual therapy. And my focus of training has been in complex trauma. And what that really means essentially is we adjust ourselves as all people do. And even when we’re wonderful dads that we are, Chris, our kids, we’re not going to be perfect for them and therefore they will have to adjust. And there’s. It just is part of life. And that adjustment means that we’re going to create strategies to protect ourselves.

Adam Angel [00:32:03]:
And we had to do that as kids. And so when I work with people individually and in the group, we notice what they’re really wanting for themselves, which is this intention that we’re going to state together. So for example, I would like to have greater self confidence or some state or experience in myself or maybe I want to have more capacity to be vulnerable. But that is where we’re coming from, from the adult side of what we want. Now when we are engaged in relationships, it’s very easy to fall into the strategies that worked for us at one point. Or at least attempted to work for us as a young person in a life where we don’t have any agency as a child, you don’t. Ultimately you’re worried about your, the people that care for you, caregivers and the culture around you. And it has rules.

Adam Angel [00:32:47]:
And you realize those rules. You’re very quick to learn that as a kid until you keep yourself safe through this process. And those strategies, they need to be confronted and addressed. And the way that you do that is by sitting with someone else who cares and has, can support you. And when you do that, working out, for example, in therapy, you get something where you can notice with the person, deepen into the emotions of what has happened, but more importantly, what’s coming up for you now and how you might be allowing in these same things. And I see that allowing with a lot of compassion doesn’t mean we’re intentionally doing it, but allowing in old strategies which are determining things in your life you no longer want. And when you can be that with that, with that, in this kind of process, we can interrupt generational, cultural, all the things trauma that you’ve been through. And again, I’m using that word lightly because I know sometimes people talk about trauma, but it’s, it’s just your experiences or you were limited to what you could do and be and who you could be.

Adam Angel [00:33:47]:
And we’re trying to just say if you want to be something else, you can, but you gotta address it and be with it. And you have to do it with someone who also has this and other people and in the group, other people that are committed to doing the same. So that that’s where the growth can happen.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:01]:
Now if people want to find out more about dads with wisdom, where should they go?

Adam Angel [00:34:05]:
Yeah, so website is dadswithwisdom.com and that’s where the groups are mostly. And if there’s anyone who’s experienced loss in parenting, you know, early life, you know, early pregnancy or late pregnancy loss, I do those groups too. But I keep that off the website and go to Adamodulotherapy.com for. That’s for the individual work and also therapy group. Because I just, it can be really intense for someone who’s lost to see those pictures of babies that are sort of on the Dads of Wisdom website. I also am doing a retreat in the fall. It’s the first time I’ve ever done that. And this is sort of listening.

Adam Angel [00:34:38]:
I went to a men’s retreat myself, was profound and very thoughtful, pushed me further. And so I was like you know, I could do this. So I’m going to be doing something in the Shenandoah area and it’s going to be exciting. So that’s also happening now.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:52]:
I always finish our interviews with what I like to call our dad connection. 6. Six more questions to delve a little bit more into you as a dad. Are you ready? I don’t know. What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughter?

Adam Angel [00:35:04]:
Maybe an easy one. Loving, caring, Something like that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:35:07]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice you’ve ever received?

Adam Angel [00:35:11]:
I’m not sure if it’s the best, but it’s true. This too shall pass. It’ll change again. It’s okay.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:35:17]:
What’s one activity that you and your daughter love doing together?

Adam Angel [00:35:20]:
Sometimes it’s just sitting and having a nice snack at this, like, particular place that we like, have like good little drinks and we just kind of like look out the window. We have a good conversation. So I think that’s one of the big ones. I think I mentioned other, other ones earlier.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:35:33]:
If you could give your daughter one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Adam Angel [00:35:38]:
You’re enough.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:35:39]:
What’s one thing that you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Adam Angel [00:35:42]:
I want to be silly with it and say I’m enough.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:35:46]:
And what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Adam Angel [00:35:54]:
I think what we’re talking about here is obviously don’t give up stuff. You’re going to be okay. All these things that we’re just mentioning. But you need, you need. If you want to be a rock, you need a mountain, you need and to sit on. And I think that’s. That’s the men that can support you. And so you doing it alone is.

Adam Angel [00:36:10]:
It’s the start to do not really possible in the same way or it’s going to be really detrimental to do it. So you need to be the person that you want to be, the dad that you want to be. You need other men to support you. You’ll get where you want to be that way much easier.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:36:24]:
Well, Adam, I just want to say thank you. Thank you so much for being here today for the work that you’re doing with dads with wisdom and for sharing the journey that you’ve been on with your daughter up till now. It’s still keep going to keep going, and you’re going to keep learning and it’s going to be an amazing journey along the way. But I truly want to say thank you for being here and I wish you all the best.

Adam Angel [00:36:44]:
Thank you so much for having me. Appreciate it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:36:46]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged, engaged dad isn’t about being perfect. It’s about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes@dadanddaughterconnection.com until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Performer [00:37:17]:
We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers we spend the time we give the lessons we make the meals we buy them presents and bring your A game Cause those kids are growing fast the time goes by by just like a dynamite blast Calling astronauts and firemen Carpenters and muscle men get out and be the world to them Be the best dad you can be Be the best dad you can be.

Building Stronger Father-Daughter Bonds: Insights from John Francis

May 11, 2026 by dadofdivas

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

This week on the “Dad and Daughter Connection” podcast, Dr. Christopher Lewis sits down with John Francis, founder of Fathers Eve and proud dad of two daughters, for a heartfelt conversation on what it truly takes to connect with our daughters and nurture their growth into confident, independent women. Whether you’re a first-time dad or a seasoned parent looking for fresh inspiration, this episode is packed with wisdom, real-life stories, and actionable advice that will resonate long after you listen.

One of the central themes of this episode is vulnerability. John Francis recounts a powerful moment when he allowed his daughters to see him grieve and express emotion about the loss of his own father—a memory that not only brought the family closer but gave his daughters permission to be honest about their feelings as well. As Dr. Christopher Lewis highlights, modeling vulnerability to our daughters breaks down barriers, opens up deeper connections, and provides a living example that it’s okay to be real and open as men.

The show also explores the importance of intentional parenting. John Francis emphasizes being truly present, stepping away from the “helicopter” parenting style, and letting kids learn through natural consequences. By designing his work and life to allow for more time with his children, he’s witnessed the value of being available and engaged throughout their childhood—something he encourages all dads to strive for.

Perhaps most touching are the actionable ideas shared: from creating regular one-on-one time with each daughter, to writing handwritten letters at major milestones, John Francis offers practical ways to strengthen bonds during both the joyful and challenging times. He’s candid about his own parenting mistakes, revealing how seeking family therapy and learning patience have helped him foster a healthier, happier home environment.

Finally, don’t miss the inspiring story behind Fathers Eve—a growing movement that gives dads a special night to connect, share, and celebrate each other just before Father’s Day. John Francis invites all fathers to get involved (“It’s fun, it’s free, it’s everywhere!”) and reminds us that being a great dad is about showing up, listening, and always striving to grow.

If you’re looking for encouragement or practical tips for your own fatherhood journey, tune in to this episode of the “Dad and Daughter Connection”—and start building the relationship your daughter will cherish for years to come. Listen now!

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there. It’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to work together on these relationships, relationships that you want to build with your daughter. And it is a journey because each one of us is on a journey to be able to become the best dad that we want to be.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:09]:
But on top of that, we have to put in the time, the effort to be able to build those solid relationships, because the relationship between a father and a daughter is a really important one, and you and I both know that. But we have to be present, we have to be in it to win it, and we have to be willing to learn and to grow to be able to become the dads that we want to be. And that’s why this podcast exists every week. I love being able to bring you different people with different experiences to be able to have them share some of their own journey in being a dad to a daughter. And today we got another great guest. John Francis is with us, and John is the founder of Father’s Eve, or we’re going to be talking about Father’s Eve, because Father’s Eve is coming up here in not too long. And. But even more important, he is a father of two daughters, so we’re going to be talking about his own relationship and experiences with his daughters, as well as what he’s done with Father’s Eve, and I’m really excited to have him here.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:05]:
Thanks so much for being here, John.

John Francis [00:02:06]:
Thank you. I appreciate it, Christopher. I’m glad to be here and be on your podcast. I love it. Thank you.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:12]:
Well, I’m really excited to be able to have you here today, and I appreciate you being here. To be honest, John has been on podcasts with me for many years. We. I’ve had him on a couple of other podcasts along the way, so I always love being able to reconnect with John. And this time we’re going to be talking about a few different things in regards to your relationship with your daughters. I guess the first. First question that I love to start these conversations with is, as you think about the relationship that you’ve had with your daughters, what’s one of the most meaningful moments that you’ve been able to share with each of your daughters and what made it so special?

John Francis [00:02:47]:
Wow, that’s a really good question. Hard to think about just one or the most. I’ll think about something. I guess what’s coming to my mind is they’ve seen me be vulnerable in a personal way, and I just remember the look on their face. I was having a memory about my dad. I lost my dad when I was 26, and I lost my brother just a few years later when I was 29, before I ever got married and well, before I ever had kids. And we were at home one day and I don’t know what we were talking about. It might have been my dad’s birthday or a holiday or something.

John Francis [00:03:19]:
And I was telling stories about my dad and how much I missed him and the sadness and the grief. And I can feel it now just thinking about it. I teared up and I was. Let it out, you know, just let it. I didn’t stifle it. I just said, you know, I gotta let this out. And. And it was fine.

John Francis [00:03:35]:
It was natural and appropriate. And I think I’ve learned how to. That’s living experience, let that happen. And. And they weren’t little, but they were young. But they were old enough to see that, gee, that dad doesn’t do that very often. And we talked about it kind of in the moment and then a little bit after, and I felt good about it because I think they realized that, oh, wow, it’s okay, look, here’s our dad. And we have typical kind of household environment here.

John Francis [00:04:00]:
But anyway, it was a moment where they saw me as regular, real human who has emotion and can express them. And it’s not always just, rah, rah, let’s go crazy. Was here’s dad really dealing with grief over his father? And anyway, it was a meaningful moment. And I remember in the moment thinking, I’m gonna just do this and let it happen and talk about it because I want them to see it. So it was intentional, but I was intentionally natural. I don’t know if that makes any sense. I didn’t stifle it. I think a lot of guys, or a lot of maybe in the past I would have Said, well, you know what, we’re going to talk about something else or move on or I wouldn’t hold it.

John Francis [00:04:35]:
But I. Anyway, I feel like that was a meaningful moment and I. We all kind of grew together and an understanding that it’s okay to be real and be emotional and express that, especially when you’re together with your family.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:47]:
It is really important because so many times men have a tendency to compartmentalize and we don’t always share things. And I’ve said over and over again on this podcast the importance of being vulnerable and showing our daughters that men can be vulnerable and pushing ourselves out of our comfort zones in that way. Because ultimately, as you found as well, you’re going to find that that vulnerability opens you up and your daughters up to more connection and that becomes even more important in the end.

John Francis [00:05:20]:
Yeah, I agree 100%. I can think of a few other moments that we’ve had that were meaningful, but maybe not in the same sense. But I’m a lucky guy that I’ve been able to. I designed my lifestyle, frankly, to be able to work from home when my kids were little and when they were old enough to start paying attention, I was really able to be full present as a dad, engaged at their schools and involved in their lives. Not helicopter snowplow parents, but fully available and to the point where it was like, well, that’s just normal. Doesn’t everyone have mom and dad who kind of do this? And then when they were old enough to realize that, boy, that’s not common. Not every mom and dad have this kind of availability, I’ll call it. So it was intentional for me and I’m just so grateful because we’ve got that kind of connection and relationship and I think it was good for all of us.

John Francis [00:06:09]:
And I’m just grateful to be able to make the choice and. And conscious enough to make the choice, you know, because a lot of guys just aren’t, aren’t, aren’t thinking about it that way.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:22]:
You know, now every one of us as fathers want to be able to do what we can to be able to help our daughters to become who they’re becoming. How did you balance guiding your daughters while still giving them the independence to grow into the people that they inevitably becoming?

John Francis [00:06:43]:
Well, that’s another great question. I don’t know that a lot of it was really conscious, but I think that what’s coming through my mind is there were moments where I let them learn a lesson where I didn’t just solve the problem or I didn’t make Them see the problem. I let them just experience what I’ll call natural consequences to different situations, good and bad, not to shield them or protect them from reality. And I think, honestly, my girls have learned to handle themselves and handle situations. They’ve got tremendous confidence and. And they are interesting. You know, they know who they are and what they want, and they’re not afraid. And I think a lot of that confidence came from letting them just be who they are and solve their, whatever problems in life.

John Francis [00:07:26]:
I mean, not that I wasn’t. I was there, but it was more or less an approach of just letting them experience life on their own terms. And they’re very different. Of course. Every child is different. Even though they’re siblings and they grew up in the same era, in the same house and, you know, at the same time, but they’re both very different and different situations with each daughter. I can think of a few moments where it’s like they get it, you know, you can see kind of the connection made or the light bulb goes off. And then I might talk about it the next day or a couple days later and say, you know, what happened there? Here’s what I saw.

John Francis [00:07:57]:
And then let them recognize there was a lesson and they pick that up. One more opportunity to learn. We’re all learning, and I’m still learning, that’s for sure. But I think it was having the ability to just stay calm. That’s something I learned too. For me as a dad, early on, patience was not a strength, it was a weakness. And someone pointed it out, a friend of mine and my wife, frankly. And I’m like, oh, man, you’re right.

John Francis [00:08:20]:
I didn’t see it. But once I had the feedback, I recognized, wow, I need to develop more patience. This is nuts. Why would I react the way I, you know, and so that became a practice and I got much better at it. And. And I think that made a huge impact in the environment and just the stress level, because I didn’t want to be that. That angry or overreactive or snap temper kind of thing. That’s not who I am.

John Francis [00:08:42]:
It’s not who I want to be. And that’s not the dad I want. Because I believe daughters, they grow up, and if you’re dad, I mean, you become the example that they look for in their lives. And so I wanted to be the best version of myself to whatever degree I’m capable of.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:58]:
I think that what you’re saying is we have to be intentional about the things that we do, and we need to be able to Think about that as we’re working with our daughters and, and some of it is intentional and it’s conscious and some of it’s intentional but unconscious as well. And I guess as you think about intentional things that you’ve done, what are some intentional ways you’ve worked? Strengthen your bond with your daughters, especially during those challenging times as they were growing up. And you know, because it’s not always easy.

John Francis [00:09:26]:
No, nothing’s easy, man. I know that something someone suggested to me two things that come to my mind. One is create some one on one time with each child separately. And so I would take them maybe on an overnight, on a short trip somewhere, or even to our family shares a lake home, which is fabulous. We go and do things just together, just the two of us, either one or the other, but not all of us at the same time. And that one on one time was very valuable. And getting them away from home, away from the family, away from their friends and just where they kind of have to have a conversation because you’re together in the car. We didn’t go anywhere.

John Francis [00:10:03]:
I mean it wasn’t like a real big deal. But creating those one on one opportunities at different moments. And I’ve seen guys that do like an annual father daughter trip, which I think could be a really cool idea. I never got that far, but I think that’s kind of a neat routine to build if you can. But for me it was having those one on one intentional, short, I would say departure from home. We weren’t like an ordinary environment where you have all the usual distractions and I work from home. So that was primarily for me because if I’m home, that’s where I’m going to be. That’s one thing.

John Francis [00:10:35]:
The other thing someone recommended or I read somewhere, you know, I try to read and learn everywhere I go. And one of the other recommendations was write your daughter a letter at certain milestones in life and handwrite it, you know, not typed, but you might organize your thoughts and talk about what do you feel, how do you see them, what are you proud of, what do you hope for them, what are your dreams or whatever. I know it’s not a novel, it’s a few pages, but I’ve written them. My girls are older now, so the first milestone I figured that out was when they graduated high school because that’s clearly a big milestone. So I wrote each daughter a letter just from me to them saying, you know, as you’re graduating high school, I want to just share with you my thoughts about you and all the things you want to share. And so I put some thought into what to say and all the way back from the moment you were born, and some of the highlights or low lights or some of the lessons learned, and it’s not a recap of their whole life or anything, but it’s more about how I feel about them. And the idea is that there’s something you can give to them that they can hold on to. And everybody knows in the, you know, years from now, when you’re long gone, they might have that letter to go back and reflect and say, well, you know, I remember my dad this way because he was able to share with me these thoughts or these perspectives.

John Francis [00:11:46]:
So I’ve done that, and I intend to keep doing that at those milestone moments. And I just think I wish my dad wrote letters to all of us. I’m one of five kids, so he wrote letters to us before he died, but sadly, he knew he was dying. I mean, he had cancer for a long time. It was slow. So as he was fighting and fighting and fighting. And then finally, at the end, about the last three or four months, he started writing. And my mom, they were together, and she’s like, what are you writing? And he says, I’m writing letters.

John Francis [00:12:14]:
You’ll read them later. So he wrote a letter to the whole family, and then he wrote a letter to each of us. And that’s quite a gift, so I’m grateful for that. And then, like I said, reading, the suggestion was, hey, hey, dad. You know, your daughter, she’s only this age for a little while, and in the long life that she’s got, how do you want her to remember you? You can create some of these milestones that could be real meaningful. So, anyway, that’s something I’ve learned and I’ve tried to do, and it’s certainly simple and costs almost nothing, but it takes some time and effort, and that’s probably the hardest part, but it’s so worth it. And then they read it, and then we talk about it if they want, but they’ve got it. And so I feel like that’s.

John Francis [00:12:53]:
I can’t give them everything, but I can give them that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:56]:
Now, none of us as dads are perfect. We’re fallible. You know, we are humans, and we do make mistakes. And for you, as you’re thinking about your daughters and helping to raise your daughters, what’s a mistake that you made as a father and what did you learn from it? About fostering a positive connection with your daughters?

John Francis [00:13:16]:
Which one? Yes. I gotta Think of one that’s maybe relevant. I’m thinking about each girl. They’re so different. So with my older daughter, probably a mistake that I made early on when she was probably early teens, preteen maybe, and things were going crazy. Her relationship with her mother, my lovely wife, they had some challenges, and they didn’t see things the same way in a lot of ways. And my attitude was, I’m going to defend my wife first. So that’s what I thought was the right thing to do.

John Francis [00:13:47]:
And so that’s what I did. And it created a bit of a gap, I would say, with my daughter, because she recognized that, oh, okay, you’re siding with mom every time. And so she responded her own way. And that, you know, I mean, that’s the dynamic. Later, years later, our family. I insisted that we go together as a family to family counseling, family therapist. I said, we’re happy, we’re not miserable, but I know we can be more happy. And when I was a kid, my family went through some family therapy.

John Francis [00:14:15]:
One of my sisters, I have three sisters. One of my sisters went through chemical dependency, rehab treatment and pushed. Our whole family went through therapy because of that, and which was fantastic. It was sad for a lot of reasons, but it was really helpful for a lot of reasons because that therapy cleared up a lot of things that we were all unconscious to. So I had an appreciation for a good therapist. Years later, we went through some family therapy. Again, nothing really dramatic, but useful stuff. And some of this came out, and I started seeing how that really wasn’t maybe the best option all the time.

John Francis [00:14:46]:
And so I learned a lesson from that. And we talked about it, and we talked through it and. And kind of resolved it. And it’s like, well, okay, I can see why you did what you did, and I can see what you’ve learned. And it was me, her learning as much as I was learning, and same as my wife was learning. We’re all in this room together, and so it’s fascinating, I think, to just experience that. And we never had a bad relationship, but the relationship became much more clear and better after that because we all understood things just more clearly. And I think that’s where a good therapist is really valuable.

John Francis [00:15:21]:
And I’m glad we did that. And I expect we’ll do it again if we feel the need. Right? Because why wouldn’t you, if you can live a happier, better, calm, more healthy environment and relationships that we all want that. So that’s one thing I learned. I’m thinking about my other daughter with her, there are several. I can think of plenty of times where she was really mad at me, things I said or did that were not helpful. I think probably there I learned patience and understanding where her behavior was frustrating to me, and I might say something that was trying to provoke a response that really wasn’t useful, wasn’t healthy, and really just made her more mad. And then probably in that same therapy, kind of talk about those things and realize that, okay, that’s not smart.

John Francis [00:16:03]:
That’s not what I was trying to do, and that’s not what I want to do going forward. So learning more patience and then being a little more tolerant, I guess, of letting her do what she needs to do, even if it’s not what I think she should do or what I want her to do. But it’s not risky or dangerous. So just support her and let her do her thing. So I think I’ve learned that. Again, my girls, they’re not. Well, they’re both adults, so they’re not young ladies, but they got plenty of life ahead of them. And God willing, so do I.

John Francis [00:16:31]:
I’m sure we’ll have more lessons along the way is what I’m trying to say.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:34]:
It definitely happens throughout I their life and our life. We’re going to have to kind of ebb and flow in that regard. Now, I mentioned that you are the founder of Father’s Eve, and Father’s Eve is coming up. And I guess, first and foremost, why don’t you tell me a little bit about Father’s Eve and why you chose to start this event for dads in conjunction with Father’s Day.

John Francis [00:16:57]:
Well, thank you. Father’s Eve, of course, is the day really, the night before Father’s Day, we’ve got Christmas Eve and New Year’s Eve. And so I invented Father’s Eve Eve because I love Father’s Day. I love being a dad. It’s the most important thing I’ll ever do is raise some children. And so Father’s Day is for the dads and families to celebrate, but Father’s Eve is just for the dads. So we call it like a national Dad’s Night Out. And this year it’ll be June 20, 2026.

John Francis [00:17:25]:
Of course, it’s Saturday because Father’s Day Sunday. And honestly, it started as an accident of the calendar. When the Great Recession came through in 2009 and 10, we had an opportunity to move to a different house. So we did. And the house was nice, but the garage was terrible. So I had a new garage built at that House. And I wanted to show off my garage, basically to invite my buddies over and say, check out this garage, because it was pretty nice. And it turned out the only night available was that Saturday.

John Francis [00:17:56]:
And I didn’t have really a lot of free time. It must have been a busy summer. And so I said, well, we’ll just have a little get together in the garage and I’m going to call it Father’s Eve. Because that’s just kind of funny, right? It was sort of a joke. Well, a bunch of guys showed up and it turned out we had a great time, right? No children, no women, really nothing to it. Music was just a little too loud. It was perfect. I mean, it was just guys hanging out in a garage, kind of an inauguration or a christening of a new garage.

John Francis [00:18:24]:
And we had so much fun. We said, well, we got to do this again. And so we did it again and it had to be Father’s Eve now. We said, well, that’s. This worked out great, so let’s do it again. So we did it the second year, but doubled, right? More guys showed up and more friends of mine. And just different people were coming together back in the same garage. And this time we added food and some games and we were a little more prepared and organized.

John Francis [00:18:46]:
Well, the third year we did Father’s Eve, there were guys coming that I didn’t know, which I thought was great. This means my buddies are bringing their buddies, more friends are bringing more friends because they’re having so much fun. And it was still just all guys, very low key, no program, no speech, no nothing. Just show up and hang out and let’s get together. And celebrating fatherhood is kind of the tagline. So someone challenged me to say, what are you going to do with this Father’s Eve? Why don’t you do some good? So the third year, I guess the fourth year, we outgrew the garage. We moved it to a bar and we made it a fundraiser for two charities. We split the money as a fundraiser and we raised $10,000 and got some publicity, got some media, had some friends, some.

John Francis [00:19:26]:
Some of my good, smart friends who were able to help me with the food and events. And we ran an auction. We got some media attention. We put in a cornhole tournament to have some fun with it. And it turned into something a little more I ever expected. And so the next year, that was 2015, was sort of the first official organized. We had a logo, we sold T shirts. We were having some fun with it.

John Francis [00:19:49]:
The next year, I went to the DAD 2.0 conference, which was sort of a media influencer thing, which I had no clue what I was doing, but I thought, well, see what we can do. And I met the guys from City Dad’s group and I met the guys from the national At Home Dad Network network. And I’m like, where have you guys been my whole life I’ve been out here doing my thing all alone, on my own, figuring it out. And now I realize there’s groups all around the country. Well, I had no idea. So started the City Dads chapter here in Minnesota, the Twin Cities Dads group, as an affiliate or whatever their thing was. And great guys, great, lot of fun. And so it kind of took off from there.

John Francis [00:20:26]:
We license it, I trademarked it and we license it for free. So Father’s Eve is fun, it’s free and it’s, we say it’s everywhere. So we kept doing it. Cities and volunteers pop up all over the country and host Father’s Eve events at their, in their backyard and their, their local bar or restaurant or a church or school or a club or. We’ve done it all over the place and had quite a bit of fun with it. Some guys do fundraisers, guys have done golf tournaments. One guy did a poker tournament that seemed like a lot of fun. Some do fundraisers for local charities.

John Francis [00:20:57]:
We’re not a charity, so we don’t want the money. We want. If you’re going to do it, raise the money and give it to someone else, someone who can do some good. Local nonprofit profit is usually what we recommend. Or for the At Home Dad Network is a good group. We collaborated with, really anybody, anyone who we thought was in alignment of let’s help dads be better dads. I mean that’s really the common denominator. Trying to help each other figure this out.

John Francis [00:21:20]:
So Father’s Eve now, this year we’ll probably have it in 30 or 40 cities around the country. We do a virtual toast. We learned something from COVID when, when that came around and, and it pushed us online. So we do an online zoom. And the fun part, Chris, you know this Father’s Eve, we do a countdown toast at 8 o’ clock. So people know on New Year’s Eve you gotta wait till midnight to do the countdown. 10, 9, 8. The whole thing at midnight on Father’s Eve, we back that up to 8 o’.

John Francis [00:21:49]:
Clock. Because I want to go home by 9:30. Man, I don’t want to see midnight. It’s Father’s Day the next day. I want to be well rested. So we do a 8 o’ clock countdown toast in East Coast, Central time, Mountain time and Pacific time, the four continental US Time zones. We go online and we get guys zooming in from all over the country, up and down the different time zones. It’s really kind of fun.

John Francis [00:22:12]:
And they, they click, they connect. So it’s like, you might be like, where I am in Minnesota, we’re Central time. So we’ll see guys from Minnesota, Chicago, Dallas, Kansas City, you know, up and down our time zone. But we of course start early for the east coast guys. We want to see them and all way from New York to Carolinas and Florida and whatever. Anyway, we do it four times online, so guys can join us anywhere and zoom in. And there’s no fee, there’s no credit card number, there’s nothing. You just show up and if you want to say something, say something.

John Francis [00:22:42]:
If you don’t, you don’t. Nobody really minds it. The expectations are pretty low. It’s. It’s just show up and maybe you’ll learn something, maybe you share something. You have some games and activities and anyway, it’s loosely organized. I’ll say a bunch of volunteers having a good time. My strategy, there’s not a lot to it, but the goal is to have dads connect.

John Francis [00:23:01]:
And we say we connect, share and celebrate fatherhood. And I tell you what I’ve learned over the years is if I can help somebody, just be a little more intentional or a little more conscious of how important fatherhood is and being that dad, you know, being the father is biological. Being the dad is much more. So we focus on trying to do whatever we can to help each other be a better husband, be a better father, be a better partner. And we welcome every dad, all the dads, really anyone. We’re very inclusive and there’s really no agenda. We’re not selling anything, we’re not promoting anything. We’re not saving anyone.

John Francis [00:23:36]:
We’re not solving any problems. We’re just there to get together and try to help each other and support each other. And what I’m learning now is really what I would say, alleviating isolation. I think a lot of guys, especially older guys, forget how to make friends and they don’t get out in circulation. I’m a lucky guy. I’ve got friends. We go snowmobiling and fishing and work. And I get around the country and do my thing, but a lot of guys don’t.

John Francis [00:24:01]:
And so this is a real easy open door. Come on out and celebrate Father’s Eve. Whether it’s in real life at a local event nearby, or whether you join us online and maybe you make connections somewhere or learn something about one of these groups or organizations that I didn’t know about, but I sure wish I did when my kids were little. And there’s always something new and interesting. And so it’s just kind of that sort of a connection point, I guess, is really the goal. I’m trying to be that the, the common denominator for all the dads. You know, we can all celebrate Father’s Eve and really have no agenda. But anyway, thanks for letting me bring it up.

John Francis [00:24:36]:
Obviously I can talk about this for hours, but we’re glad to do it and it’s been a lot of fun and we’re still learning, we’re still growing, but it is, it’s been meaningful and I think it’s a lot more room to improve always.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:47]:
Now, if people are interested, they’re hearing this, they’re saying to themselves, hey, I’d like to have a get together in my area for, for dads like this.

John Francis [00:24:56]:
This.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:56]:
Talk to me about what they would need to do to be able to do that, to get signed up and to be able to be a part of the fun.

John Francis [00:25:02]:
Well, Father’s Eve is the website. There’s no apostrophe, right? Because it’s not possessive, it’s. It’s plural, right? It’s for everybody. So some grammar teacher told me that. Where’s the apostrophe? I’m like, well, I didn’t trademark it with an apostrophe. So it’s Father’s Eve.com and we’re on all the whatever socials. I don’t know how to do tick tock, so I don’t think we’re there. But anyway, not hard to find.

John Francis [00:25:24]:
And there’s five rules for Father’s Eve. This is super easy. Number one, keep it clean. This is not a bachelor party. This is not a frat party. This is not let’s go crazy, right? It’s have a good time. I would say it’s PG13, whatever, but keep it clean. That’s rule number one.

John Francis [00:25:39]:
Number two, it’s for the dads, and that means all the dad. It’s not really a family event, although you can do it that way if you want. We’re not rigid, really, but it’s inclusive. So dads, divorced dads, single dads, granddads, gay dads, kids, trans dads. We’ll welcome anybody, whoever. If you want to celebrate fathers, we want you to be with us. So number two is all the dads. Number three is you got to have something to do, some kind of an activity or engagement.

John Francis [00:26:06]:
A lot of guys just have a barbecue and sit around a table and just talk. That’s fine. We do a bags tournament with the cornhole because I can hold a beer in one hand and throw the bags with the other hand. So that’s pretty fun. Something to do. And so you gotta Anything, anything, Something interesting to do. That’s number three. Number four is work together.

John Francis [00:26:25]:
We do a Facebook page for the hosts. We call them event hosts. There is a private page. I want to talk to you and share with you what I’ve learned and what. We have some tools and some simple stuff for guys who want to organize a little more and promote themselves a little bit, but work together. We want to know what you’re doing, and we want to help you do it better and have better results. And then rule number five is don’t screw it up. Don’t be that guy that does something stupid and wrecks it for all of us.

John Francis [00:26:50]:
So none of this involves any. Any fee. It’s really all just common sense. And we’re trying to build a movement, we’re trying to build a group. We’ve got social media, we’ve got an email, we send a newsletter. It’s not complicated. The goal is to get this thing big enough that maybe someday we’ll get a sponsor. Someone wants to be the official fill in the blank of Father’s Eve.

John Francis [00:27:11]:
I could think of a lot of things. I’d like to be affiliated with a lot of organizations. And if we get big enough where it’s attractive and we have enough. Enough activity or engagement, then there’s some economic value that I think if we made any real money, we. All we would do is promote ourselves even more and have bigger events and even more fun and try to reach more people, which is really the goal. If we can reach more of the dads out there, and there’s new dads, there’s old dads, there’s about to be dads, There’s. We can learn from each other and share ideas. And that’s really the goal.

John Francis [00:27:43]:
So Father’s Eve is fun. It’s free. It’s everywhere. There. Hit the website, click the link. There’s an agreement there. There’s a trademark, a license agreement, but it’s free. There’s no fees, no nothing there.

John Francis [00:27:54]:
We. I guess we do sell a T shirt. If you want a T shirt or coffee mug, you can buy that. But we’re not big on the merch, but someone said, why wouldn’t you sell a coffee cup or whatever? So. But it’s pretty simple, Chris. Part of the fun is I get to talk to these guys. I want to know who you are and what you’re up to and what your plans are, and then I want to help you and see if I can make your event even more fun and more successful so I get to know these people. And over the years, I’ve made some great guys that are doing Father’s Eve, and some guys have been doing it year after year after year.

John Francis [00:28:22]:
I think Chicago, I think they’re on, like, I want to say, 10 plus years. I think they’ve been doing it. Some of the other cities around the country, it’s same guys, same groups, and they have quite large events. It’s fascinating to see what they’re doing. And that’s really what it’s all about, is just keep it simple and have some fun.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:38]:
Well, we always finish our interviews what I like to call our dad connections. Six. Six more questions. The devil. A little bit more into you as a dad. Are you ready?

John Francis [00:28:47]:
I’ll try. I’ll do my best.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:48]:
What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughters?

John Francis [00:28:53]:
Loving.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:53]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice you’ve ever received?

John Francis [00:28:57]:
Parent the child you have, not the child you wish you had.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:02]:
What’s one activity that you and each of your daughters love doing together?

John Francis [00:29:06]:
We love being on the water, on the lake, at the cabin.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:09]:
If you could give your daughters one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

John Francis [00:29:15]:
Be very careful of who you choose as a life partner because it’s 80% of your happiness or misery in life.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:24]:
What’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

John Francis [00:29:28]:
Life is so much more interesting as a parent. It’s a whole new dimension of possibilities and growth and meaningful life. I love it. I can’t imagine not being a dad. Dad.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:40]:
And finally, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

John Francis [00:29:48]:
Learn how to be patient and really learn how to listen. Those things are easy to say, but they’re really hard to do consistently. But I’ve tried and I’ve gotten better, and there’s always room for more. But patience and what do they say? Active listening, really being present. There’s no other way. I think that’s the starter for any kind of meaningful relationship.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:09]:
Well, John, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for being on the show today. Thank you for sharing about your own journey with your daughters as well as all the amazing things that you’re doing with Father’s Eve. I wish you all the best as you get ready for the next Father’s Eve. And as always, I really appreciate your time and everything that you’ve shared today. I wish you the best.

John Francis [00:30:30]:
Thank you, Chris. I appreciate it very much. Thank you.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:33]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to be build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect, it’s about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes@dadanddaughterconnection.com until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:31:04]:
We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers we spend the time, we give the lessons, we make the meals, we buy them presents and bring your A game Cause those kids are growing fast the time goes by just like a dynamite blast Calling astronauts and firemen Carpenters and muscle men get out and be the world to them Be the best dad you can be Be the best dad you can be.

The Power of Being Present: Fatherhood Lessons with Mitesh Khatri

April 27, 2026 by dadofdivas

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

What does it really mean to be a great dad to a daughter? The latest episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection digs deep into this all-important question. Host Dr. Christopher Lewis, joined by guest Mitesh Khatri—Melbourne father, writer, and corporate strategist—explores the daily challenges, triumphs, and small yet powerful moments that shape our relationships with our daughters.

A central theme of the conversation is the importance of being truly present. As Mitesh Khatri candidly shares, simply being in the room is not enough; it’s about showing up emotionally and giving your attention, especially during routines like bedtime or unstructured play. One meaningful moment he describes is when his young daughter told him to “stop rushing me.” This wake-up call led him to rethink how often stress and distraction rob us of precious connection—and how even “routine” moments can become the foundation of trust and closeness.

The episode also explores the challenge of balancing professional ambitions with family life. Mitesh Khatri discusses how corporate careers often offer clear metrics of success—promotions, projects, and accolades—whereas fatherhood can feel less measurable. The takeaway? We must create our own scorecards within our families: counting moments of connection, presence, and patience as real victories.

Perhaps most powerfully, the episode underscores the need for vulnerability. Mitesh Khatri opens up about his struggles with stress, his journey to calm his nervous system, and his realization that anger often masks deeper feelings like disappointment or sadness. He introduces practical strategies—like pausing before reacting and honest journaling—to help break generational cycles and model healthier emotional regulation for our daughters.

For dads who worry about not getting it right, Mitesh Khatri says it’s not about perfection, but about trying. He advocates for intentionality, ongoing learning, and talking openly with other dads. As host Dr. Christopher Lewis reminds listeners, “being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect. It’s about being present.”

If you’re searching for practical insight and heartfelt stories on building meaningful father-daughter relationships, this is one episode you shouldn’t miss. Tune in to The Dad and Daughter Connection for real conversations that will leave you inspired to show up, connect, and be the dad she needs.

Listen now and start building your own toolkit for intentional, loving fatherhood.

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]:
If you’re looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you’re in the right place. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we’ll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let’s get started, because being a great dad isn’t just about being there, it’s about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to delve a little bit deeper and into the relationships that you want to build with your kids. And I love that you’re here. Every week you’re here, you’ve rolled up your sleeves.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:08]:
You are doing what you can to be able to show up for your daughters in so many different ways. And that’s why this show exists. This show exists to help you to be that dad that you want to be. And I try to bring you different people, different people with different experiences every week to allow for you to be able to learn something new, to gain some tools for your toolbox that can help you to be able to be that dad. Today we’ve got another great guest. Mitesh Khatri is with us today. And Mitesh is a father from Melbourne, Australia. He’s got two kids himself and we’re going to focus on his daughter, but he also has a son and we’re going to learn a little bit more about him and I’m really excited to have him here.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:51]:
Mitesh, thanks so much for being here today.

Mitesh Khatri [00:01:53]:
Thank you so much, Christopher. And really appreciate all the work you do for fatherhood and dads and daughter in this connection. This podcast is fantastic.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:01]:
Well, I really appreciate that you’re here today and we’re going to talk about a new book that you have out to help fathers in many different ways as well. But. But we always start our interviews talking a little bit about you as a dad and especially as a dad to a daughter. And I know you’ve got a six year old daughter and I am really excited to be able to delve a little bit deeper. And I guess as you’re thinking about your relationship with your daughter, what’s one of the most meaningful mom that you’ve been able to share with your daughter, what made it so special?

Mitesh Khatri [00:02:28]:
Yeah, I think one of my most meaningful moments has definitely been the bedtime routine. I think it’s been really. Because it’s come from a moment where it wasn’t the best moment for me. So, you know, there was a time when I was completely stressed out. Two young kids, and my daughter was four. My son was five and a half. And I remember my son is quite direct. But my daughter, she is more subtle in her ways of expressing her emotions.

Mitesh Khatri [00:02:54]:
And she said to me one night, and as I was putting her to bed, four years old, looked up to me and said, you know, stop rushing me. Those three words, I just froze. And she wasn’t being difficult. I was trying to get through the routine. Please put on your pajamas, brush your teeth, go to the bathroom, read a book or two, or cut it short. I was stressed, I was depleted, and I didn’t want to be there in the room mentally, even though, you know, my beautiful daughter was just asking me to be there and to actually be present with her. And we talk about present all the time. I hear it on your podcast.

Mitesh Khatri [00:03:23]:
It’s all be present. It’s so difficult to do. You can’t think yourself to be present in the moment. You physically can sometimes not be able to be present, and your mind is rushing and your body is not allowing you to do that. So it was quite a low moment. But today, when I look at it, it’s one of the most beautiful times I have, is to put her to sleep every day, read her books, that routine, the cuddle she gives. And I look at her now, she’s six years old, just turned in April. We take time with that routine, and I really cherish that time.

Mitesh Khatri [00:03:51]:
Is she’s so sweet and she has the cutest smile and the cuddles and kisses you get at that time, you think, well, you know, I’m never going to get this back. And she’s only going to be this age, like this, this moment. So we have to make the most of it, because they do fade. I hear it from people with older children. You have clearly girls that have grown up. You have to appreciate that. And so I think my best moments, they’re around the bedtime routine because you get to talk about the day. You get to talk about what they really enjoyed, what they liked in the day, what they didn’t and might do differently.

Mitesh Khatri [00:04:21]:
And it’s really sort of deep, meaningful connections which you might not get it. Sort of school pickup. How was your day?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:26]:
So talk to me a little bit about that transition that you had to go through because just hearing those three words, you can’t switch on a dime. You definitely have to go through a process for yourself to, I’m going to say, reinvent yourself in many different ways to be able to change that paradigm for yourself. So talk to me a little bit about that and what you had to do to be able to make that shift. I’m guessing failing a few times along the way and then getting to the point where you are now.

Mitesh Khatri [00:04:55]:
Yeah, absolutely. I think, you know, what I found was I thought I could think myself to be present and calm. And actually I found at that point my, my body was tense. It was stressed out from work, stressed out from home work, life management, all things that new dads or sort of dads at least, I mean all dads, but especially with the young children, you have a lot of competing priorities. And I didn’t think to look there, but actually looked to my body and I was tense in the shoulders, my back was hurting, I felt I was short of breath. Deadlines and emails and what’s next for the kids in terms of what we need to take care of. And I had to go through a bit of journey to really understand how to relax my nervous system. Right.

Mitesh Khatri [00:05:38]:
Ultimately our. If we think back to sort of hunter gatherer times and we think about the threats we had, right? We always talk about the lion and we sort of have to run away from the lion, the threat, and then our sort of nervous system can calm down. In today’s day and age, we all know with technology and the pace of life, there’s almost this ambient stress and therefore our automatic nervous system actually never sort of calms down. So we need to be sort of this safe and secure place. Polyvagal theory sort of talks about this where you need to be safe and secure. The next stage is survival mode and then complete shutdown. And I think many of us, at least me at the time, I was at least in survival mode every day, if not shut down on every other day. And I had to get my body back and I had to sort of calm my body.

Mitesh Khatri [00:06:25]:
And I have a sort of framework in the book around how we can discharge that stress. And there’s techniques and things you can learn to do. And I sort of had to learn how to do that and how to bring my body back to its irregular state.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:38]:
And that’s never easy. And I guess one thing that comes to mind is you and I talked at the very beginning that you’re a busy guy, you have Your professional work, you’re balancing that. You’re balancing being a dad, you’re balancing other things in your life. So talk to me about balance and how you’ve been able to find that optimal balance for yourself to be able to be the professional you want to be, the person you want to be, the father you want to be as you are today.

Mitesh Khatri [00:07:04]:
Yeah, I think balance is a very interesting word. Right. I think you have to really dig deep. If I sort of bring a parallel to corporate life, and I’ve been in corporate Life for like 20 years, helping organizations with complex jobs, blue chip organizations. I’m a sort of marketing corporate strategist, working in research and consulting. And, you know, we’re helping brands launch new products and services and ensure they meet consumer needs and doing some complex work around that. And I was sort of succeeding in that sort of arena because I had the metrics to sort of measure and perhaps in the most important area of my life, my family and my children, I didn’t have the metrics, I didn’t have the measure, and I felt like I was failing. It always came sort of second.

Mitesh Khatri [00:07:44]:
And I think myself, and when I talk to other dads in the community and friends and colleagues, I find it’s an easier thing to measure. So men sort of go towards things we can measure and we get that affirmation we’re seeking from work. We get praised with it. And it’s this scoreboard, I think, that we can easily track and see. When I think fatherhood’s not so easy, it’s in feelings, it’s in moments, it’s in those relationships where you can feel them. But you sort of. No one sort of celebrates the dad that comes home at 5pm on time to put his kids to sleep. But you do get the accolades and success at work when you succeed in your career.

Mitesh Khatri [00:08:19]:
And I’m not saying that we should sort of give up and forego our careers. I think it’s. It’s finding ways to measure things that matter. Those moments at home. So it might be the time that you don’t actually have your phone on you and just. Just have unstructured play with your children. You’re just getting on the floor. You’re not in any structured piece of work or structured time is taking them to dance, taking to music, taking him to soccer practice.

Mitesh Khatri [00:08:42]:
You know, that’s very structured. And kids need. Kids need that structure. But I think almost equally important or more important, they need that unstructured time. So I think when you can have those moments, you can say I’ve had 1, 2, 3, 4 moments this week where I’ve had really had unstructured time and play with my daughter. Whether we’re doing teacups or playing with Barbie dolls or kicking the ball outside. Those are the measures of success that I just didn’t have. I had all the traditional stuff, the KPIs that you get in your corporate life.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:10]:
And there’s always this push and pull when it comes to raising daughters. And as you are trying to raise your daughters, you’re balancing, trying to guide your daughter while also giving her the independence to become the person that she’s becoming. And I know she’s still young, but I guess as she has been growing up. How do you balance that? How do you balance guiding your daughter while still giving her that independence?

Mitesh Khatri [00:09:32]:
Yeah, I think it’s a really interesting one. I think kids in general, but daughters especially you are the model they’re looking to when it comes to men right from a very young age age. So there’s, there’s that scanning they do of the environment to see how do you react to situations, how do you carry yourself when things get tough, how do you treat your partner, her mum, you know, how are you treating different women, how do you sort of interact, how do you talk to friends that are female, how do you just treat people in general? So I think they’re modeling and learning of what a man should be. So I think you want to sort of help them with that. And in terms of independence, I think it really comes down to having honest, open conversations as much as you can for that age where you can really help them distinguish between right and wrong. What is the right kind thing to do and what is not so kind, what are the sort of right behaviors to be following? I guess. And one of the things I’m always mindful of is no one’s a perfect father, but not moving straight from a stimulus like some sort of stressor, straight to anger. And I think we as men tend to do that, perhaps more when especially I was doing that quite a bit where I’d find myself, kids are running late to school, we need to go.

Mitesh Khatri [00:10:41]:
And I actually get really angry. It’d come out in the force in my voice. And then you sort of how it is, you tell your kids not to shout at the other one and that’s what you’re doing and that’s the behavior and modeling. So I think modeling the right behavior is pretty critical. And that sort of journey of really understanding myself, modeling the right behaviors was pretty critical for Me for the last sort of two years. And, you know, recognizing that actually underneath that anger, it’s actually not anger that we’re feeling often. Maybe we’re hurt because actually we really wanted to spend that hour playing with our daughters before they go to school. Maybe we’re sad because.

Mitesh Khatri [00:11:14]:
Or disappointed because we wanted the morning to go a particular way and on time and not be late for something else. And we sort of go straight. We almost skip that emotion in between. Sadness, disappointment, hurt. Because I think we just weren’t taught that. And therefore our daughters are learning that. They’re modeling that as well. You know, when I get angry, I’ll just.

Mitesh Khatri [00:11:33]:
I’ll just go straight to voice, you know, raise my voice and actually not express my emotions. So I’m trying to say I’m hurt. I’m sorry I didn’t do the right thing there. And I apologize. I felt really sad that we couldn’t be on time because of these reasons. So it’s trying to label the emotion and model that. But I think the independence thing is hard. I think you’re always scanning the environment to go, how much do I let her go? How much do I pull her back in? Whether it’s at parties, whether it’s devices, whether it’s certain foods she might be eating or whatever it is.

Mitesh Khatri [00:12:02]:
That’s a tricky one.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:03]:
Completely understand. And we never have all the right answers. I mean, we definitely do our best and we try our best to be the best people we can be, but we’re flawed. Everybody is flawed in talking about that, I guess. What’s the mistake that you’ve made as a father, and what did you learn about it, about fostering a positive connection with your daughter?

Mitesh Khatri [00:12:22]:
I think I’ve made lots of mistakes. Probably like many dads, we all make lots of mistakes. I think one potential mistake I’ve made my daughter, and it probably comes from being that almost pushy parent when it comes to activities in sports. So sports or music or whatever it is really pushing them, maybe pushing them too much as well. We’re often projecting our own childhoods onto our kids. And they can lose the fun, you know, in what they’re doing, whether it’s dance or they’re playing some sport or whatever it is, and I think you want them to do well. But I think it’s also recognizing that they’re just kids, you know, we’re not sort of in the professional leagues. So I think I’ve really learned from that.

Mitesh Khatri [00:13:02]:
To not be the parent on the sideline shouting. I think it’s encouraging your kids, but not in a way that’s perhaps disrupting their sort of natural way to enjoy what they’re doing, whether it’s. Yeah. Dance or sport or whatever it is.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:16]:
Now, as I mentioned, you’ve got a new book that’s out there called the Fight or Father Using Calm to Stop Reacting and Start Connecting. As a author myself, I know that many times when you’ve got this idea in your head and you got this passion to be able to get these words out and trying to connect with your people that, that you go all in. But you definitely have to have a passion for it to get to that finish line. So give me the story of the book and tell. Talk to me about why. Why you decided to write it, why you decided to put the time, the effort and the passion into it to get it out into the world.

Mitesh Khatri [00:13:52]:
I never thought I’d be a writer myself, but I’ve always sort of been research and really, as I was saying to you earlier before we started, always very interested in why people do what they do and what drives our behavior, what motivates us. Right. So I mean, I’m the sort of tragic in the self help section looking at the next book and going, how can I learn from this? I wrote this book because I think modern fatherhood is really breaking men and the expectations have changed and you’re supposed to be a provider and present with your kids. You’re meant to be the breadwinner and also emotionally available. And no one really taught us. If we think about our father’s generation, they didn’t really teach us how to do that. Our fathers really had a role which was sacrifice, commit yourself and be the breadwinner and be respected at home and very traditional household. I guess I’m talking to.

Mitesh Khatri [00:14:40]:
And I think I see a lot of modern parents for really my sort of discoveries on this journey started about five years ago. Kids very young. I see a lot of dads just grinding through it, myself included, exhausted, distracted. We’re snapping at our kids. We sort of promise ourselves we’re going to do better tomorrow and. But deep down we know something’s wrong, something’s not working. We need better tools, we need better ways to parent and we know that it’s a learning process at all. So I wrote this in almost a way to sort of say we can choose to fight and react and be in that sort of survival mode or shutdown mode when stresses hit with our kids, or we can choose a almost new way to father modern fatherhood.

Mitesh Khatri [00:15:19]:
I think it takes the best of what our fathers taught us. And it builds on that. And I think it builds on, you know, a lot of what you talk about, Christopher, is, is showing vulnerability. We need to show vulnerability to our children. We need to show not just the masculine side, but actually it’s okay to get things wrong. And this is what you do to repair that. And I think, I’m sure there’s lots of books that sort of talk to various things around that out there. I didn’t see something targeted specifically at that aspect.

Mitesh Khatri [00:15:45]:
And therefore, yeah, really focused in my own journey of switching from a dad that was reacting all the time at his kids, didn’t have the patience. As I said, my body was chronically stressed at the time. I put on weight and wasn’t eating well. I was numbing pain through alcohol, etc. And it’s not enough to just think yourself to a better version of yourself. You need tools, you need techniques. So I wrote the book and have got some practical techniques on what dads can do. You know, simple things like just having clear boundaries between work and home.

Mitesh Khatri [00:16:18]:
It’s so difficult, particularly post Covid. Many of us are working home in hybrid sort of environments and it blurs. You have your kids next to you in the school holidays. We’ve got school holidays going on now. My son or daughter will work almost in the same room in a work mode. I might close the laptop, but still mentally be processing the emails that I haven’t sent, the tasks I haven’t done. So I think it’s having those practices to say, you know, simple things, five seconds, where you might go, I’m home now, I’ve closed the laptop, let me show up. Or you might go wash your face or you might go change your clothes.

Mitesh Khatri [00:16:48]:
It’s just physically doing something. You might do 20 star jumps. But you need that transition process and just one example from work to home. So that calm framework is really around that. So you clear your body of the stress. Firstly, you anchor yourself between work and home. So have a ritual around that. You lead with calm because kids follow your regulations.

Mitesh Khatri [00:17:09]:
You need to be calm and have techniques for that and model and repair is probably the most important part where when you get it wrong and you will like myself every day, there’ll be something I do wrong, I need to admit to it and I need to label what that emotion is, which is then going into my vulnerable side, you know, it’s going into really understanding what that emotion is, not just anger and then coming up with a repair, you know. So yeah, I just remember I Actually had an argument with my daughter. I was stressed this A couple of days ago. She wanted to play. She can we play. She likes doing tea parties and cafes in her room. And I didn’t have the patient. And I just said to her, I’m really tired.

Mitesh Khatri [00:17:47]:
I’m stressed. I’ve had a long day and a hard day. And I shouted at you, is it okay if we start again? And she just looked at me and she said, okay, dad. And I think previously I would have just shouted and said, I’m not doing this, and it’s time for bed. So I think. I think it’s having those skills. It’s. Firstly, I’ve been quite vulnerable in the book myself.

Mitesh Khatri [00:18:04]:
So, you know, I’ve had sort of beta readers say it’s been quite difficult to read at times because they’ve seen themselves in it as well. So I think it’ll. It’ll definitely make you turn the mirror on yourself and analyze your own life, your own behaviors, and perhaps you’ll pick a couple of techniques and tools that you can use to just be that modern father and not fight all the time.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:23]:
And one of the things you write about in the book is being there, but not there. And many dads believe simply being physically present is enough. What helped you recognize the difference between proximity and true presence? And how can dads begin to see that difference in their own lives?

Mitesh Khatri [00:18:42]:
I like the bedtime routine with my daughter. It was actually that really broke me when she said, stop rushing me. And you really, you know, reflect on those things and try to make a change. And you don’t always get it right. But my son said to me one day, he was on the, I think, kitchen table, dining table. I was scrolling on Instagram, you know, usual blur posts that we would normally go, just mindless, scrolling, doom scrolling. And Taj was nearby and he. I don’t know what he was doing exactly.

Mitesh Khatri [00:19:08]:
And that was part of the problem. And without looking up, he said, you’re always on your phone, dad. Not angry. He wasn’t whining, just like matter of the fact. Like, he was describing the weather. And I looked at him and, you know, his face was soft. He was disappointed. He wasn’t trying to start a fight with me about it, that he was just telling me the facts for what he saw.

Mitesh Khatri [00:19:26]:
And I said automatically, almost automatically, I’m not quite defensive. I just need to do this one thing. And clearly I was lying to him, right? I wasn’t being honest. I was lying to him. I wasn’t being honest to myself. I put the phone down in that moment and I felt my chest get tight and I had a little shake in my hands and I felt enormous guilt that he had just seen me more clearly than I had seen myself. And I think we’ve all been there and I think researchers, you know, we’ve heard this all the time, we hear about phones all the time. But technically interference.

Mitesh Khatri [00:19:57]:
Dr. Brandon Michael actually coined the term where seemingly sort of normal amounts of phone use during parent child time. It’s actually linked to increased behavioral problems in children. So the screen time, not because of the screen time itself, but what it communicates like. You’re not important to me. Right. Right now, in this moment, this is most important to me. We’ve all heard that before.

Mitesh Khatri [00:20:18]:
So that’s what I mean by you’re there, but you’re not really there. You’re in the room physically, but in your mind you’re somewhere else. You’re in another place, you’re thinking about something else. You’re not actually aware of your surroundings. You’re not actually picking up the cues or the people in the room. So I think that in itself because it increases the behavioral problems and we see how much time we spend on our phones and screens. It’s something which I’ve been much more conscious with. Now the phone goes on the charger.

Mitesh Khatri [00:20:44]:
Leave it there at 6pm in the evening. Sometimes I’ll throw it upstairs in the bedroom in a drawer. Because when it’s there we’re just so automatic. We’re so addicted to these devices that are in our pockets that are so powerful. So I think that’s really what I mean. We’re not there. And that can be a physical device, but it can also be actually we haven’t decompressed from the day and we’ve got all the stress from work or so we’re thinking about something else. We’re actually not there with our family.

Mitesh Khatri [00:21:08]:
We’re just unavailable and we’re not in tuned with not engaging with them.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:12]:
Now one of the other things that I read in the book was you talk about how many fathers suddenly hear their own dad’s voice coming out of their mouths during those stressful moments that you kind of talked about. When that realization happens, what practical steps help a father pause long enough to break that generational pat?

Mitesh Khatri [00:21:32]:
Yeah, that is a real difficult one. I think. I think what I’ve done is pause for five seconds. So when you see your voice coming, and you might even hear, you might even see in your children yourself, then your father talking to you In a particular way, that is really difficult. And I think we have to appreciate everything they did for us in terms of sacrificing, building a life and opportunities for us, and appreciate all those things. But at the same time, they maybe didn’t know how to deal with that stress or anxiety, anger. And when I say anger, it could be hurt, it could be disappointment, it could be sadness around something. So I think, you know, pausing, reflecting.

Mitesh Khatri [00:22:10]:
It’s a lot of journaling. So the last five years, on and off, journaling, I haven’t been as regular. But journaling on those moments where you know that you’ve almost automatically reacted in a way, and you can hear your father’s voice, whether it’s the harshness, whether it’s the criticism, whether it was the absence of. Of a father. I think we tend to overcompensate from what we had or didn’t have. And I think it’s a lot of deep reflection that needs to be done. But I just encourage everyone to just pause, pause. You don’t have to respond straight away to your kids.

Mitesh Khatri [00:22:41]:
You can pause for a couple of seconds, reflect, and actually sit with those thoughts. I think you got to do quite a bit of deep work and journal and plenty of services out there where you can talk to psychiatrists and psychologists and so forth to really understand the relationships with our parents. I think I’d also encourage if. If you can and your father’s around, have a conversation with him, Talk to him about things that you really have a lot of gratitude for and the things you wish that he could have done better. I think those things, and it’s not sort of pointing the finger or blaming anyone, it’s just having those honest conversations. And I think you’d be surprised where that might take you as well.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:17]:
It definitely is a journey. And a lot of times we’re constantly trying to find new ways to be able to measure up as a dad. And we look around us and we think, oh, all these dads are doing better than we are. And there’s almost that. As you talk in the book about that scorecard that we have in our book, about how we are grading ourself, how we’re scoring ourselves, and you talk about rethinking that internal scorecard that we use to measure success. What are the most common invisible scorecards that you’re seeing that fathers are running, and how do they quietly pull dads away from connection with their kids? But also, how can we change the script on those scorecards and allow for us to be able to look at that in a different way.

Mitesh Khatri [00:24:03]:
Yeah, I think that there’s a powerful primary story here. We almost have this deep obligation we have to build, we have to secure, we have to work long hours. We have to sacrifice. Sacrifice is love. And love looks like a mortgage paid off, a fridge that’s full, a future that’s funded for the kids. And that is important, you know, and elements of that are really important. And it’s a powerful story, and it has deep roots in human history, and male identity has been shaped by that. And I sort of talked about this a little bit earlier, earlier in the sense that fathers of men that do that, you know, they keep reinforcing that scorecard that exists.

Mitesh Khatri [00:24:37]:
So, you know, status follows the achievement. Respect comes with that success. The man is getting the promotion or close the deal or starting a new business and is an entrepreneur. They get admired. But we’re not throwing the awards and accolades for the dad who’s performing really well at home with his kids and actually teaching them about vulnerability, teaching them about how to regulate themselves, teaching them about how to show kindness and how to introduce themselves and respect others and be part of the community and. And, you know, have strong values and those sort of things. So I think men chase the thing that’s being rewarded, and we pour ourselves into that, you know, into our careers and into our work, and then we don’t have much left for the family. So.

Mitesh Khatri [00:25:16]:
And I think what fathers can do is have that sort of scorecard for themselves. So I have read sort of James Clear Atomic Habits, and, you know, we’re all sort of creatures of habits. So in my diary that I physically write, I write time with my wife, specific things I want to do, time with my kids, specific activities, time for my exercise. And I tick those things off, right? So I’m not just my career ticks and successes, but actually, what are my goals for my relationship with my son, my relationship with my daughter, my wife? What are my goals? How am I working towards that and am I sharing those goals, what I’m trying to do? So I think almost like we have KPIs for work, if you have a team and you have some employees and you sort of evaluate them, you can’t evaluate them on something you haven’t actually given clear KPIs on. And I think it’s hard to evaluate yourself on your family life if you’re not clear on those KPIs as well, and your children as well. If you want them to respect other people and talk with kindness, then you need to Teach them that. So you need to sit down, maybe it’s 10 minutes, maybe it’s a couple of hours where you need to show them what kindness looks like. How do you actually talk to someone? How do you greet someone? You know, how do you leave a social situation in a respectful way? I think those things we don’t measure and therefore we just think they just happen and get done.

Mitesh Khatri [00:26:34]:
I think, you know, the adult, the age old sort of saying what gets measured gets done in corporate life also matters in our personal life. And so we need to create those measures at home. And I don’t really know what the perfect measures are. It might just be that I had a beautiful moment with my kid today, you know, have a box for that and it’s a tick. So there were three nice things that my child said to somebody else as a measure around that. I think we need to create our own measures of success and have some KPI guys similar to what we would do in our career, because that’s how you get to the next level. You sort of can’t do that in your relationships if you don’t know what those measures of success are. So I think we all need to sort of create those.

Mitesh Khatri [00:27:12]:
And they’re going to be different for different, you know, whether it’s a girl or a boy or different ages, you sort of need to come up with those and your kids can be part of it, your wife can be part of it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:20]:
The one thing I really liked about your book, and I think we could spend the next few hours talking about different aspects of your book, but one of the things that I really liked was the fact that your book, as you said, wasn’t written from the perspective of someone that’s figured everything out. You talk about where you are now, what you’ve learned along the way, but at the same time that you’re still failing, that you’re still flawed, and that there’s still things to learn. So as you are continuing your journey, what are you still learning about fatherhood that is surprising you?

Mitesh Khatri [00:27:52]:
So there’s just everyday surprises, I guess, with kids. You know, they sort of surprise you in different ways. But I’m just trying to think of more sort of themes that surprise you. Me, I think their maturity surprises me. You sort of sometimes underestimate how much your kids are learning as they grow up and where they’re at. They’re 7 and 6 and my daughter’s 6 years old, but you know, she knows a lot about the world and she is very mature when she needs to be And I sort of sometimes don’t want that to go away. Like her being very young, that small little girl, that beautiful girl that I put to bed at bedtime, I don’t want her to grow up to too quick. So, I mean, coming back to your question, what, what am I still learning is I think our kids are becoming independent and learning more than sometimes we appreciate or sort of take notice of.

Mitesh Khatri [00:28:38]:
And I mean, that’s come back, comes back to your independence. You know how, you know, you want them to have that independence and learn and grow and not slow them down in those settings. But I think my natural instincts is maybe to slow them down at the age they’re at and make sure they don’t grow up too quickly. So I think that’s a tough sort of battle I’m sort of facing. That’s what sort of comes to mind.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:58]:
And I guess finally, as I think about your book and for you, as you think about the legacy that you’re leaving behind in the book, you ask fathers to consider what their children are going to remember about them. If your kids were adults today, in reflecting on your parenting journey, what do you hope that they would say, say most about you?

Mitesh Khatri [00:29:21]:
I hope my children at the start of my book, this book is for every that that’s trying and I hope they see that I really tried. I, I got it right a lot of the time and probably got it wrong a lot of the time as well. So I think if I can have them growing up seeing a man that really tried to improve themselves, really tried to improve himself around his relationship with them and worked hard at the that and didn’t take my situation and where I was, as you know, that’s how it is. And I improved on who I was and knowing that those I was never going to be perfect and that I tried, that I love them, that I wanted the best for them and wanted to support them in everything that they did. So particularly with Alia, if I think about her, she has a lot of strength and it’s through sensitivity. She feels our feelings much more than my son will. She’ll notice things in others. She’ll carry emotions that’s probably bigger than a small little body.

Mitesh Khatri [00:30:18]:
I want her to know that she really has a superpower there in terms of that emotional intelligence and she can sort of really sense the situation. I hope that I give them the foundations of what being a good person is, what a kind person is, that vulnerability is strength. Whether you’re, whether it’s my daughter or my son being vulnerable, being Self aware, being calm when things get tough, showing emotional strength. They’re going to be the backbone of everything that sort of helps you in your life, whether it’s career or family or social. I want them to get rid of emotional sort of just thinking about it, but I just want them to remember myself and my wife really loved and cared and, and did everything for them to ensure that they got the right values in life, that they got all the opportunities they wanted to have, and that we really tried, that we always loved them.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:06]:
Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our dad Connection six, where I ask you six more questions to delve a little bit deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

Mitesh Khatri [00:31:16]:
All right, let’s try it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:17]:
What’s one word that describes your relationship with your daughter?

Mitesh Khatri [00:31:20]:
Beautiful.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:21]:
What’s the best piece of dad advice that you’ve ever received?

Mitesh Khatri [00:31:26]:
Work on you first. Start with yourself. Then you can serve the people you love.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:31]:
What’s one activity that you and your daughter love doing together?

Mitesh Khatri [00:31:35]:
There’s many, but. Bedtimes, tea parties, playing with her dolls. I’m definitely a dad that has not done that until my daughter came along. So really getting down on the floor and playing those games. Games. Originally I felt quite ridiculous doing it, but then I thought I found joy in it because I’ve just never done it before. Just freeing into my sports and, you know, all the manly activities.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:55]:
If you could give your daughter one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Mitesh Khatri [00:32:00]:
You know, always, always speak your mind and stand up for yourself. You have a lot of potential.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:06]:
Now, you’ve mentioned a number of these, but what’s one thing you’ve learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Mitesh Khatri [00:32:12]:
So much. Yeah. Um, that you really need a lot of patience. We hear it all the time. But I think more importantly, everything you do has to be quite intentional and intentional. And I’ve heard you talk about it. Chris. Christopher as well.

Mitesh Khatri [00:32:23]:
Intentionality is probably one of those cornerstones of everything you’re doing in fatherhood, especially with your daughters. You’ve got to be quite intentional, but not, obviously, taking away from unstructured play time. But by being intentional, you can be present, you can be there, not outside the room.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:39]:
And finally, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful, meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Mitesh Khatri [00:32:46]:
Treat vulnerability as strength. And I think if you were to journal or you talk to some close mates and dads and actually really get into the deep and meaningful and get vulnerable. And in my book, I have A lot of stories from other dads I run with and friends and we start to realize that we’re living parallel lives and when we get vulnerable, something unlocks, we learn something. And I think men don’t talk enough. So I’m a big advocate of dads talking about talking. And podcasts like this bring different topics and things dads are going through to, to life because we tend to bottle everything up right. We’re not very good at that. So I just encourage everyone to talk to someone and around things you’re going through and it might surprise you that actually somebody else might be going through very something very similar and can you can relate and you can bond over that.

Mitesh Khatri [00:33:35]:
So make sure you join these sort of podcasts or some sort of dad group or have a set of friends you can can have those conversations with.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:33:45]:
Well, Mitesh, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for being here, for putting this book out into the world, for sharing your journey with us today. And it’s not over, but I know that it’ll keep continuing and you’ll keep learning. But I truly want to say thank you and I wish you all the best.

Mitesh Khatri [00:33:59]:
Thank you so much, Christopher. Really appreciate it. And yeah, the book comes out on 28th of July, so it’ll be available Amazon, all sort of good book stores.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:07]:
We’ll definitely put a link in the notes today and I congratulate you on getting this out into the world and look forward to others reading it and learning from what you’ve learned along the way.

Mitesh Khatri [00:34:17]:
Thank you so much, Christopho.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:18]:
That’s a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn’t about being perfect. It’s about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don’t forget, you can find all our episodes at the end dad and daughterconnection.com until next time. Keep showing up, keep connecting and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:34:49]:
We’re all in the same boat and it’s full of tiny screaming passengers we spend the time, we give the lessons we make the miracle we buy them presents and bring your A game Cause those kids are growing fast the time goes by just like a dynamite blast Calling astronauts and firemen carpenters and muscle men get out and be the world to now Be the best dad you can be the best that you can be.